Brabham BT35

Bryan

BT30-15 some clarification is at hand. The Salisbury BT35 is a different car. Salisbury races the BT30 at the Boxing Day '71 meeting at Brands. I think that this is the car that goes to Martin Webb. The BT35 is retained by Gerard until '73 then Harry Gilbert. 1975 John Wingfield, 1976 John Thistlethwaite for Tim Wood

Chris

The ex-Gerard/Salisbury BT35 was regularly raced by Nick Overall in HSCC events late ‘80s/early ‘90s

Chris/David.

Is it to much to believe that David McKinney's report of BT30-15 as now with Bob Salisbury, is this perhaps the same Robert[Bob] Salisbury ex. Gerrard.????

Had only last night after posting , decided that the Salisbury BT30 and BT35 would be two seperate entities, purely down to the wording of one adv. in period, which I revisited. So I will seperate the BT35 out .

Thank You Bryan.

Despite Andrew Fellowes champing at the bit in Surfers Paradise re. BT36's , I will list what I can for BT35's 1st. as they are well entwined .

BT35 , this is all I have on all cars , and have listed F3's that I have info. on , it may assist some one somewhere.

BT35-1 , F3 , Race Cars International, Brendan McInerny 25-3-1971 p.35 , to Geog Pinhol[ portugese driver] , for sale A/S 28-10-1971.

BT35-2 , F3 , Colin Vanderwell 25-3-1971 p.35.

BT35-3 , F3 , Bernard Lagier [ French Brabham Importer ]

BT35-4 , F3 , Chris O'Brien [ Canadian in U.K. ].

BT35-5 , F3 , Jean Louis LaFosse [ French].

BT35-6 , F/A , Nicolas Cook Ford Twin-cam , at Snetterton 20-5-1971 p.31 , for sale 28-10-1971 p.63 , with a note , car to go to U.S.A. , car did return.

BT35-8 , F/A , new to Ed Reeves 24-3-1971 , with BDA , used 12 times that I can find in U.K. Yellow Pages Atlantic series , 10 x Reeves , 2 x Dave Morgan at end of year. Re-engined with a David Wood prepared 1800cc Cosworth BDE and won the 1st round of the new 2000cc F2 Championship at Mallory Park in March 1972.
Sold shortly after to Australians Crystal and John Millard and came to Aust. not run again untill 1976 , fitted with a Ford Twin-cam , and raced as an Aust. F2 including Australian G.P. Car sold to Denis Lupton of Melb. Aust. and dismantled and stored untill purchased by Bryan Miller 2-4-1999 less eng. , now rebuilt with correct Cosworth BDE and used 1st time in historics at Eastern Creek Sydney Sept. 2003.

BT35-9 , Nick Craw .

BT35-19 , reported with Mathews Collection U.S.A. 2003

BT35-30 , F3, Conny Anderson , Sweeden 10-6-1971 p.6

BT35-36 , F3 ?? , Advert. never raced , A/S 18-11-1971, car came to Aust. almost immeadiately , and is now with Brian Sampson of Melbourne.

BT35X-1 , ?? , Sir Nicholas Williamson , Cosworth FVC 1790cc, 1st. outing appears to be 17-4-1971 p.53, for sale 4-11-1971 p.46 , and changed hands to Iain McLaren a/s/ 6-4-1972 p.41.

BT35X-2 , Tony Griffiths , 5.0 litre Repco U.K. hills A/S 8-4-1971.
Car now with Mitsuo Usaba / Leaf Garage , Japan. chassis number confirmed again in email from Usaba to Andrew Fellowes and copied to me. Nov. 2003.

Other period cars with no numbers as yet.

BT35 , Fred Opert / Robertson in Canada sept. 1971
BT35 , Ray Folland in Canada sept. 1971
BT35 , Alan Lader in Canada , A/S 21-10-1971 p4.
BT35 , Maurice McGraig ''''''''''''''''''''''''.
BT35 , Gray Mickel in U.K. hills A/S 30-3-1972 p.44 , note as brand new for hills in 1972.
BT35 , For Jimmy Fuller with at T/C used at Guyana , Fuller from Antigua.
BT35 , Gerrard / Salisbury till 1973, then to Harry Gilbert,1975 John Wingfield, 1976 John Thistlethwaite for Tim Wood , by late 1980's early 1990's Nick Overall.

MRE have a car for sale advertised as BT35 converted to F2 specs. A/S 20-4-1972 p.57.

Bryan.

OK Bryan, one day we'll get to the 36's (cart horse before the Lord Mayors Show?)

