"DICE WITH SPICE" Anyone??

Hi Gerry here, I should love to get hold of a video or DVD copy of the film "DICE WITH SPICE". I saw it many years ago, and seem to recall a gaggle of mini's racing nose to tail round Crystal Palace? It was a great little film. Some years ago I wrote to Gordon about it, but he didn't reply. Anyone got a copy? Thanks, Gerry "Swish" Taylor.

I have been trying to locate the TV film "DICE WITH SPICE" Featuring...er...
Gordon Spice, without much luck. Having just got back from being out of the UK for a few days, I had half expected to have some news about this elusive product....but nothing? Did I imagine it? I know it was many years ago, featuring mini's in action at Crystal Palace, but surely SOMEONE out there has a copy??? Or maybe could point me in the right direction to get hold of it. Sorry to be a nuisance, but I wanted for Christmas. Gerry SWISH Anglia Taylor.

Gerry, I've merged these two threads for obvious reasons. I must say it does sound familiar, so probably not your imagination. Anyone out there help Gerry, please!

Gerry, there is a guy called Ian Clarke racing a Mk1 Capri in the Classic Touring Car Race Club pre-73's who was parked next to me at Pembrey. Well he is racing with help and assistance from Gordon Spice and has his stickers on the car. He also told me he was a personal friend of his, maybe he could ask him for you. I have his email address at work I think, if I can find it I will PM you as I don't think he posts here, he seemed a real nice fellow and am sure he would not mind.

Hi Al, Hi John, many thanks for the posts. I have today had a reply from a chap that is a friend of Gordons, and the film DOES EXIST! In fact Gordon says he has a copy and will get me a copy from his film, how about that! The contact is Patrick Sumner, to whom I owe a debt of gratitude. I have been searching out this amazing little film for over forty years! For any tin-topper it is a must. Real Door Handling Stuff! Once again thanks to ten-tenths for bringing us all together, :woot: Gerry SWISH Taylor.

Glad you are sorted Gerry!

Hi Al, yeah, I have just had a really great chat with Gordy Spice on the phone, and he is so pleased to talk about the old days. What a racer eh? Anyway, he told me "DICE WITH SPICE" was a BBC film, shot (as I remembered) at CRYSTAL PALACE, the very track being talked about on another part of the forum. It is sadly no longer available, but Gordy is going to have one done for me for Christmas! So, I'm well made-up. I can almost hear those mini's screaming past, Gordons Britax mini, with Chris Crafts Escort and I think John Rhodes mini, with "nowt but a fag paper between em". Incidentally both Gordon and yours truly are now officially PENSIONERS! Stay Lucky! Gerry.
thank you Mr Sumner. :woot:

Excellent stuff Gerry.

Gerry, perhaps Gordon could turn it into a commercial proposition and have a limited run of this film issued for sale. I reckon there's plenty here who would be prepared to pay for a copy. Guess it depends how long the film is though, and what the quality is.

well done gerry pleased you got sorted out. absolutelly nothing to do with this thread but it got me thinking... when i was a kid and the bbc were playing trade test transmissions for the new bbc2 with monotonous regularity day in day out there was a short film called "home made car". was anyone sad enough to remember this?.. like me! think i must have seen it a hundred times in the school hols in 196? :rotate:

Gerry I Would Like A Copy Of The Film And The 100 Greatest Sporting Moments Race With Gerry Marshall So Press Mr Spice Some More And See If He Needs Another Pension Fund!!

Hi Guys, Once I have my copy safely in my Christmas stocking, I shall call Gordy again, and indeed ask him, or put it to him that he may have a market here for his film. For your information the film lasts around half an hour and is commentated by non other than MURRAY WALKER, complete with his usual quips! Leave it with me, I will ask, but I would ask that you don't pester Gordy at the moment please. I shall come back on shortly, and let you all have a progress report. incidentally, did I mention that both Gordy and I are indeed old age pensioners!!!!!!! Gerry,

happy to wait & let u talk with the man
dont be so smug at being a pensioner and having all that time on yr hands SOME ONE WILL FIND U SOMETHING TO DO !!

