FF1600 Relay Races etc

Does anybody think that running occasional FF1600 races in a different format would be a fun idea?

What we've got now is :
a} Qualifying
b} A 'short' race over a given time or distance, fastest starting first.
c} Somebody wins, the others don't.
d} Go home.
e} Wait for next meeting.

I have some ideas to 'liven things up' and would appreciate your comments. I am talking about an extra and 'cheap entry fee' race after the championship race on the day. Only occasionally, if there is spare time within the timetable, so not at every meeting.

1. Run to an "open handicap".
Let somebody assess the potential lap times of each competitor using practice times, known performance, familiarity with the track in use, experience etc.

I arranged one of these once at Oulton and it was a success, even if I thought I had blown it with 3 laps to go. My slow man was 11 seconds a lap slower than the quick guys and looked totally unassailable, until I realised that he was only about 27 seconds clear on the road. The top 3 were eventually covered by half a second and Mr Slow came home about 5th.

You have a grid with the slowest starting first and the quickest last with the rest in between. The start is by Union Jack. Every 5, 10 seconds etc. more cars start. The theoretical idea is that everybody finishes together. The quick guys have a target and the slow guys an incentive to stay at the front.

2. "Tail end Charlie"
Each lap, black flag the last couple of cars off the track until there are only ten left. Then neutralise the race with whatever method will be in place in 2004 [with the demise of the black and yellow quarter flags]. Next, you unleash the surviving ten cars in a three lap dash to the flag.
'Guaranteed excitement'

3. "Relay Race"
There was one at the old Croft in about 1979/1980 and it was mega fun. Just ask Comtec Renault or Malcolm Barfoot, as they were team mates in it.
If my memory is correct, drivers were paired up [by ballot] into teams of two. The first drivers set off for their stint [maximum 15 mins per stint] complete with a sash. When they pitted, they had to get out and pass the sash to their team mate - who was strapped in and ready to go. This continued to the finish. I recall the race was either one hour, or 100 miles.
Refuelling, strategy etc. it was great fun.

4. "Pit Stop Race"
A normal race with a compulsory pit stop. The driver has to pit, get out of the car on one side and then get back in from the other side, get strapped back in and rejoin.

Benefits :
More track time for the drivers.
An extra 'something' for the marshals and spectator [if he comes that day :laugh: ] and the mega benefit is the commentators wouldn't have a clue what is going on [even bigger :laugh: ]

relay race 1hr = 3 sets of tyres.

Originally posted by kartingdad
relay race 1hr = 3 sets of tyres. Happy New Year kd.
1hr per team = 30 mins per car = 1.5 sets of tyres per relay race - by your reckoning.
30 mins = about, or just under what you get in a typical club race inc qualifying.
Are you saying that Stu used 12 sets of tyres - minimum in 2003? Assuming you only used one set per race that is.
If you'd have got him to drive slower, he wouldn't have worn out his tyres. You might have done the season on one set. He wouldn't have done well, but think of the money you would have saved! :p

You could do the "Tail End Charlie" race and tell him to come round last on lap one. More £££s saved.

I'm not sure about the Pit Stop race though. I hadn't considered the wear and tear on the seat belt buckle.

Looks like the Handicap is a non starter as well, with £££s being a handicap. :bag:

Keep up the good work Diz. There is so much enthusiasm for FF1600 at the moment, especially in the NW.

Relay race might not be such a bad idea. What about a team event with 3 car teams all going for points. Would have to be 2 nominated cars + 1 random car to prevent a top 3 driver stitch up.


Would perhaps mean that the faster drivers helped the not so fast drivers and cars to up their game/exchange ideas/get friendly/have big fallouts.

The idea of a relay race sounds like a lot of fun. Anything that gives greater race time in a car is always welcomed, as it can be rather annoying to have paid your £150 ish entry fee and then only get 8 or so laps. From a spectating point of view a FF1600 race with a full grid is always my highlight of the day and I cannot understand why at some circuits they seem to give the FF1600 either one of the first or last slots.

Originally posted by kartingdad
Keep up the good work Diz. There is so much enthusiasm for FF1600 at the moment, especially in the NW.Would perhaps mean that the faster drivers helped the not so fast drivers and cars to up their game/exchange ideas/get friendly/have big fallouts. I thought they all mucked in and helped each other anyway.

Yes Diz, they do,

But there's helping one another and HELPING one another if you get my drift...LOL

I like the sound of the "Open handicapped" race.....thats because I am most likely going to be one of the "Mr. slows" this coming season as it will be my first.
The other one you mentioned where drivers are paired up sounds good although it would prove more than a little difficult if an engine or gearbox was to go.....who did the damage? and when? and more over ..who will be paying for it?! The idea does have merit but I think that this idea would warrant more support if you could choose your team mate.;) :beer:

I think the idea is that you use your own car. Unless you were really trusting and entered a team of 3 people 3 times and worked it that you hopped out of 1 car straight into another, Could get a biiit ticky tho'.