BT35X-1, now with Chris Roden, Hampshire. UK (VSCC forum; www.vscc.co.uk/default.asp)

Andrew

I've been reading this thread with great interest, but haven't chipped in until now as I had nothing to add. But I would like to say that I was really pleased to read that the ex-Dave Morgan BT35 is alive and well and in such good hands. I'm something of a Morgan fan (you'd never know, would you) so that really made my day. I did actually see the car race at Oulton in 1971 with Ed Reeves at the wheel, I may still have details of the race results somewhere, so if I can find them I'll let you know how it got on that day. Thanks for starting this Bryan - fascinating stuff.

Ian Senior

Davemorganfan I saw BT35-8 at Eastern Creek, Bryan has put it in period trim & it now looks quite stunning.

BT35/3
Nick Reed in HSCC events 1999

BT35/6
I have Cook in this car again in 1972
Car was in the Netherlands in the early ‘90s

BT35/7
Not on your list. I have it as the Fred Opert/Sandy Shepard car
Campaigned since 1995 by Sid Hoole, Duncan Dayton etc

BT35/28
Swiss hillclimb car 1971, Euro F3 1972-73
Lincoln Small UK -88-94
Nick Overall for sale 1997

BT35/35
for sale in Gloucestershire 1990/91

BT35/44
This is the number I have for the Mickel hillclimb car
Other owners on UK hills throughout the ‘70s
Fred Edwards in HSCC events -88-92

BT35X/2
I have a note that despite its number this car is really a BT36 (for what that’s worth)

Some more unknowns from the early years:

•Mike Hawley UK hillclimbs 1971 (t/c) and 1972 (FVA)
Tony Harrison 1973, David Render 1974-75

•Bob Marsland FAt 1972, Euro hillclimbs and Nivelles F2 1973

•Rob Turnbull UK hillclimbs from 1973

*Ronnie Mackay in Scotland 1973

•Mike Hall US FB late 1971

•Bertil Roos FB early 1973 (no doubt an Opert car)

•Ric Forrest Canadian FB 1973

•Mike Gill in the Caribbean 1973 - ex-Fuller?

I owned BT35X-2 after my BT30. It ended up with a BDA engine and was used by Shaun Mooney in Euro F2. Tony Griffiths I beleive ordrered and received a BT30 but as it was to be used on the "hills" it was designated an "X" No by Brabhams. I also owned the BT30X It was basically a modified BT23 fitted with 23 Bodywork to take the 2 Litre V8 Climax. It was later fitted with a Buick and even later was "cloned" into 2 Cars.

Before I venture to BT36 territory , sorry Andrew , I needed to advise a few things.

The Mike Lawrence book , of which Ron T. was quite complimentary about to me at Eastern Creek a few weeks ago has production lists , I also have , which Mike probably used , thought Ron T. 3 very large sheets apparently commisioned by Bernie E. some time after he purchased Brabhams, and these sheets , painstakingly done in hand , give details in regard to model number , production volume , tracks , wheelbases , fuel tankage ,etc.etc.
Mostly appears the same in the Lawrence book.

If we take the production figures for the cars we are discussing , we get .

BT35 ,

BT35A , 1971 , 3 off , Atlantic. inboard rear brakes , which is exactly BT35-8's specs. except from new with BDA , not twin-cam as per Lawrence.
Also the plate on mine is simply BT35-8 , no mention of an ''A ''

BT35B , 7 off , as FormulaB/Atl. in Lawrence book , but only as Formula B in the sheets.

BT35C , 27 off, as F3 .

BT35X , 4 off , all as hillclimb cars and all with 4 gall fuel tanks.
Two are listed as Ford Twin-cam .
One as Cosworth FVC.
One as 5.0 Repco .

O.K . the last 2 we know about , but I suggest at least one of the first 2 will be the Mike Hawley car , also Lawrence states the 5.0 Repco car was McDowells, do we all agree this is incorrect and he is referring to the BT36X.

Has anybody ever heard or seen ref. to a BT35X -3 , OR -4 , or were they not numbered as such.

Ted , who owns the two cars, i.e one correct and one clone.?????

Bryan.

I saw Hawley's BT35-FVA in hillclimbs in 1972, and although I noted the chassis no., the info. is not with me, but approx. 100 miles away at my parent's house.... so sometime around Christmas I'll hopefully be able to give it.

1 more located;

BT35-33 Mathews Collection (as well as 35-19 as listed above)

David.