Why Driftwood, ya young whippersnapper (by the way what is a whippersnapper Haha) I am still working! For my sins I am in the Entertainment business and currentely am the voice of JERRY LEWIS in the show "THE RAT PACK LIVE", also doing voice work for radio and the corporate part of the industry. So, I do spend quite a lot of time on the road touring. One day I shall retire and go and live quietly by the sea-side with my pipe and slippers "YEAH RIGHT!!!!" :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: GERRY

I also have received my winter fuel allowance,also remember Chris Craft stalling his Anglia on the grid at Brands,getting a push start from the marshals and carving his way from last to about third overall,passing all those Mk2 Jags etc,thunderous applause from the stands and car parks,think he was penalised 10 sec's for a push start,everyone watched for Chris after that.

Eric Falce

i went to see Brat pack at theatre very good show worth every penny
talking of chris craft had a brief discsussion with old lola 290 race mechanic other day Craft raced sports cars for a few years and was of course a Capri Gp 1 sparring partner of Mr Spice ( just to keep the thread going!! ) all these drivers will be free bus pass holders now but it seems like yesterday they where racing and i was in short trousers training to be a whippersnapper
memory is a great thing and reading old asutosports helps too

Driftwood, is Chris craft still with us? I recall racing with him down at Brands, although I must add that he had two years racing in his pocket before I came along (I guess I was a young Whippersnapper, well...not so young, but a Whippersnapper all the same) Chris I guess was amongst the first to race the famous 105E brand, and was really quick. Their is some debate as to whether his steed was called the Orange Box or the Orange Crate, I have actually head Chris refer to it as The Orange Crate, so which was it? (There that's another can of worms opened Ha,ha,) Gerry SWISH Taylor.

FWIW if you look at my avatar you'll see a minor tribute to Gordy. Also a fellow CTCRC/Top Hat 70's saloon competitor owns an ex spice group 1 shell although its got big group 2 wings now.

FWIW if you look at my avatar you'll see a minor tribute to Gordy. Also a fellow CTCRC/Top Hat 70's saloon competitor owns an ex spice group 1 shell although its got big group 2 wings now.

I'm going off topic here i think but Uh oh, Peter, the Capri juices are starting to flow again!!

Yeah i remember having a chat with the guy who's got this car you mentioned and was urging him to convert it back to a 'standard' shell to enter the Pre 83's with. He said he had some spare wings for it but thought he'd keep it as it was and enter Oldtimer races in Germany with it. That was 2003 and i must confess to being a bit out of touch lately with Grp 1 Capri movements.

There's another guy who's got a restored ex Vince Woodman Esso liveried car in his garage, which apparently was on show at Autosport show last year. He was hoping to get on track as he got a good deal of impressed onlookers at the stand!

Would be nice to see a pukka Esso car versus a pukka Red Spice car wouldn't it!

Hi Everyone! I said that I would keep you informed, so ...I have just recieved the one and only copy of that amazing piece of film "DICE WITH SPICE" Filmed at Crystal Palace in 1968. and featuring the Britax Mini or Gordon Spice and Chris Craft in a Broadspeed Escort, along with John Rhodes, with John Handley mini mounted, Mike Freemans Imp, et al. In the film Gordon smashes the Mike Youngs Anglia lap record by FOUR SECONDS! I have spoken with Gordy Spice and he is giving some serious thought to making the film available on DVD. We are to talk again after Christmas. Gordy evidentally has a load of RACING FILM and it all needs sorting. What an amazing archive! And the prospect of making it available on DVD next year is absolutely wonderful. More later guy's. Gerry.

Good show Gerry and long live the internet and 10/10ths, what an institution, you would not have stood a hope in hell of securing that footage without this wonderful technology.

Al, you are so right. It has taken me over forty years to actually get a copy of this famous film. More on the progress after Christmas. Have a great time. Gerry.

Gerry, thanks for the update (and also for the PMs). Something good could come out of all this, I hope!

lads, before you all get carried away with the contents of Gordon Spice's loft, has anyone thought about copyright? Gordon would certainly NOT be allowed to issue the Crsytal Palace film on DVD, it's BBC copyright!!
And this is from someone who produces his own DVD's. I too, would love to see these old films released again, but copyright clearances make it a complete no-go. Example : in Septembver I talked at length with the Production manager of a company called 2Entertain Ltd. They now control the release of ALL the BBC DVD's and CD's. I tried to convince him that a well-researched DVD of motor racing items from the BBC Archive would be well-received, BUT....in the end, it all comes down to sales and he just couldn't justify it! He is more used to sales the size of the Clarkson things (ugh!), so anything he can't sell through the High Street outlets (WH Smith etc) is just not worth it for them I even offered to research it myself for them, as I used to work at the BBC Film & Videotape Library (so I know what I'm looking for / at), still it didn't work!

