What do you think is the best ever FF1600?

To all the hardcore FF fans, let's chat about what is the best FF1600. Please state your reasons (both real and b*ll*cks).

Swift DC94/95 should be SC94/95 of course.

The RF01 Van Diemen is a nice piece of kit, the sidepods are very slippery, the cars here in Australia in this model seem to be better than their newer and recently older models, but perhaps because they are with one of the better teams here.

How long has it been since the Kent engine headlined the British series?

It seems we are moving to the Zetec, or whatever the next step in the UK is, in 2005 as well

Its got to be the RF90, although I love the way the reynards are set-out, a very logical and neat design.

Can you add RF00/01 to your poll

For me it has to be the Ray 97 my dad and myself run! on new tyres nothing can touch it!! Justin have a look at our Ray if you want to see Logical and neat design its dead easy to work on, same rose joint throughout so only need to carry one size for spares, the oil tank is one can of oil no more no less, all the airoquip is equal length which means all spares are the same length. hard to fault its logical design!

Matt

Originally posted by jadlamracing
Can you add RF00/01 to your poll

Sorry don't know how I missed it. it was on my original list of 19 but then I realised you can only get 10 on a poll!

who's clicked other and not stated? Point of that being?

20 votes and only 6 posters!

Are we being infiltrated by saloon racers?

GTR, Jadlam and Mattray must be 3 of the 4 RMR. At a total guess the other is... no idea.

Originally posted by JR Ewing
20 votes and only 6 posters!

Are we being infiltrated by saloon racers?
I suspect the worse also, I think they have crept into our thread slowly, or as fast as they can go, then under-steered out also very slowly.

I'd say the '92 Van Diemen. I raced a 89 Swift and a 93 Swift but the 92 Van Diemen looked like it was the best. The 93 was quite stiff and very hard to drive in the wet.

I heard the '92 was diificult to drive because of the monoshock, particularly over the kerbs?

I placed my vote....it was me

can you guess which I voted though ?

I've always found monoshock cars a nightmare in the wet...

RF 85/86 were a pretty good car in their time. Quite innovative if it wasn't for the fact that Dave Baldwin copied them from the US built Swift at the time. The RF87 falls to the worst I fear? JR i've always found that a mono shock car is much easier to run and Quicker to change set up for the wet than a twin.

I could never decide which I liked less, driving or workig on the 84 Van Diemen. Though I should point out in fairness that i was doing that back in 98/99 :-/

Most people slate the '87, but it did win the festival, and it did win both champioships, is it as bad as everyone says? You dont see hardley any racing nowadays.

The RF85 was a bit of a dog as it flexed badly and needed more metal welding in. The RF86 was a lovely car. the RF87 was modified late and was too long which affected handling. Interestingly the Reynard upto 92 was just a light development of the 87. The monoshock cars are very difficult over the cars and, apart from a few attempts, some good, nobody does it now.

Is it true that the three works cars (Irvine, palhares?,?) had chrommoly chassis for the festival?

My favourite must be this Reynard FF86 witch took the finnish and nordic championships two year in a row driven by JJ Lehto in '86 and Mika Häkkinen in '87. The picture here is from '87.

http://www.clarinet.fi/~spitkane/images/87hakareynard2.jpg

Chromoly - yes I do think so.

It would be interesting to see one out there, I would have throught a good 85 or 86 would be capable of running at the front, so an '87 must not be too bad. They are a good looking car, lots of them on my dad's '87 Bimingham Superprix Video!

the RF89 was/is a good car, and there are alot of them about. seen them mix them up with newer cars too. great in the wet, nice and soft.

They are a nice car, a good evolution of the '88, which was also very good. I guess the LD200 makes it good too compared to the '88. An 89 also has ally radiators?

Most do now Justin but not originally.

The RF 94 Stealth converted car built by Brett Lupton in Australia its a weapon, as good as any 02/03 car around.
Twin Shock.

What car is the stealth converted from?

Originally posted by JR Ewing
Most do now Justin but not originally.
I didn't think they were. I am half and half!