I'm sure Diz would sort it though.

Originally posted by kartingdad
I think the idea is that you use your own car. Ah yes. Well that was how it was supposed to be at the Croft Relay, but it became 'car share' when Comtec Lewis went over the banking in his borrowed Van Diemen and reappeared in the pits on foot and handed his sash to Hotfoot.
Some 15 minutes later, Malcolm's face was a picture [you would have needed to be there, but use your imagination]. Malcolm was shown the 'In' board. As he came to a standstill, we dragged him out of his Crossle and Jonathan jumped in and off he went. It was only half of Malcolm's car anyway, he owned the engine and Dave Mellor the chassis - or vice versa. Dave wasn't at the meeting and MB spent the next 15 minutes 'gibbering' in the pitlane, until JL had completed his stint and Malcolm went back out.
If Malcolm is reading this, I apologise for using the gibbering word.

heel'n'toe-no If you are joining us this year and haven't made contact with me yet, get in touch. Contact details on brsccnw.com (http://)

Ian, we did the 4 hour relay at snett about 5 years ago, which was quite good fun - 4 to a team. No tyre changes were needed apart from one front on mine due to a puncture in the assembly area before the off. It needed more runners though as there were only about 15 teams. The entry fee was £500 per team, not bad value per lap.

Diz, I think your idea deserves to be given some serious thought. Sounds great entertainment for the spectators and potentially good value for the competitor.

Dad remembers taking part in a few relay races in the dim distant past: they first began by having to swop wheel nuts around from wheel to wheel. Well, you can probably imagine what happened there......! So, it was decided to adopt the coloured sash idea instead, far more sensible!

Most relays are for closed wheelers and - I'd forgotten about the one Steve mentioned at Snet - I just thought an FF1600 one "would make a nice / novel change". I am about to move the goal posts a bit now.
How about an open wheeler Relay. That way, if there were two or three different types of single seaters at a meeting, it would make a great curtain closer for that day. Also some drivers share cars, so they could both have a play on the day.

Thanks for the reply Diz. I wish I was going to be racing in the North West as I live less than an hour away from Oulton Park. I am, however, going to be racing in the Northern Ireland championship, mostly at Kirkistown with a one off race at Silverstone. I will be watching the NW championship closely though and hope to see you lot in action in 2004.
It might well be on the cards that I come and play in the 2005 season but --one step at a time for me....I will watch with interest to see if the relay thing takes off.

Incidentally do any of you lot know Leigh Fielding who is just starting out in the North West somewhere? (female about 40 years old)
Possibly not FF1600 though.

Diz or anybody for the BRSCCNW, having just visited your web site and viewing the gallery. I was amazed to see the car I will be driving next season in action.

Can anyone shed any light on the number 9 car (Red and white). It is a VD RF90. It is in Northern Ireland now with my team manager but who raced it last year and what are they doing this year?

Originally posted by heel'n'toe-no
Diz or anybody for the BRSCCNW, having just visited your web site and viewing the gallery. I was amazed to see the car I will be driving next season in action.

Can anyone shed any light on the number 9 car (Red and white). It is a VD RF90. It is in Northern Ireland now with my team manager but who raced it last year and what are they doing this year? It was raced by Stuart Dix from Stoke on Trent, known throughout the Paddock as Two Dogs. He bought the car from Denmark. I believe he sold it as an 'absolute bargain' of a Swift became available and he couldn't resist buying it. He will be racing the Swift in 2004. He sold the VD because he didn't need three cars - he also has a Reynard 85, which he is threatening to make work. I wish him luck with that as it never worked in it's day!
Why are you racing at Kirkistown, are you an Ulsterman? Is Steve Patton your TM? Come and say hello when you are at Oulton.
:beer:

Happy New Year All.

Great idea Diz. That would really enhance it, wouldn't it. Throw all the drivers in a pot and the teams be drawn out totally randomly. That would throw up some tasty combinations and some not so tasty, but all the same, a proper mixed bag.

Your an asset Diz. You really are.

I remember doing the starting order thing at Anglesey that time on November with the black flags coming out for the last driver on each lap. Great idea. I do think it actually made me go a bit quicker at the time.

heel'n'toe-no - why are you doing the NI Championship if you live 1 hour from Oulton? Oulton is the best FF1600 championship in the UK with over 50 drivers at every meeting. The car is set up for Oulton from Stu Dix so would be a good place to start?

I hear you both "Diz" and "Redracer". I am racing in Northern Ireland with Michael Edgar. I figure a season or two under his direction will stand me in good stead for when I race on my own in my own car. He is one of the instructors at Kirkistown race school and has raced for years. He was also 2nd to Matt Gillmore last year but has been the Irish champion in Formula Opel in the past as well as many other formulae.

I do hope to race with you guys in the coming years but having had this opportunity handed to me from Michael I feel I need to take him up on it.

By the way the car is running superbly well only half a second of Michaels own "Kirkistown tuned" VD RF90.

