Dutch 240z race car

does anyone have any info on the dutch datsun 240Z that raced in the group 4/5 european sports car championship in the mid 70s. It was driven by Han Tjan and earlier by Rob Janssen. Janspeed were involved in preparing the car in 1976ish. Did you race against it? Did you see it racing? Have you any photos of it? All info gratefully recieved. cheers ben

yes i have see it raced by Han Tjan
have some pics from magazines but need to scan first

here is some include a model i build

more to come

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/DSCF2097.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/datsun-tjan-02_pag.jpg

That is just great! I also want to know more about any of the janspeed cars, I have been researching the subject myself a while ago for an article I wanted to write. But information is scarce.

This is what I wrote to Ben over 2 years ago:
----------------------
The history up to 1974 can be followed on my site in the Dutch championship section, especially from 1973 on. You might find some entries of the same car in the Euro GT championship 72-74 too.

The history of Tjan's 240Z might have started as early as 1971. Rob Janssen raced an ex-Safari Datsun in the Dutch prototype championship with a group 4 car. You'll find a reference here: http://homepage.mac.com/frank_de_jong/Races/1971%20Zandvoort%20F3.html

After that, the car was not seen in 1972 but reappeared in 1973 in the now group 2/group 4 championship. There were two cars now, but they raced hardly together on 1 weekend. Check out the dutch national races on the site. One car raced again in 1974, ad there's a picture on the site: http://homepage.mac.com/frank_de_jong/Pages/p%201974%20Grote%20Prijs.html

I have to start on the 1975, 1976 etc seasons, from memory I can add the following:
Tjan raced the same car in 1975 on occasions, even in the 4-hour ETCC race at zandvoort. In 1976, a Datsun was entered as 280 ZG in the new Group 4 form; not sure it was the same car. In 1977, a group 5 version was built initially with an atmospheric engine, later with a turbo. There were not many results to speak of.
-----------------------------------
In the mean time, results for the 1975-1977 period have been added to my site. The car was hardly used in 1975, but in 1976 a 280 ZG appeared following the strict 1976 Group 4 rules. It came second in the Dutch championship, but that was hardly a result to be proud of.
It became worse in 1977, when Janspeed tried to creat a group 5 car with a turbocharged engine; on raceday, the engine was not ready, the car was not ready or Tjan was ill. It didn't even appear in the top-5 of the Dutch championship.

The history of Tjan's 240Z might have started as early as 1971. Rob Janssen raced an ex-Safari Datsun in the Dutch prototype championship with a group 4 car.

Be careful here. Rob Janssen's 71/72 was certainly NOT an ex-Safari Rally works car......

First of all, Nissan never used any left-hand-drive 240Zs on the 1971 East African Safari Rally - so any "Safari" history for that car needs to be taken with a big pinch of salt.

However, Janssen did have access to an ex-Monte Carlo Rallye works recce car from 1971 ( which he had subsequently driven in the '71 TAP Rallye ) and I believe this was the car that he drove in some circuit events. But I don't think it lasted long and I don't believe that it was campaigned into 1973 ( mainly because some major components of that particular car still exist today in pretty-much their TAP Rallye configuration ).

There has always been a lot of rogue information about these cars ( even in-period ) so it is worth bearing this in mind when researching the cars today.........

here is some include a model i build


I noted that the original car was left-hand-drive, but that your model is right-hand-drive. Base kit was RHD, I guess?

yes it is a slotracer from scalextric ,but i could fit a other int. here

here is the 76 version

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/tjan4.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/tjan5.jpg


and the turbo for 77

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/tjan3.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/tjan2.jpg

this is a recent pic so the car may be alive

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/IMG_0050.jpg

Oh yes, the 240z is still alive!:) It's regularly hill climbed, I'm actually eager to see it in real life.

Regarding other Janspeed datsuns; I've done a bit of research for my new website on which I hope to public a good article about it (won't name it though, I'm not sure advertising is allowed on here?). I just couldn't keep this bit of information back, so here it is.

Well anyway, I know that the datsun sunny 120y raced by Tjan in the netherlands was brought to trinidad by I believe Alec Poole (who regularly undertook such trips) and raced there by Dave Maraj. Who is now boss of the champion audi le mans team and also has the biggest dealership of porsches in florida! I contacted him not long ago and he told me he crashed the car and went up in flames:(. I'm still awaiting some photographs of its time in the carribeano.