Gary, point taken, but I guess that copywrite is just one of several hurdles that Gordon and Gerry will have to overcome. Got to try, though!

One of my customers specialises in mastering and re-releasing old film scores and other music, one I did artwork for the vinyl album cover was a re-release of the Italian Job. The point is he has to seek permission from copyright holders but as I understand it a lot of the companies (eg Ranks) are not even aware they own it and can be quite receptive to releasing it (not all of course). So it may be well worth making an approach to the Beeb, you never know you may be pleasantly surprised, especially if you can promise to give them credits on the re-release.

If it is BBC copyright, they may be pleased to have it found, as they often have appeals for missing footage. They may even make it available on stream, or broadcast it at some point.

'you never know you may be pleasantly surprised'
er...I think not!! I've tried and tried with stuff over the years and it all comes down to how much money they want!! If it's for European release, worldwide, the US etc etc, it's all different payments, believe it or not.
Then you get into the copyright issues with the music, let alone the film/programme itself. Then also, you have to pay voiceover people too.
You'll never recoup your outlay if you have to pay all this stuff up front, believe me. If only we could, I would be releasing old material every month!!

Ok so just give up and no one gets to see it, try who knows. As I say this guy I know seems to get around it althogh he says it is sometimes a struggle but he makes a living at it so must be getting somewhere.

Thanks for all the comment. It really has started something. Point taken about copyright. We shall be trying regardless. If we cannot do it, then all this lovely nostalgic Motor Racing history will just remain in a box in the attic.
On a lighter note, Gordy has a lot of NON BEEB work, ie shot by an indie, and is indeed copyright of Gordon Spice! So...All the Tricentrol Capri racing, and all the Le Mans will still be available, hopefully in the New Year. Thank you for all the interest. Gerry & Gordon. :banghead:

Driftwood, is Chris craft still with us? I recall racing with him down at Brands, although I must add that he had two years racing in his pocket before I came along (I guess I was a young Whippersnapper, well...not so young, but a Whippersnapper all the same) Chris I guess was amongst the first to race the famous 105E brand, and was really quick. Their is some debate as to whether his steed was called the Orange Box or the Orange Crate, I have actually head Chris refer to it as The Orange Crate, so which was it? (There that's another can of worms opened Ha,ha,) Gerry SWISH Taylor.

Chris is very much alive and well he is working on a project for the conversion and import of a Japanese road sportscar from his base in Chigwell

well done gerry pleased you got sorted out. absolutelly nothing to do with this thread but it got me thinking... when i was a kid and the bbc were playing trade test transmissions for the new bbc2 with monotonous regularity day in day out there was a short film called "home made car". was anyone sad enough to remember this?.. like me! think i must have seen it a hundred times in the school hols in 196? :rotate:


"The Home Made car "is still available from the BP Video library

wwwbpvideolibrary.com

by post from BP Video Library 53 Great Suffolk Street London SE1 ODB cheque to BPVL £20.56 includes P&P ring them first

I was not sure if he was the Chris Craft from racing AND the same of rocket cars the 2 seater road car looks like a formula car for the road ( deisgned by Gordon murray?)
now Vemac cars for the japanese market and a car runs in GT300 out there

On a lighter note, Gordy has a lot of NON BEEB work, ie shot by an indie, and is indeed copyright of Gordon Spice! So...All the Tricentrol Capri racing, and all the Le Mans will still be available, hopefully in the New Year. Thank you for all the interest. Gerry & Gordon. :banghead:

Oh yes!! I've been trying like mas to find old vid's of Group 1 BTCC featuring the Capri's for yonks and had no luck!

Please let me know as soon as something's available!! :D

I'll second that Chunterer!. Anything from British Saloon Car Championship Tricentrol / Trimoco late 70s early 80s would be fantastic. I too have looked hard fro this stuff but can find nothing.

On another note, surely footage like this could be marketed via the internet and make a profit. Why do these people insist on having to push all their motorsport DVDs through the high street stores?