I just checked my post and have BT35X-1 to Iain McLaren via an A/S report 6-4-1972 p.41.
The report reads , Scottish hillclimb Championship 25-3-1972.
I quote '' Biggest and most exciting changes were in the single seater classes, with Gray and Agnes Mickel fielding a spotless and brand new white Brabham BT35 with a Mike Hawley engine to challenge last years champion Iain McLaren , now wielding the ex. Nick Williamson BT35X in it's former owners colours.''

So did McLaren have another one a bit later for the 1973 season.????? Question to me.

Bryan.

I don't have any problem with McLaren having two cars - BT35X/1 in 1972 and BT36/10 in 1973 (which is what my records say)

To anybody following this thread , I just loved the F1R REASON why a certain driver did not appear in his BT35 BDA at the Nurburgring round of the F2 C/ship 29-4-1973.
Entrant R. James .. Drv. Roy James , DNS. driver in prison.

Bryan.

More updates.

BT35X-2 , still in the hands of Tony Griffiths as at Bouley Bay h.c. 3-8-1972.A/S p.39.

However by 24-5-1973 , car now in the hands of John Cussins and renamed the ' Saxon Hawk Special ', A/S p.53

The Mike Hawley BT35 Hart FVA car , which may be an X no. is reported as just acquired by Tony Harrison , A/S 5-4-1973.
The above car is described in one race report only as a BT35X, Great Auclum H.C. A/S 10-8-1972.

Confirmed Harry Gilbert in ex. Salisbury BT35 , which is said , that before Croft 21-6-1973 A/S p.32, he had not driven.

Also confirmed that at the virtually same time as Martin Webb in his ex. Gerrard BT30 FVA at S/stone sprints , 2-11-1972 , Robert Salisbury is offering for sale the BT35. A/S 23-11-1972.

Bryan.

Same issue, BT35 Hart-BDA, chassis no. 44 - Mickel

Ref. BT35's. I met Peter Kaye at several events, he had a BT35X/FVA in 1977 and won the UK 1.6L hillclimb championship that year. Not sure on the chassis number.

Ian

Peter Kaye's car was BT35X/1

Am going to get some of the easier cars out of the way,at least up to the end of 1976 , as by then the trails are just about dead. Not in any order.

BT35X-2 ,Tony Griffiths as a Hillclimb specialty car 5.0 Litre Repco , used all through 1971 and 1972.

To John Cussins , A/S 4-1-1973 , p.32.
To John Cussins and Malcolm Dungworth A/S 18-4-1974.
14-nov.1974 p.57 Cussins advertises car for sale.
To Malcolm Dungworth 13-3-1975, {Cussins gets Chevron B32}
18-3-1976 , Dungworth still using car , and still 24-6-1976 A/S p.58.
Advertised by M. Dungworth [ Waring and Gillow Racing }
A/S. sept. 23 1976 , p.54.

Now as advised in Japan , Leaf Garage.

Bryan.

BT35X-1 , ??? not confirmed unlike previous.

The only other I am able to find is A/S. with a report from a Rufforth meeting 26-4-1973 p.41 , that George Dixon has purchased the ex. Nick Williamson/ Iain McLaren BT35X , and is fitting car with a BRM Twin-cam.

Nothing further, but many adverts could be this car as time goes by, but no definate trail.

Bryan.

No, I have nothing on Overall in this car in 1975 either, though he did race the ex-Salisbury BT35 about ten years later.

BT35X/1 Robert Sunderland and Peter Kaye 1974-75, then apparently Kaye alone for the next two years

BT35X/2 Malcolm Dungworth 1977, Terry Smith 1978

David .

Thank you , I have Sunderland and Kaye quite a few times in a BT35X , however I wasn't prepared to call out an entity , as I had no def. report of ex. Dixon.

So the advert. by Dungworth didn't work , and he gets to keep it a bit longer.

Bryan.

Re. BT35X-2 , now in Japan, this car is in the archives section of Race-cars.com as for sale some years ago.
States rebuilt by Simon Hadfield , only problem is ,the car has been rebuilt as a std. F2 with big bulgy side tanks etc. none of which it would have had in 5.0 litre hillclimb days, so another car looses it's true identity.

Bryan.

The table below is taken from my files of HSCC Pre ’71 entries & results. I have attempted to list which year driver & car first appeared. (I have no results for 1984 as I took that year off).
Can anyone add the missing chassis numbers to the following for me?

