MSA and CAT's

Reading the latest mag from MSA looks like they are pushing ahead with mandating CAT's on road based cars again...

Now, this actually does not affect me personally, however, I really think this is a stupid move on several levels, and just smacks of MSA once again pandering to a perceived political agenda and having no balls.

Their arguments FOR fitting them appears to be based on sod all (as usual)..

The reality is that a CAT on a race car is going to be an additional safety hazard and actually does nothing to improve the exhaust emissions in the context of a race car.

The article goes on about how they don’t cost you power etc etc, but that’s not really the point is it? How about what happens in an accident, it’s dangerous enough for the marshals to have to deal with a steaming hot wreck, without adding a component to the cars that will be running at some 800+ degree’s C make it an ideal ignition source for any fluids that could well be spraying about.

You then have to consider the effects on a CAT of an engine not running a typical closed loop setup, production cars these days all have to have miss-fire detection built in to them to counter the problem of un-burned fuel being dumped in the exhaust, this will then hit the CAT and burn, at best, this will raise the temp of the CAT yet higher, it will almost certainly destroy the CAT in time.

Now, it’s bad enough when MSA foist stuff on us every year on safety grounds, however, this is just a joke, how can they mandate stuff like this without any consultation/discussion/etc with the general license paying competitors?

/Rant over

I saw that and whole heartedly agree with your comments, yet another expense we dont need that will make no difference whatsoever. When are they going to fit CATS on 747's for the New York weekend shoppers, now there you are talking about real waste and a real issue, I once read those things use more fuel getting ready to take off than an entire race meeting.

This has been on the cards all year why didn't you lobby the MSA back in January?

I don't have to fit them to my cars (too early).

However as there doesn't seem to be a testing requirement then it seems to be a PR exercise more than anything else.

How long before someone start knocking out empty CAT cases on ebay?

As falcemob said, it's probably a bit late to complain now but it could be worth a try. However I would suspect that the safety argument won't get much air time as every single production car has them fitted and they don't catch light that often! I suppose all you could argue is that for modified cars you don't have the resources of Ford etc and you can't predicted what would happen in a crash.

Well, race cars on the continent have had cats for many years now with no problems.

Suppose it's some ammunition against the jerks who'd ban motor sport anyway.

Falcemob

I for 1 DID lobby the brains trust at MSA when it was first published "for consultation". I took the time to write a comprehensive analysis of why it was a really, really dumb idea.

They ignored it.

A while later, when I was annoyed at not even getting an acknowledgement I re-sent it demanding a response and got a mealy mouthed brush off to the effect of tough sh1t we're doing it for the good of the sport. I wonder what is the point of the "consultation"?

Pathetic. There are so many ways (some of which I mentioned way back then) that club motorsport could actually be improving its environmental impact/image - Cats are not one of them.

This is one rule that, when I get back to racing after my sabbatical, I shall take great pleasure in flouting. "Yes, there's my Cat, fitted in the passenger footwell where the ballast will do most good - show me where it says in the BB it has to be fitted in the exhaust system".

G

This is one rule that, when I get back to racing after my sabbatical, I shall take great pleasure in flouting. "Yes, there's my Cat, fitted in the passenger footwell where the ballast will do most good - show me where it says in the BB it has to be fitted in the exhaust system".

It will do now ;)

This is one rule that, when I get back to racing after my sabbatical, I shall take great pleasure in flouting. "Yes, there's my Cat, fitted in the passenger footwell where the ballast will do most good - show me where it says in the BB it has to be fitted in the exhaust system".

G
Not sure why you would do that. If you pay your entry fee and then get told you cant race in the morning as you dont have a cat fitted who will that upset most? At best you will have to work hard to fit one in time for your quali session at worst your will go home having lost your entry fee and have had no track time.
Like was said above its a way of keeping the green people happy and is a way of improving the image of motorsport. The big problem is how it is policed, not sure what testing can be done but be warned im sure there are tests out there and it wont take long if they have not already found most the little cheat ways and it will probably cost you more to cheat than to fit one.

How long will it be before we are all racing those funny little electric cars seen around town. I think they ought to encourage LPG powered cars a bit more and have a means of filling them at the track, no need for a CAT with one of them.

The big problem is how it is policed, not sure what testing can be done but be warned im sure there are tests out there and it wont take long if they have not already found most the little cheat ways and it will probably cost you more to cheat than to fit one.
The big problem with testing is what would you test, the rule says the car has to have one fitted, unlike an MOT test there is no rule to say what it has to do or what limits have to be achieved. If a cat is fitted to an engine with standard ignition and carbs any limits would be unatainable anyway.

How long will it be before we are all racing those funny little electric cars seen around town.

Fine by me, I know a hell of a lot more about electricity than I do about distilled petroleum spirit!

And you could have whatever 'engine noise/exhaust note' you liked!

As for the cat's, falcemob is right. Without a specified CO2 target it is totally unenforceable as to whether the cat is doing anything.

Even with CO2 limits, it's about as good as the MOT which is SO easy to get round.

PR stunt, no more.

Not that that's a bad thing. If it delays motor racing being banned for a couple more years then it is possibly worth the compromise.

Just stick to old cars which are exempt! Should bump up the value of my Corolla a couple of quid.

Does any one know how mmuch the cat would be to buy at all?

£200ish+ (page 294 of the Demon Tweeks Motorsport catalog).

£200ish + ??!!?!?

That's my race budget for for a few rounds!! Races that is!

This has been in place on German classics for years,thier answer is to get a second hand ceramic cat and knock the guts out of it.;)

One of the reason maybe why so many cats get nicked these days in Germany. :rofl:

From someone who has been used to selling cats in Germany: buy a HJS one, a bit costly but no power loss and they work for years without a problem. They do not fall off either as you have to weld them in, unless you are all tumbs like me. ;)

I just hope I don't have to ever fit one, I'd be stuffed for space to actually get one on my system.

I just hope I don't have to ever fit one, I'd be stuffed for space to actually get one on my system.

Yeah,and the fur stinks when it gets really hot.:laugh:
Eddy,theres no power loss with an empty one either,in some cases we saw a slight increase in power on the rollers,expansion box ?