They are a nice car, a good evolution of the '88, which was also very good. I guess the LD200 makes it good too compared to the '88. An 89 also has ally radiators?

apart from the gearbox, dont 88 use rocker front sus instead of the pushrod of the 89? cant remember.

nope 86 was last rocker front. apart from LD200 the 88 and 89 are the same chassis. Bodywork differs but is interchangeable in whole sets and there are narrow and wide track versons

They are both v.good, Gary Marsh has shown how quick they can be, I also notice in Autosport that he is switch (why I do not know) to ARP for the rest of the season!

Careful justin, your going to hit a nerve there, gary is quick but that cos no one in the b's is pushing him. yes he has got quicker, but he hasnt gone faster than times both myself and another 89 of rivett and andy jones come to mention it, went round in. he also aint short of a few quid, probably hence ARP. nice guy though.

Originally posted by JustinDawkins
What car is the stealth converted from?

The Stealth can be converted from either a RF 93,94,or 95 Van Dieman.

Originally posted by RMR
Careful justin, your going to hit a nerve there, gary is quick but that cos no one in the b's is pushing him. yes he has got quicker, but he hasnt gone faster than times both myself and another 89 of rivett and andy jones come to mention it, went round in. he also aint short of a few quid, probably hence ARP. nice guy though.

Sorry Richard! It was based more on assumption than fact!

Originally posted by carbontub
The Stealth can be converted from either a RF 93,94,or 95 Van Dieman.

I think I have seen pictures of them, am I right in thinking that the Aussies compete to slightly different rules to FF1600?

no worries :)only messing. i remember gary last year chatting to me and saying how money is tight racing etc etc, then walks of and gets in his spanking new M3. the next meet he has a fresh bold rebuild....mmm id love to be that poor!

He did Donington earlier this year with us and I remember him having a pretty smart car. If he ha smoney now he won't this time next year after a season of ARP!

ARP is rubbish. Poor driving, no overtaking, very slow for what they are. A few of the quicker guys spend so much they should do Class B proper F3.

I agree, what I cant believe ishow well it is supported, the amount Rowan and friends charge for a season (no offence to ray) you could do loads of other stuff, UKFF, Scholarship F3 etc.

I like the Reynard 89, perhaps biased slightly, maybe.
It is excellent in the wet, when we have wet races, but sadly no wet ones this year. well balanced and comfortable.

Yeah i have seen very good results from the reynard always give newer cars a good run for there money and seems the best 89 or pre 90 for sure.

How can anyone not have voted for the Prowess?? What a gorgeous looking car............. was the designer on acid?

Whether the RF90 was the actual best car or not it gets my vote because it set the trend for future successful VDs and others in much the same way as the Lotus 79 did in F1.

95 Swift for me!

I'd be keen to try a 95 swift as I suppose they are the closest Swift to an Rf00 (for example) as the later Swift zetecs appeared to suck. Still keeping my vote as the swift though :)

Swift 95 is just a slightly heavier version of the 94 with square rear chassis rails for the Zetec lump...

urghhhh I'll stick with 92 thanks.

94/95 is a MUCH better car than the 92 or 93.

now I am interested in trying one

yep try one. I raced a 93 Swift and briefly an 89 van Diemen and the 1995 Swift I have used now for 18 months is far superior. It’s very well engineered, meaning it’s very quick with the standard setup. It’s a very forgiving chassis with excellent drivability, stiff when it needs to be, but adjustable enough to be soft when needed. An example is that everyone said an 89 Reynard or 90/91 Van Diemen was the car to be in at Anglesey and that a Swift was too stiff. I think we showed this year that setup correctly is very quick.

Only disadvantage is weight as it has a zetec chassis, but that can be overcome.

Like I said, a 94 has the same suspension/geometry/bodywork but a slightly lighter and softer (rear) chassis.

I think Goughy hit the nail on the head there with setup. Unless its spot on you wont get the best out of them, alot of people swap cars and dont change the styles differently (ie rf89 to SC93)
Personally I think you setup a 92/93/94/95 for that driver and make him drive it how it was designed and there will little in it. does that make sense?