1985
BT35-? John Bryning, Silverstone.

1986
BT35-? Ray Mallock at Oulton, D.N.F
BT35-44 Fred Edwards, Thruxton
BT35-? Nick Overall, Silverstone

1987
BT35-? Nigel Fehler, Donington

1988
BT35-6 Keith Norman, Brands Hatch
BT35-28 Lincoln Small, Thruxton

I was trotting around paddocks with my little notebook throughout the period, but can't add as much as I hoped I might:

1985
BT35-? John Bryning, Silverstone.

1986
BT35-? Ray Mallock at Oulton, D.N.F
BT35-44 Fred Edwards, Thruxton
BT35-? Nick Overall, Silverstone - ex-Gerard/Salisbury, Wingfield etc

1987
BT35-? Nigel Fehler, Donington

1988
BT35-6 Keith Norman, Brands Hatch
BT35-28 Lincoln Small, Thruxton

David.

10 demerit points for not recording the ellusive BT35 /Gerrard /Salisbury chassis number.

Originally Andrew reported BT35 -? with Nick Overall in 1986, Then David reports that it is indeed ex. Gerrard /Salisbury car.
I have kept all sorts of snippets , and in Motor Sport May 1997 p.583 , Nick Overall has a colour advert. for BT35-28.
Much admired and raced in HSCC events,states the advert.

Could we have uncovered the Gerrard/ Salisbury BT35 ch.no.

Do we know where the car is now ?

Bryan.

If one reads all presented to one , one may make less mistakes.

Can we connect BT35-28 raced by Lincoln Small at Thruxton in 1988 to Nick Overall in 1986 , or to Nick Overall in Motor Sport adv. 1997 .

Bryan.

Although I guess Nick Overall may have raced more than 1 BT35, I have Overall in a BT35 1987-92, and Lincoln Small in BT35-28 1987-94, including:
Donington 13/9/92 Small & Overall at the same meeting in BT35s.

Also, in HSCC events:
In 1991, John Harper in BT35-35, and Nick Buttress in an unidentified car in 1993

Thanks, Thats filled another small gap or two but still leaves Overall/Small 35's in question.

I have a feeling that Ray Mallock might have been driving Brynings car at Oulton. I know that he did at Brands as John had a U2 as well and both cars were entered by his company Lithofast.

The Overall and Small cars were definitely different beasts and, as Jeremy says, often appeared in the same race. Overall was (is?) in the business of buying and selling old racing cars, which would explain his offering BT35-28 on behalf of Small (or perhaps a subsequent owner) in 1997.
I accept your demerit points for not discovering the no. of Overall’s car, Bryan, but you have to remember that I was at these meetings as a reporter, perhaps covering ten races in different classes, which meant a lot of people to get around (and races to watch). If I had time for my own pursuits, I might race around the paddock noting as many c/no’s as I had time for (starting with anything F1 and working down). If there was no plate on the instrument panel, or easily visible elsewhere, I would move on to the next car. I might sometime have taken the time to ask an owner, but the cars were often unattended.
Buttress’s 1993 car was the one Overall had been racing until then. I haven’t hard of it since.

David.

I should be doing exactly the same in my position of Hewland distributor at the current F3 championship races over here for all the Dallara's , however for exactly similar reasons I have to admit I am not.

BT35-28 , corrections if I am wrong please , but this appears to be the first time , when Lincoln Small appears at Thruxton in 1988 , that we have seen this chassis number reported.

Bryan.

I may have noted it in 1987 (he did race it that year)

David.

I went and looked at earlier post by yourself, as you were posting.

You reported in Swiss Hillclimbs 1971, Euro F3 in 1972-3, and Small 1988-1994, thence sale by Overall in 1997 .

So we have a long trail , I will have to do a complete rebuild on all the ch.nos. in our posts etc. so I don't make the same mistake again.
So we are still back to not having a ch.no. for Salisbury/ Gerrard car , and if you did not note it easily in the paddock, maybe the plate has gone A.W.O.L.

When I started this I was aware the BT35's were going to be a nuisance, but never did I think they would be so intertwined, and it appears more so now in Historic in 2000's

Andrew, this suggests that Lincoln Small had two cars at the same time, as you reported earlier Lincoln purchased BT30-16 via Ted Walker in 1986 and retains today.
Bryan.

If it helps, I have Small in the BT35 up to 1994, and the first time I saw him with BT30-16 was May 1995.

Jeremy.

Thank you, probably racing BT35 untill BT30 ready to re-enter the fray.