There was a second janspeed datsun over there, a cherry 100a. I'm not sure if this is the factory car or a car built with various janspeed bits and just called a datsun janspeed. At the time, one was rallied there by a chap called Barry Mackenzie, same one?

In britain a certain Martin Pearson raced another janspeed cherry 100a in special saloons with modified bodywork. I'm sure someone on here can shed a lot more light on this car than I can:rotate:.

Well I hope someone can tell us some more on the technical side of these cars, which seems very interesting.

btw, not long ago a janspeed race cylinder head was on ebay and apparently it was quite a bit higher than the standard road-going version to allow for bigger valves and springs. Lovely, a bit of cheating!

Two cars came from Britain (where they were driven by Poole and Kitano as Jananese works entries. There was a rear-wheel drive Sunny 1200 coupé and a front wheel drive 120A coupé. These cars were driven in the Netherlands in 1974-1975, in 1976 the Sunny disappeared to "the bahama's" which might be Trinidad. There were a number of group 2 120a coupé's in the Netherlands - I'm not sure if the original 120a coupé was modified - I guess not.
In 1977, the Dutch went to Group 5 with some 120A coupé's, but guess what: late in season, the good old Sunny returned...

Yes it is most certainly alive and fighting fit. I was out in it at the weekend and will be out in a couple of weeks time
http://www.tisburymotors.co.uk/Wiscombe_Park_HillClimb.html

Two cars came from Britain (where they were driven by Poole and Kitano as Jananese works entries. There was a rear-wheel drive Sunny 1200 coupé and a front wheel drive 120A coupé. These cars were driven in the Netherlands in 1974-1975, in 1976 the Sunny disappeared to "the bahama's" which might be Trinidad. There were a number of group 2 120a coupé's in the Netherlands - I'm not sure if the original 120a coupé was modified - I guess not.
In 1977, the Dutch went to Group 5 with some 120A coupé's, but guess what: late in season, the good old Sunny returned...

Well that's very interesting frank, it seems you finished some more of your dutch group 5 history. Pool and Kitano drove these cars in trinidad?

But the sunny reappearing in 1977 is incredibly confusing, it must've been a different sunny as the 1974 sunny was racing away in the hands of Dave Maraj, there is a photo of it on one of the trinidadian forums complete with janspeed works colours.

Could the 120a of martin pearson in special saloons be the same car as one of the 1977 dutch group 5 ones?

(Is there any chance of anyone changing this thread's name to janspeed datsuns? As we're getting slightly off-topic of the 240z now:rotate: )

Poole and Kitano drove it in Britain in 1973 (check the BTCC British GP support race on my site for instance) - I don't know if they ever drove the car elsewhere. There was even an article in Dutch Autorevue about these cars.
The 1977 reappearance of the Sunny was puzzling to say the least - it wasn't noted in the dutch press but pictures show clearly that it must have been the same car - can't think of any other Sunny racing in Europe.
Perhaps they just hired it for a few months instead - I suppose Coronel's original Group 5 120A coupé wasa crashed and Datsun had no plans to enter the 1978 championship so building a new one was no option?
(I haven't checked 1978 yet but from memory I only remember private Datsun's and a one-off race with Hayje in a silly Janspeed 2-liter Group 5 car at the Dutch GP - silly because compared to the German turbo group 5 monsters like the Capri a car with a 220 HP rallye engine is a joke...).

In britain a certain Martin Pearson raced another janspeed cherry 100a in special saloons with modified bodywork. I'm sure someone on here can shed a lot more light on this car than I can:rotate:.

Well I hope someone can tell us some more on the technical side of these cars, which seems very interesting.



This one?
http://www.racing70s.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/racing70s/Japanese/saloons_01.htm

Yes KA, that's the car I meant! I couldn't find it. It's interesting to note that the english 120a was used by pearson in 1977 and 1978. Whereas at the same time there was the 'Datsun Holland' 120a here in holland driven by coronel according to Frank. Was this one built by Janspeed as well?

BTW, Frank do you have any photographs of the dutch datsuns? Perhaps it could bring any clues.