Trus, although the 94/5 is definetely a much better car - bear in mind that in FF1600 'much better' equals about 5 hundreths...

The thing with the 95 is that as long as you set it up as per the swift's manual factory setup and then just fine tune roll bars, you can't go wrong with it, which is a sign of a well sorted chassis.

Also Swift as a manufacturer give excellent backup, which for ourselves being new to formula ford and running ourselves as been a huge advantage. All this year Swift have given us fantastic support and feedback. That's something that for sure has helped us a hell of a lot.

So, attempting to draw my thread for a close there seems to have been some good comments although, in the end, most people (except me) voted for the car they own! Objective research not.

i didnt vote for my own car, in fact i never voted. i suppose a lot have only driven 1 car before and its hard to compare, others vote on cars that are at the front all the time. I'm just glad the swifts are held in high regard as that is my new toy :)

when's it coming out then and have you sold the 89 on now. If so, when and where will that likley be seen do you know?

PM if you prefer

Oi Goughy - you should be out training, not messing around on your pc!

Out of interest has anyone seen this new Swift update kit yet (the one reported in Autosport a few months back??)

It'll be out soon according to Alan Cooper, owner of Swift. Apparently it's worth 3 seconds a lap.

Surely not? things haven't moved on that far in 8 years!

what is in the kit?

A Zetec isn't that much faster!

Originally posted by RMR
what is in the kit?

A rocket at that ****ing pace!

More like three seconds a year quicker.
3 seconds a lap - LOL - **** me it must be a Formula 3!

LOL. 3 seconds a lap and you fell for it!!!!!!!!!!

Ive put a deposit down now!

ive ordered 1 aswell! Doh!

Alex Ames was supposed to test this about 2months ago 93 - normal, and 93 with an upgrade kit. Never happened though.

I have been interested to see what this comes out with. I don't think it will make a killer difference, I have seen 93's keep up with the RF00's. I am a bit scared it will wack up the happy prices of swift parts to RF00 prices eg: £500 per nose, although I am told that RF00 parts such as wishbones are coming down FAST.

RMR - what swift did you buy in the end ? where did you get it

JR - I think most people vote for their own car because they like it...thats the reason they bought it. If they didn't like it though one was better they would probably buy the car they thought was better.

Van Diemen have dropped their prices on the 99-01 bits..the nosecones are a total rip off agreed.

The noses are honeycomb aren't they, as they 'include' the nosebox in them.

Seriously the 92/93 Swift upgrade was supposed to bring the cars upto the level of a 94/95 (ie minute differences only), although whether this possible is debatable due to bulk/aero reasons...

and up to raw costs, upgrade kit was rumoured to cost over 2K....if I wanted a 94/95 that bad I'd sell the 92 and simpley buy a 95 they are around the same price as the 92/93

just realised nobody voted for the Vector which, I have to say, is probably the best built FF1600 ever...

Got to go with the Ray and look forward to seeing the new car RMR...!!!:rotate:

What do you guy's think of an 96 Vector?

Originally posted by darcym
Alex Ames was supposed to test this about 2months ago 93 - normal, and 93 with an upgrade kit. Never happened though.

I have been interested to see what this comes out with. I don't think it will make a killer difference, I have seen 93's keep up with the RF00's. I am a bit scared it will wack up the happy prices of swift parts to RF00 prices eg: £500 per nose, although I am told that RF00 parts such as wishbones are coming down FAST.

RMR - what swift did you buy in the end ? where did you get it

JR - I think most people vote for their own car because they like it...thats the reason they bought it. If they didn't like it though one was better they would probably buy the car they thought was better. you havent been to oulton.....the origional swift and the 91 van d both out paced an 00 ...driven i might add by a v.quick driver???????

Whats that thing Dave Bruns designed before th Swift? ADS or ASD was it? that would get my vote just ebcause it was SO different.

Originally posted by bart_jacobs
What do you guy's think of an 96 Vector?

Bart,

I have a 96' vector I run here in the US.

Great car, .. works good on slicks, .. .. but Mono's do seem to be more of a "hand full" to drive, .. ..

Curtis