Small had the BT30 in 1994, though whether he raced it that year I'm not sure
Your "probabilty" theory isn't quite right, Bryan. He was a regular competitor in HSCC events with the BT35, and bought the BT30 to compete in the FIA European F2 series (though as I remember was never a regular competitor in it)
And before someone asks, the BT35 raced (once?) by Laurence Edscer in 1994 was Small's. It was also raced that year, still in Small's ownership, by someone whose name I didn't note - John someone?

Thanks David.

Re. BT35-6, in the course of my business I visited Autosport show 2001 at Birmingham , and on display was I am sure BT35-6 , it was either -6 or -10 , as I noted the car was 2 ch.no. away from mine.
I believe the owner was Keith Norman,the car was on display with an R.A.C. service unit , for the purpose of signing up new members.

Am I correct with the owner , still having the car at that time.????

Probable's and possible's just don't work do they.??
Bryan.

Interesting...
I have Norman's name against 35/6 in 1988, but then with Robert Haze in the Netherlands 1992-95-
Of course there are several possible explanations....

Certainly the car was at the show , and looking very correct, the name Keith Norman rang a bell , but I am now questioning my memory, the lady I spoke to advised that the car was looked after at race meetings primarily by R.A.C. service people.

David.

I have information in front of me that advises a BT35 in the U.K. has BT35-47 , complete with a correct 1972 AM number.
As we already know of BT35-44 in the U.K. , the Mickel car, which was stated to be brand new for the hills in March 1972 , we would at least in the case of BT35 series cars at least , obviously have more cars than either the Lawrence book or my Brabham sheets indicate.
In the case of the 35's , 41 cars off , and we certainly know of -44 , and I have no reason to disbelieve the -47 report , so discounting the usual -13 ch. no. we have what appears to be 46 entities at least in the BT35 series.

We will also have a few 'ring-ins ' via BT28's updated bodywork wise when the rules changed , the first car I can think of is the Tom Belso car, which in period was called a BT28/35 in the Atlantic series in 1971 , so if the car has lost it's ch.plate , or the subsequent owners didn't know or care , it could become a de-facto BT35 , I am not suggesting it did happen to that car , just a plausible scenario.

Bryan.

Hi Bryan,
Two more BT35's have shown up in US. Dave Erwin has BT35-41 and BT35-44 for sale both as rolling chassis. BT35-44 refered as a hillclimb car. BT35-41 as a FB car.
Regards
Ian

Ian.

Thanks for that.
BT35-44 is a hillclimb car ,the ex Agnes and Gray Mickel car from Scotland .
BT35-41 , I had another name against that , also in the US , back in the 90's , so fair chance that one was new to the US as a FB car in period , which is where the majority of BT29's would have gone as new as well.

I think I have heard the name Dave Erwin , is he a dealer.?

Bryan.

I think his name is spelled Dave Irwin and he's somewhere in the eastern US - Ohio or Virginia I think.

While I'm on the forum can anyone either help me or direct me within the forum to any discussions on the Ralt RT2 F2 and CanAm cars. I own one and have a brief history of all of them but would like to widen my input? Thx - Derek

Derek.

Thanks for that.
Re. Ralt RT2'S , there is a fair bit in the Irish Formula Atlantic Thread, which is on page 2 of the main historic forum , so scroll to bottom rh. corner and hit p2 .

Bryan.

All.

I had a look at the final results for the Euro F2 Series, and the following cars and drives are as below.

BT35 , Peter Shaw , U.K.
BT35 , Nick Read , U.K.
BT35 , Duncan Dayton , USA/UK , BT35-7 ??????????????
BT35 , Roy Walzer , ???.

Can anybody assist with identification.?

Bryan.

Hi Bryan and Chris,
Dave Irwin has a business in NE US and prepares historic cars, and deals in cars and parts.
Ref. Euro historic series, I can confirm (from 2000 visit to Sid Hoole) that Duncan Dayton has BT35-7 with/1.6L FI BDA (updated to BT36 specs) prepared by Sid Hoole. Also, BT35-? is with Sid Hoole, owned by Roy Waltzer and is also updated to BT36 specs w/FI 1.6L BDA. Nick Reed has BT35-3 in FA trim from a previous forum posting.
Ian

Trying to contact Nick Overall to find out ........ the Salisbury/Gerrard BT35 chassis number.
Ian

BT35-3 , Nick Read , I saw the report earlier re. him and this ch.no. but I wasn't aware in what series it was being used , it could have been the F3 series , I wrongly assumed ,as the car was when new to Bernard Lagier an F3 in period , that is was rebuilt in that form , guess not.

Bryan.