And Frank, that's indeed a joke Hayje with 220 HP engine, was that in a Sunny or a 120a? Must've been during that soaked DRM weekend at zandvoort then. I'm surprised it didn't win, as everyone knows power isn't 'important' in the rain:rofl:

The Datsun showed up during the GP support race - as a surprise. It was a Sunny, but a newer model, with 4 doors (...) and a Janspeed decal.
Pictures are scarse so far - what I've got is on the website. Have you checked http://www.racehistorie.nl/ ?
And some more Dutch datsuns: http://www.icce.rug.nl/~soundscapes/DATABASES/RNI/rni13.shtml

here is another one

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/tjan6.jpg

And this wil be my 1:12 model of the righthand driven car based on
tamiya's 280zg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/2008_08030024.jpg

This one? 1978

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/2008_08040026.jpg

That's the 1978 Sunny alright!

Here is a article from Autorensport in dutch

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/sunny1.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/sunny2.jpg

Excellent input to the thread! That 4 door looks a pretty mean device!

BTW, who was driving that red Pantera (on right of earlier pic at Zandvoort) looks like he's having a job getting the power down onto the road.....

Excellent input to the thread! That 4 door looks a pretty mean device!

BTW, who was driving that red Pantera (on right of earlier pic at Zandvoort) looks like he's having a job getting the power down onto the road.....



René Tricot (B) i belive

an advert from 1976

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/adv1.jpg

Who took the picture of the 240Z at the bottom of post number 8?
Have you got any more taken that day?
cheers Ben

i download it from a site
it was an article about all jap car day
maby you know

cant find it back for now,maby later

Sweet:p all the Datsuns! Absolutely stunning these contributions Haman132!:drool:

Interesting bit to read as well! It seems there was a lot of confusion around what group to enter the Sunny car in. Seems Antonides and a certain 'Kamikaas':rofl: both drove 'factory' supported Cherry Coupes! This must've been in 1978 then?

i'm not full awair of the whole history ,i only find articles in my old magazines
trying to help

this is from 1973

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/sport1.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/sport2.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/sport3.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/sport4.jpg

Who took the picture of the 240Z at the bottom of post number 8?
Have you got any more taken that day?
cheers Ben
found the link back to the pic

http://racer86.wordpress.com/2008/05/17/japfest-17-05-08-part-1/

Evert Bolderheij 1977

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/evertbolderheij.jpg

Here's a nice 1973 picture of the Sunny which landed in Holland in 1974:
http://s271.photobucket.com/albums/jj127/drivers71/Motor%20Racing/1973/Tourist%20Trophy%20-%20Silverstone/?action=view&current=73090SSTT-08.jpg

The Datsun showed up during the GP support race - as a surprise. It was a Sunny, but a newer model, with 4 doors (...) and a Janspeed decal.
Pictures are scarse so far - what I've got is on the website. Have you checked http://www.racehistorie.nl/ ?
And some more Dutch datsuns: http://www.icce.rug.nl/~soundscapes/DATABASES/RNI/rni13.shtml

Hi, I did check racehistorie.nl, rather sadly I couldn't find any relevant photographs. And the second site you pointed at doesn't work anymore Frank, it's a site from a Groningen University student or something, perhaps he quit and now his site has been removed.:rotate:

By the way the other contributions are absolutely marvelous! Brilliant additions to Datsun racing.

If you check the photobucket site and go to 1977/Silverstone WSC you'll find our Sunny once again.
The Groningen site works fine for me??

Ah, it works again I see! It must've had some downtime at the time I was looking at it. And you're right in 1977 the sunny (does it have bigger arches than a few years before?) was still here in Europe, must've gone to trinidad after that then.

btw Frank;on the 1973 TT photobucket site, have you noticed the Opel Manta? Seems to be dutch as well, on the spoiler it says: Hotel Zonne Noordwijk.

Yes, I know the Manta, it was shared between owner Franz Heine and dutchman Gerrit de Vries.
The Sunny was a surprise to me; I knew there was a Sunny, but not that it was the one which appeared in the Netherlands in 1977 (see post #10).
It looks like it was not really updated after 1975.

Indeed the sunny looks not very much updated since 1975, but for some reason it seems to have wider arches.

By the way scroll down a bit on this page and see Martin Pearson's Datsun: http://forums.autosport.com/showthread.php?threadid=99466&perpage=40&display=&pagenumber=2

And another one from a post of the other forum: http://img299.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pearsongp2.jpg

enjoy

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/tjan8.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/tjan9.jpg

Han Tjan, I believe a young Keith odor, Jan, I think a young Norman Clancy, any other names to faces or hair styles

1975?