1 reason they seek high street shops is pedestrians thru the door but in motorsport do we go to the high street to get our vid/dvds no !
We go to specialist shops but they cant see that as they sell music vids etc from the tv programmes by the 10000`s

I know driftwood. Why should our little Gems get stuck in their vaults. Why cant they release this stuff to someone that does care and can sell it and make a decent profit. It's so b%%$dy easy. I could build a site and be marketing this stuff on the net by the end of the week.....now there's a thought!

sadly its the £ per vid return they look at if the profit is 15% per vid they would rathre do 100 000 vids than 10 000
the profit from 10 000 would not cover their time effort etc in digging the rell out creating contract copyright etc
we are small fish in the big pond
for example the kid that won X factor will sell more singles in week1 of realease after the TV programme than he may sell the rest of his life- to those in the biz that will do nicely for them
we racers may buy over 10 years 1 million Spice dvd/vids but that will not gee them up enough
look at Mr Blobby or the telly tubbies the Beeb raked it all in in a matter of weeks
yes we can all sit here and whine about gems in vaults and we want to watch them or buy copies on dvd etc but the numbers do not stack in their favour for the effort required
unless u have 1 million quid and can go to the beeb and say ok u will take the whole lot 1 hit 1 contract 1 van u will not get far with these sorts of things
Gary has worked at the beeb i had dialouge with another guy who worked at the beeb and made his own F2 video and they all say the same thing
so unless u can get real money together to make an offer its unlikely to go much further
so we need 1000 people with £1k each to put into the pot
then u need maybe £200k to then start making vids to sell and in 3 yrs time u might reoup that £200k to then make some more vids
sadly any investor with 1 mil can go buy 5 industrial units and get a return for no agro and a profit in the land value every year with out getting out of bed so why get into race car video business

Ok well instead of having them lying in vaults because it is too expensive to do a run of vidieos/DVD's why not digitise them then sell them as downloads. People who want them can then pay to download and burn them to CD/DVD at home. How much can this cost, a fraction of the other option surely.

probably need an expert here to start this argument!!

Ok well instead of having them lying in vaults because it is too expensive to do a run of vidieos/DVD's why not digitise them then sell them as downloads. People who want them can then pay to download and burn them to CD/DVD at home. How much can this cost, a fraction of the other option surely.

Yeah good idea, but i'd still prefer a good hard copy for my collection though!

Well Form The Response Here So Far It Looks Like We Need 1 Smarty Pants Tp Set Up A Web Page Where We As Plebians Can Register Our Intention To Purchase Said Video Dvd So The Marketing Process Can Start
Once We Have Dispensed With Dice With Spice ( A Lads Night Out In A Dodgy Curry House) We Can Then Get Onto The Beeb For Other Titles 100 Greatest Sporting Moments Crystal Place Race Etc

I Suspect The Sales Will Be Around 1000 Copies And Not Enough To Warrant The Input Form The Beeb
However Gary Critcher Is In A Better Position To Know As He Worked At The Beeb And Is Selling His Own Vids
I See On Usa Race Car.com Site A Webpage Is Up Names To Pressurise For Grandprix To Be Put Onto Dvd

Yeah good idea, but i'd still prefer a good hard copy for my collection though!If it was done right you could download your movie which you could burn to CD/DVD at home and at the same time they could also have a DVD cover that you could download and print off, trim and insert in the DVD case so that would be almost as good as a manufactured hard copy. I find with any downloaded music, my daughter does a lot not me. if you print of a cover off and make a thing of it it looks far nicer in your collection, somehow gives it a less copied feel.

If it was done right you could download your movie which you could burn to CD/DVD at home and at the same time they could also have a DVD cover that you could download and print off, trim and insert in the DVD case so that would be almost as good as a manufactured hard copy. I find with any downloaded music, my daughter does a lot not me. if you print of a cover off and make a thing of it it looks far nicer in your collection, somehow gives it a less copied feel.

Know what you mean Al! It's true what you say though, just that i'm a bit of an ignoramus with this sort of stuff, but i'm sure i could get someone else to do it for me!

Know what you mean Al! It's true what you say though, just that i'm a bit of an ignoramus with this sort of stuff, but i'm sure i could get someone else to do it for me! Still working on things. Gordon is very busy at this moment, but we havn't forgotten. Gerry.

Great,

Thanks Gerry, look forward to further info!