Hopping back to BT35s, I have Mike Hawley's car as BT35-35, noted at the 2 Harewood meetings in June & September 1972

Jeremy.

Thank you very much.

David McKinney has reported BT35-35 for sale in Gloucestshire in early 1990's , but no previous history .

So that should put another one to bed for a while, although I wonder where it is now.

Bryan.

I belive thet BT35-35 was reported with John Harper in 92/93 competing (Ref. reports in Historic racing magazine/David McKinney)in the Euro F2 historic series as either an F2 or FA car.
Other BT35's are still competing in the F2 Euro series, not sure which chassis numbers.
Ian

I also found another BT35 on the Brian Wilson brabham owner's website. Trevor Needham has BT35-26 for sale in the UK last year.
Also, another BT35 for sale on same brabham website, but no chassis no.Will try to find out some info.
Ian

Finnaly contacted Nick Overall and confirmed that BT35-28 is with Peter Shaw in UK. Also, BT35-? (ex Salisbury/Gerrad)is still with Nick Buttress, UK. Nick is looking for the chassis number.
Also, confirmed that Nick Overall raced BT36-#10 in the UK J-Brands F/Libre series for 75 season.
Ian

BT35-5 was still in France a few years ago, fitted with a wrong one litre Cosworth engine and non original nosecone, outboard rear brakes and wobbly wheels. Don't know current whereabouts.

BT35-6 belonged to Keith Norman, then was sold to Rob Haze in the Netherlands, then bought back by Norman.

BT35-9 with Peter Watts in 1998.

BT35-22 Martin Birrane in 1991, rebuilt as an F2 with FVA.
For what it is worth, FIA papers say:
Supplied new to Italy, F3 races, Fossati.
Siebenthal, Switzerland 1987.
UK 1989.
Peter Watts 1990.
Martin Birrane 1991.
Then sold/p-exed as a rolling chassis: Steve Pontin-Warltier.
Sold to Steve Worrad in 2000.
Confusing is that I was advised that BT35-22 was imported back to the UK from Switzerland in 1999 which does not match the above. 2 cars ?

BT35-26 was with Treveor Needham. If I remember well the car came from Sweden, but don't quote me on this.
BT35-26 advertised for sale in the USA recently. Same car ?

BT35-28 my notes say car was driven at Spa by Nick Read in 2000.

BT35-35 now in F3 trim.
For what it is worth, the FIA papers of the car mention the followng owners:
Mike Hawley 1971.
Bob Howling 1972.
Mike Sharott (Jamaica) 1972.
Back to UK: Peter Watts 1986 - 1987
John Harper

BT35-6 is for sale
BT35-9 Now in the States?

BT35-22 I have nothing on so its European travels are interesting indeed!!

I thought my old friend Trevor Needham had sold BT35-26, certainly he had it advertised on the Brabham page http://www.nvo.com/brabhams/carsforsalewanted/ in December 2000. So I imagine it could well have gone to the States.
Does he still race in historics?

phdm it would be useful to identify Sepps’ car wouldn’t it? I had not appreciated that it was to 36 spec. Very interesting.

Andrew

BT35-6 see www.qv500.com/brabham.htm

Trevor Needham now resides in France. Read he recently drove a G4.

phdm. Thank you very much and wellcome.
BT35-5 , would be the car that was on www.carclassic. about a year or more ago , that had the front wings bonded into the nose and at least one set of wheels old style wobblies.Also had incorrect front radiator / oil cooler set up.

BT35-6 , both David McKinney and I were correct , as it was Keith Norman's , went to Rob Haze in the Netherlands and then back to Keith Norman , who had it when I saw it at the Autosport show a few years ago, but David's last report was in Holland. Problem solved.

Bryan.

Originally posted by phdm

Trevor Needham now resides in France. Read he recently drove a G4.


Thanks for the info, explains why I couldn't get him at his old address!

At Trois Rivieres , 1977 , John Gloviak in Brabham - Hart Ford-BDA BT35. Bryan.

Further to Bryan's brief note about Brabhams at Trois Rivieres in 77 here is the list I have of Brabhams in Canadian and SCCA races 1972 - 76. This is very incomplete for SCCA and 72-74 in Canada

1972

Bill Eagles BT35
Al Justason BT35

1973

Bertil Roos BT35 [Opert] then a new BT40 [Opert]
Ric Forest BT35 probably from new, retained 1974

1974
Canada
Hugh Cree BT35

SCCA
Bill Cooper BT35
Joe Freeman BT35 retained 75
Dorsey Schroeder BT35

1975
Canada
Fred Beyer BT35

Anybody able to fit any of those into a pattern or offer connections?!!