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/che1.jpg

1977

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/che2.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/che3.jpg

The first one is 1975 indeed - the ETCC round at Zandvoort.

Indeed Rob Janssen with codriver Jaap Dik did drive the Tap rally and also probably also the Acropolis rally with the same car , this became later a racing car .
I have spoken with Jaap Dik , but does any body know where to find Rob Janssen , is he still around ?

If Rob is found then I would love to contact him re my car and any memories he has of it.
Did Jaap Dik drive the car that became the circuit car as well? or was this another car

I think the Rob Jansen cars where all left hand drive one's

I think the Rob Jansen cars where all left hand drive one'sMine was a left hand drive to start with. It was converted to right hand drive in the mid 70's for reasons that I am not sure of at this time. There are certain things on the car which tie it in to definately being the same car that Rob was campaigning and also the same car that Han Tjan was campaigning. What I am struggling to find out is apart from Rob and Han Tjan, who else drove the car and where

Mine was a left hand drive to start with. It was converted to right hand drive in the mid 70's for reasons that I am not sure of at this time. There are certain things on the car which tie it in to definately being the same car that Rob was campaigning and also the same car that Han Tjan was campaigning. What I am struggling to find out is apart from Rob and Han Tjan, who else drove the car and where

The car Nr 30 on the picture is the car what crashed in the 1971 TAP rally
I still own the glassfibre lefthand door skin with the nr 30 on .
this car has probably been coverted to a circuit car .
Jaap Dik was never driving himself , he only was a co driver .

Mine was a left hand drive to start with. It was converted to right hand drive in the mid 70's for reasons that I am not sure of at this time. There are certain things on the car which tie it in to definately being the same car that Rob was campaigning and also the same car that Han Tjan was campaigning. What I am struggling to find out is apart from Rob and Han Tjan, who else drove the car and where

Ben,
Please don't get your hopes up. The car that z-spec is talking about was a much earlier build-date car than yours, so they are two quite different cars for sure.

We know the original identity of the car in the bottom picture on post #28, and it's not the same as yours.

Still some loose ends to be tied up though.......

Interesting, isn't it? :)

Ben,
Please don't get your hopes up. The car that z-spec is talking about was a much earlier build-date car than yours, so they are two quite different cars for sure.

We know the original identity of the car in the bottom picture on post #28, and it's not the same as yours.

Still some loose ends to be tied up though.......

Interesting, isn't it? :)

PZR , free translated the dutch article in #28 says that Rob Janssen build a circuit car from the crashed TAP rallycar for Hans Ernst ( he is at the moment chairman CEO from circuit Zandvoort) , that is the car at the bottem of the post ( lhd ) , also the article sas Rob Janssen was building a new car in the same time .
So PRZ , I think we know till 73 / 74 where this second rallycar is left ,
I wil speak later on this week with Hans Ernst , if he can tell me more about .

There sure were two 240 Z race cars in the Netherlands in 1973 (for Ernst and Janssen); there were massive problems with parts and reliability; only the last part of the season both cars were entered and raced.

Ben,
Please don't get your hopes up. The car that z-spec is talking about was a much earlier build-date car than yours, so they are two quite different cars for sure.

We know the original identity of the car in the bottom picture on post #28, and it's not the same as yours.

Still some loose ends to be tied up though.......

Interesting, isn't it? :)

Hi, I am not holding out any false hope at all. The car that I have can without doubt be identified as one that Rob was running on the circuits. From talking to various sources it is definately not the rally shell built into a circuit car. I do have photos of Rob with the car in the pits at I believe Zandvoort, and from them I can identify why there are 2 holes in the rear roof pillar on the car that I have. They match identically the location of the fuel tank breather pipe in the photo.
I took the car to Zandvoort in 2000 to a Z meeting and Han Tjan was good enough to come over to see the car there.
I am interested in any information or lead on the history of the car and what Rob and subsequent drivers achieved with it.
Cheers Ben

The car Nr 30 on the picture is the car what crashed in the 1971 TAP rally
I still own the glassfibre lefthand door skin with the nr 30 on .
this car has probably been coverted to a circuit car .
Jaap Dik was never driving himself , he only was a co driver .

In the article posted by haman132 (no 28) you can read about the crash on the TAP-rally.
In those days the cars weren't equipped with a full roll-cage but just a rollbar over your head.
Because of the crash the front window shattered but nevertheless Rob decided to drive the car home (back to Holland) without a front window. After just a few miles the rear window blew out because of the built up pressure in the car. With the help of some skiing goggles he drove all the way from Portugal to Holland.