I will watch out for Two Dogs in the paddock at Oulton. I hope to meet some of you guys there too.

we have our own legends in Mike Waite, Dave Hart, Malc Barfoot.... etc all who could teach you a thing or two on how to pedel a FF1600 round a circuit. Would be much closer and bigger field and better circuits.....in my opinion

I hear you Redracer. I look forward to eyeing up the competition this coming season.

I do like the look of Oulton Park circuit. It must be an interesting circuit to "Pedel" round......Do you guys have stabilisers for my Van Diemen I could borrow???....lol

Originally posted by heel'n'toe-no
It must be an interesting circuit to "Pedel" round......Do you guys have stabilisers for my Van Diemen I could borrow???....lol You really must start ewsing yor speil chekka Redracer :laugh:
I take it heel'n'toe-no that you probably hail from the Province originally.

No Diz...I only go over there to work occasionally.

I am English through and through.

spell checker what is that?? i just type and press enter

Dont worry Redracer he is Dizlexic.

BTW Did you know that DNA is the National Dyslexic Association.
I've got my coat :bag:

Sorry your Lordship.

Blue Nose is your team in for the karting race???? Or was it a joke as I have not got a PM from you

Does it have to be marshals and racers or any one involved in racing

anyone, it was meant to be for championships to challenge each other but to make as much money as poss it can be any team

Good news, Alder Hey saved my daughters life I will post a team to you tomorrow.

Dislexics of the world---UNTIE ! Dislexics rule KO !!....lol

No offence to any dislexics out there.

Originally posted by heel'n'toe-no
Dislexics of the world---UNTIE ! Dislexics rule KO !!....lol
No offence to any dislexics out there. Sorry for going off topic, but I couldn't resist posting this snippet from one of my newsletters :

ALPOGOY FOR THE SLLPIENG IN THIS OAPL TLEEOCM NWSELETETR

"Aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at an Elingsh uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoetnt tihng is that frist and lsat ltteer is at the rghit pclae. The rset can be a toatl mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae we do not raed ervey lteter by it slef but the wrod as a wlohe."
:D

Your digging them up now Diz.

I used to be Dislexic,
but I'm alright then.......

Diz, Having spoken to Michael Edgar last night, I have found out that he is considering doing a race in the BRSCCNW this coming season. If he does it then I will probably do the same as it will cost no extra to bring my car over at the same time.

I know that you are bound to secrecy until Thursday about the race dates so I will give you the perfect scenario for us.....A race meeting at Oulton Park 7/8th August or 14/15th August as the cars will be over here anyway for Silverstone on July 31st.

Two Dogs mentioned to Michael that he should try to come over and do a race in your championship......What do you think?
:beer: :cool:

On a slightly related tack (well closer than some of the above :p ) has anyone thought of racing without timekeepers?

Why do we need times? - only to make a grid. Paying for the kit needed to provide a timekeeping service such as we currently enjoy probably makes up quite a bit of the entry fee.

If drivers could agree some way of making up a grid, then all you need is lap scorers/judges to determine the final order over the line.

Anyone can buy their own electronic timer if a team stopwatch is not good enough for your purposes. Indeed I guess that most teams have them already.

I understand that some club racing is done on this basis in New Zealand.

Just a thought.

Regards

Jim

PS Nothing against timekeepers. :) If anyone can remember how frequently we used to have to wait for them before the introduction of the current equipment and compare that with how rarely it happens these days, it will be clear what an improved level of service we get.

JimW
Brilliant idea.
diz

Does anyone know the testing dates for Oulton and the costs of a days testing ?

Generally the day before the race. Last year the days testing was only £195 + £50 for a garage.

BTTT

Diz, your BTTT buttons got stuck, whatever the BTTT means!

I've PM'd him on that one.

I think he is trying to type with one hand whilst holding a glass in the other(!)

;-) (Hck)

So what's new - I do it every wednesday night (our private 'motor club' night) with a few mates.

I reckon it might be he's typing with his nose, with a glass in one hand and a cake in the other hand. In the circs., as usual he does a cracking job. LOL.

I am going to have to get up to speed on these abrev's.
BTTT? LOL?

I think it could be slice of cake in each hand and a straw for the drink.....

And how do you type then? Use a dictaphone type thing?

Big toe.........

Originally posted by heel'n'toe-no
Diz, Having spoken to Michael Edgar last night, I have found out that he is considering doing a race in the BRSCCNW this coming season. If he does it then I will probably do the same as it will cost no extra to bring my car over at the same time.

I know that you are bound to secrecy until Thursday about the race dates so I will give you the perfect scenario for us.....A race meeting at Oulton Park 7/8th August or 14/15th August as the cars will be over here anyway for Silverstone on July 31st.

Two Dogs mentioned to Michael that he should try to come over and do a race in your championship......What do you think?
:beer: :cool:

Tell Mike Edgar he owes me a nose cone! :(