Chris

I see I'm pretty late in getting involved here. First a brief intro:

My name is David Irwin, I owned a restoration shop, Lime Rock Motors for 15 years in Connecticut. I've restored about 15 Brabhams, have owned several and have vintage raced since 1989. Recently moved to Virginia, bought some property where I'm putting up a small shop (3200 sq. ft.) while I work for ProtoType Technology Group restoring vintage racing BMW's owneds by BMW of N.A.

Here are some Brabham's I've had contact with:


BT35-26 Needham car TwinCam/MK8, sold to Walt Pawlick.... 2003, Walt told me he was installing a FT200. Wanted to sell or sold the car in 2003.

BT35-41 Log Book back to 1973 shows David Ralston 1973 to 1974, sold to John and Thomas Gloviak 1974 to 1982. Log book shows Formula B with Hart 1600, (2 or 4 valve?), Gloviaks were making some suspension mods, didn't finish, thank goodness, sold to Gene Frings, car just sat, sold to present owner David Irwin 2002 with BDD/FT200.

BT35-44 AM#71 64 ( CL ) Original owner Gray Mickel, 1971, F2 spec car w/ Hart TwinCam (2 or 4 Valve?), changed to FVC. Sold to Rob Turnball 1975. Sold to Fred Edwards 1985, raced Historics 1985 to 1991, restoration not complete 1998?, sold to present owner David Irwin 2001, less engine/FT200.

Hope this helps fill in some gaps for you. Keep up the good work, this info should help many in the future. David Irwin

Dave I may be a Rookie on this forum but I would like to say a Warm Welcome!

& what a sensational first post!

Andrew

How very forward of me to turn David into Dave, My apologies.

Andrew

Thanks for your input David
According to my notes, BT35-44 went from Gray and Agnes Mickel to Jim Cambell 1974-78 and Chris Dowson 1980 before Fred Edwards
Rob Turnbull had BT35-6, ex-Nicholas Cook, 1973-74; its subsequent history is traceable
Did Turnbull buy 44 as a replacement for 6? In which case what was the Campbell/Dowson car?
Or might the US records of 44’s UK history be suspect?

David.

Very warm wellcome from Australia.
Thank you for your input, will help to sort out some US cars.

Regards Bryan.

Yeah, it probably is nice and warm in Australia. Cold and snowy here.

The information on BT35-44 came from Ted Walker and Fred Edwards FIA papers.

I do know of other 29,30,35's,and maybe a 36 in the US.

David

As we seem to be slipping down the page , and this is a no-no.

Two more cars , both with Ian Rimmer in the U.K.

BT28-32 , F3
BT35-15 , or what from the evidence to hand must surely be this number. Also an F3.

Best to list it as found in extremely original condition , appears to be ex Italian car all it's life, which from the total lack of updating etc. may have been very short, and the car just sat around until purchased buy Ian.

Bryan.

Re-the Jimmy Fuller BT35. I have an Antigua contact who saw it race in Guyana (against Dave Brodie Chevron) who may be able to help with info. Would current contact for J.Fuller also be of use?

A/S Oct 15th, 1970 p.15
Tony Griffiths has an ad for BT29X to full BT30 spec. for sale.
Did he drive a BT29 & a BT30 in 1970?

Annnnd…, how many Brabhams did he have please?

BT29X and BT30X2 and BT35X2, or have I made a real stuff up on my notes?


Andrew

Andrew,

The BT29 and BT30 share the same engine cover. The BT29 has a fiberglass undertray (no side bulge) with the fuel cell behind the seat. The BT30 has fiberglass sidepods with fuel cells located inside. BT30 side pods are the same as BT36. Most BT35's had aluminum side tanks with fiberglass contoured ends, fore and aft.

David Irwin

Andrew. As I think I said in an earlier post Tony Griffiths destroyed his BT29X at Silverstone. Brabhams replaced the chassis with a BT30 one. The car still carries its BT29 Plate BT29X-37. Tony ran this car on the hills with an FVC engine.He re-placed this car with BT35X-2 that was fitted with a Repco V8 for the 72 season. I later owned this car when it had a Rover engine installed and sold it to Shaun Mooney,who had it fitted witha BDA by Simon Hadfield.

BT35-8 .

Fuel tanks ,front and rear fibreglass end pieces , but the rubber bag tanks sit inside STEEL main side tanks , which bolt up by 10/32 bolts in 12 seperate positions , two top and two bottom in the centre to a wide strap piece which is part of the vertical square section top to bottom tube, and the top and bottom at front and rear to triangular gussetts , in the corners of vertical/horizontal main chassis rails.