There sure were two 240 Z race cars in the Netherlands in 1973 (for Ernst and Janssen); there were massive problems with parts and reliability; only the last part of the season both cars were entered and raced.

It will take more than a view pages to mention all the problems encountered in building and racing the Z's in Holland.
The Z's were the only cars still on carburettors, 2 valves per cilinder and no cross-flow cilinderhead (intake and exhaust on different sides).
These parts were available in Japan but they couldn't be convinced to send them to Holland.
The rear brakes were converted from drum to diskbrakes. Pictures of the diskbrakes were combined with some japanese text, photocopied several times and added to the homologation papers.

I think the Rob Jansen cars where all left hand drive one's

Yep, that's right!

After the Monte Carlo Rally (1972?) somebody in Japan decided four or five workscars should stay in Europe. Nobody knows why but that's how these exotic rallycars ended up in Zandvoort, Holland. The evidence of the pressence of these cars in Zandvoort had been on the roads for several weeks because all the cars still were on spikes !
One of the cars was collected by Tony Fall who drove a rally-Z in England and needed the car for spares.
Another was sold to a MD who allready had several nice cars like a Tomaso Pantera and the Honda S800 Rob Janssen drove (in 1969?).
I am not sure anymore but I think another car was sold to Miroux, a belgian Datsun dealer and racingdriver.
At least one of the cars was changed into a racing car and driven by Rob Janssen.

Yep, that's right!

After the Monte Carlo Rally (1972?) somebody in Japan decided four or five workscars should stay in Europe. Nobody knows why but that's how these exotic rallycars ended up in Zandvoort, Holland. The evidence of the pressence of these cars in Zandvoort had been on the roads for several weeks because all the cars still were on spikes !
One of the cars was collected by Tony Fall who drove a rally-Z in England and needed the car for spares.
Another was sold to a MD who allready had several nice cars like a Tomaso Pantera and the Honda S800 Rob Janssen drove (in 1969?).
I am not sure anymore but I think another car was sold to Miroux, a belgian Datsun dealer and racingdriver.
At least one of the cars was changed into a racing car and driven by Rob Janssen.
You seem to have some inside information from the Janssen camp. Were you with Rob at the time or is this info you have collected over the years?
It would be very interesting to here more
Ben

Marcius,
Thank you for your very interesting posts. It sounds like you have some knowledge of these cars - maybe through personal experience? I would be interested to hear about that. :)

You mention the 'home made' photocopy homologation of the rear disk brakes in Europe; In fact the full ( official! ) homologation of the four-pot, vented rear brakes was achieved by October 1973 ( JAF GT-010 V-21 & FIA 3023 17/15V ), and they were being used in Japan well before this on circuit racing cars. There is no doubt that they were needed sooner than this for the rally cars, but the main focus of the Works rally team in Japan was always the Safari, and The Monte, RAC and a few other top international events were seen as secondary objectives. The first *official* major Works outing for the 240Z rally cars was the 1970 RAC Rally, but just a few months later they actually won the 1971 E.A. Safari Rally - which was an amazing achievement. According to Japanese sources, this almost stopped Works rally development of the 240Z at that point ( objective achieved! ).

There was always a lack of funds, parts and logistical support for the Works team - so they were doing their best with limited resources. Nobody should underestimate the difficulties they faced in building their cars in Japan and coming to Europe, Africa and Australasia with them. They had a massive company behind them, but it never really gave them its full support. They did amazingly well when you take into account what restrictions they faced. Personally, I admire those men very much indeed.......

After the Monte Carlo Rally (1972?) somebody in Japan decided four or five workscars should stay in Europe. Nobody knows why but that's how these exotic rallycars ended up in Zandvoort, Holland. The evidence of the pressence of these cars in Zandvoort had been on the roads for several weeks because all the cars still were on spikes !
One of the cars was collected by Tony Fall who drove a rally-Z in England and needed the car for spares.

Actually, there were quite a few ex-Works cars ( particularly ex-Monte recce and rally cars ) that stayed in Europe, and several of them made their way to the UK. Tony Fall never actually owned the car you mention, and it certainly was not cannibalised for spares until after he had almost destroyed it! It is true that spare parts were in short supply, and the rate of attrition took the Works staff somewhat by surprise. Some cars were destroyed on relatively 'minor' events that were effectively seen as practice for the 'majors'. No doubt the Works team were set back by circumstances such as these.

Another was sold to a MD who allready had several nice cars like a Tomaso Pantera and the Honda S800 Rob Janssen drove (in 1969?).

I think our fellow member 'z-spec' knows this particular car very well..... ;)

I am not sure anymore but I think another car was sold to Miroux, a belgian Datsun dealer and racingdriver.

I don't believe the Miroux brothers ever owned a genuine ex-Works rally Z (?). Certainly the period photos of their cars that I have seen show cars that were not ex-Works examples.


Nice to have you participating in this thread. I would like to hear more from you. :)

Yep, that's right!

After the Monte Carlo Rally (1972?) somebody in Japan decided four or five workscars should stay in Europe. Nobody knows why but that's how these exotic rallycars ended up in Zandvoort, Holland. The evidence of the pressence of these cars in Zandvoort had been on the roads for several weeks because all the cars still were on spikes !
One of the cars was collected by Tony Fall who drove a rally-Z in England and needed the car for spares.
Another was sold to a MD who allready had several nice cars like a Tomaso Pantera and the Honda S800 Rob Janssen drove (in 1969?).
I am not sure anymore but I think another car was sold to Miroux, a belgian Datsun dealer and racingdriver.
At least one of the cars was changed into a racing car and driven by Rob Janssen.

This is i think the right information exept from the year , i personel think this was 1971 , two cars got Dutch registration plates in 1971 and where entered by Datsun Nederland in several WRC rallys , by jan 1972 the FIA banned the use of glasfibre body pannels like doors bonnet and bootlid , and 1971RAC rally was the last entry from Datsun Nederland with a 240z in rallys , there is a promotion film from the RAC with this car .

the modelcar is ready

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/2008_10060003.jpg

http://www.ten-tenths.com/http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/2008_10060003.jpg

more pic's here

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=916020

A small article in Autovisie 47/1971:
"Janssen and Dik will start at the RAC rallye. They drive a Datsun 240Z which has been prepared with lots of troubles in Rob's Zandvoort garage. At the TAP rallye their rallye 240Z was badly damaged by another competitor;parts from this car were used to transform Rob's circuit car (with which he drove some races this season in the " special" category) into a rallye car for the British round.
Early december they will also take part in the adventurous Ethiopian Highland rallye.

the modelcar is ready

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/2008_10060003.jpg

http://www.ten-tenths.com/http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/2008_10060003.jpg

more pic's here

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=916020
that looks lovely. There is still a transfer missing!!!!! It goes on the doors just above the door handles
PM me your address and I will send you an original. I am not sure how you would shrink it down to fit but I am sure that you will find a way

A small article in Autovisie 47/1971:
".........They drive a Datsun 240Z which has been prepared with lots of troubles in Rob's Zandvoort garage. At the TAP rallye their rallye 240Z was badly damaged by another competitor;parts from this car were used to transform Rob's circuit car (with which he drove some races this season in the " special" category) into a rallye car for the British round........."


Something not quite adding up there....

First of all, Janssen/Dik drove '67-54-RU' on the 1971 RAC Rally, which was actually an ex-Works rally car - originally registered on the Japanese 'carnet plate' of 'TKS 33 SA 987' - which had been driven by Tony Fall / Mike Wood on the 1971 TAP Rallye.

Janssen/Dik had an accident on the 1971 TAP Rallye whilst they were driving '67-58-RU', which also was an ex-Works rally car - originally registered on the Japanese 'carnet plate' of 'TKS 33 SA 988'.

The mention of "...Rob's circuit car...." being prepared for rallying ".....with lots of troubles..." is slightly odd. Janssen/Dik used 'TKS 33 SA 987' ( on Dutch registration '67-54-RU' after the Japanese carnet expired ) on the 1971 RAC Rally......... So it was already a rally car.

At what point in 1971 was one of these two ex-Works rally cars prepared as a "circuit car"? I think one of them eventually went on to do some circuit work, but in 1971 both cars were still very much as they were in their Works rally guise.

Is this a clue to some ( Dutch ) registration plate switching, or is it a red herring from a journalists' mistake?

z-spec, care to comment? :)

more pic's from the Rob Jansen's time

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/reclame.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/reclame2.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/1973.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y228/haman132/jansen1974.jpg

Take a look on this website: http://www.datsuncherry.ch/pressinf.htm

It shows some very interesting tuning brochures. It even has some of Janspeed online! As well as information from the German Datsun tuning firm 'Nippon Speed Car'. Very interesting stuff as well on the photos page.

Something not quite adding up there....

At what point in 1971 was one of these two ex-Works rally cars prepared as a "circuit car"? I think one of them eventually went on to do some circuit work, but in 1971 both cars were still very much as they were in their Works rally guise.


The car was entered and raced by Rob at the Easter races (in the libre/sportscar/prototype race) early in 1971.

The car was entered and raced by Rob at the Easter races (in the libre/sportscar/prototype race) early in 1971.

That emphasises the point I was trying to make: It seems extremely unlikely that such a car could be circuit-style modified 'from being a rally car' ( and an ex-works rally car at that ) and then back into an ex-works rally car, inbetween the 1971 Monte Carlo Rallye and the 1971 TAP Rallye.

Both the ex-works rally cars ( both were ex-1971 Monte Carlo Rallye connected ) that Datsun Netherlands were involved with during 1971, and which were driven by both Janssen and Fall ( both cars on the 1971 TAP, and then Janssen on the 1971 RAC in the ex-Fall 1971 TAP car ) were busy being rally cars during 1971. The story that one of these cars became a circuit car temporarily early in 1971 seems extremely unlikely. Even if it was true, you'd have to say that it must have still looked a bit like a rally car whilst it was on the circuit, and then still a little bit like a circuit car when it took part again in a rally........

For me, it seems clear that wires got ( are still getting? ) crossed, and that there are more cars in this story than people originally seemed to believe. But there are only two ex-works rally cars in the story as far as I can tell, and they were both doing serious international rallies during 1971. The Janssen 1971 circuit car must surely have been built up from a standard road car, despite the stories.

Anyone care to comment on that?

I wouldn't say the circuit car would have been extensively modified (unlike the 1972 car); it might be that Janssen just entered his rallye car on racing wheels. The libre/sports/prototype class (with no GT class!) was really a very thin field of very different cars and classes (and no championship).

PZR , I think the car #20 with the white wheels in post #60 , must be one of the works rally cars regarding to the early style body , rally style windscreen washers and early type over fenders , this is probably 1972 ?

I wouldn't say the circuit car would have been extensively modified (unlike the 1972 car); it might be that Janssen just entered his rallye car on racing wheels. The libre/sports/prototype class (with no GT class!) was really a very thin field of very different cars and classes (and no championship).

Yes, I agree. And the photos that I have seen of the car at that time seem to confirm that it was in full rally mode, but simply stripped of most of its stickers and logos.

In which case, I wonder why the talk of work in Janssen's workshop and all the 'difficulty' in circuit preparation.......? Surely the truth would be that - during 1971 - he did very little to prepare the car to a circuit-bias spec? 1972 was a different story.

PZR , I think the car #20 with the white wheels in post #60 , must be one of the works rally cars regarding to the early style body , rally style windscreen washers and early type over fenders , this is probably 1972 ?

Yes, I agree. It has enough tell-tale details to point to it being the ex-Works rally car that we think it is, and in the 1972 season circuit racing guise that would be quite difficult to reverse.

And we agree as to which of those two ex-1971 Monte works cars it actually started life as, yes? :)

I'd say the #20 car is from 1972 - it raced in exactly that form in the 1972 Euro GT championship. So the 1971 car might have been even less modified...

car number 20 pic are from advertising of 1973 magazine's

PZR , I think the car #20 with the white wheels in post #60 , must be one of the works rally cars regarding to the early style body , rally style windscreen washers and early type over fenders , this is probably 1972 ?

The nr.20 car is one of the first racecars because the "real" racecar had Bilstein shockabsorbers instead of Koni's.

The first Z Rob ever drove on Zandvoort (just for fun) was an original rally car. The only thing he took of were the extra lamps from the frontfender. Even the crashguard under the car was still fitted. The car was also still on roadtires (no slicks) and suffered from terrible body-roll and understeer which very suddenly changed in massive oversteer (especially in fast corners such as Scheivlak, Tunnel Oost en Bos uit).
I cannot recall wether they used a rally-car to change into a race-car or a normal roadcar. I do remember the cars they used for the racecars were completely stripped and built from scratch and I cannot imagine they used a rallycar for this purpose.