Strangely I was advised a long time ago , that the steel requirement , as opposed to alloy , was a requirement to meet U.S.A regs.

By the way they bolt up , the tanks would certainly add stiffness to the chassis, replacing the std. arrangement of diagonals.

Can we have any more details possible on the Guyana car please.

Bryan.

Originally posted by Ted Walker
. I later owned this car when it had a Rover engine installed and sold it to Shaun Mooney,who had it fitted witha BDA by Simon Hadfield.

Ah! some memory cells are awakening, -thank you Ted!

Andrew

Bryan,

You are right, STEEL side tanks on BT35's, and bolted as you describe.
Thanks for the correction. David

I feel we are really starting to get somewhere now.

Information just faxed to me from Ian Rimmer in the U.K. thanks Ian.

On a Motor Racing Developments letterhead dated 22nd March 1972 , and signed by Ralph Bellamy as Chief Designer .
The following.

The rollover bars on the following racing cars comply to FIA Specification , article 297 of the FIA regulations 1972.

BT35/48
BT35/49
BT35/50
BT35/51
BT35/52 , the last added in pencil.

So now we are looking for even more of these critters.
As up to now the last we had was BT35-44, and I have a seperate note re. a BT35-47

Bryan.

Bryan,
Reference the 1972 MRD letter on BT35's up to #52. My BT36-10 has an updated rollover bar with horizontal head rest barand support plate. I assume that is the new FIA reg. arcticle 297 that was required in 72. I am wondering if these BT35's (#48-#52)would be F3 cars req. FIA compliance?

BT35-10 (with wrong wing) is currently for sale on Ebay.
See: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&category=6737&item=2457714353&sspagename=STRK%3AMEBWA%3AIT
Has anyone got further information on this car ?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&category=6737&item=2457714353&sspagename=STRK%3AMEBWA%3AIT

phdm.

Thank you , I have nothing on BT35-10 , given underneath all the incorrect add ons , it looks like it may be a proper FB car from new , I have one name associated with the car , but that is 1990's and only in the USA.

Bryan.

A little extension of BT35s in Canada FB series

In 1971 June [Edmonton]
we have
Al Justason and Tom Morre in BT35s.
So these are cars with original owners I guess.
[Justason retains his in 72]

By the Mont Tremblant race in July we also have
Brian Robertson in an Opert BT35 [perhaps also raced at Edmonton]
and Maurice McCaig in a BT35

Chris

Thanks Chris.

That reminded me to go look at my earlier post on some of these.
So, Al Justason into 1972.
Tom Moore June 1971 ,

July, Mt Tremblant , Opert/ Robertson , still in Sept 1971.
July as above Maurice McCraig.

Sept, 1971 Ray Folland .
Oct. 1971 , Alan Lader
Oct. 1971 , Maurice McCraig.
One would suspect BT35-10 will be one of these, but which.?

BT35's , It is not that I have a preference for them, just fascination.

If we assume [ bad I know ] , that we are trying to sort out at least 51 cars, BT35-1 to BT35-52 , less BT35-13 .

Lets see where we are , in regards either a report in period or current.
Corrections happily taken.

BT35-1 TO BT35-10 all mentioned in despatches.
BT35-11/12/14 nothing.
BT35-15 , Prob Ian Rimmer U.K.
BT35-16/17/18 , nothing
BT35-19 USA.
BT35-20/21 , nothing.
BT35-22 UK.
BT35-23 Nothing
BT35-24 I believe in US.
BT35-25 nothing.
BT35-26 USA.
BT35-27 I believe USA.
BT35-28 UK
BT35-29 nothing
BT35-30 Sweden 1971
BT35-31 and 32 poss. same owner in USA.
BT35-33 Mathews US.
BT35-34 nothing
BT35-35 UK. in 1990's
BT35-36 Aust. since 1972.
BT35-37/38/39/40 nothing.
BT35-41 U.S.
BT35-42 / -43 nothing
BT35-44 now US.
BT35-45 /46 nothing
BT35-47 U.K.
BT35-48/49/50/51/52 nothing.

Two we dont know about are a BT35 F3 in a Swiss museum, advised by phdm privately, and Maverick motorsport have a pretty sad looking basket case for sale on racecarsdirect.

Have I missed any.????

I would think that a few will still be lurking around in sad states or totalled in Italy, probably old F3's, and quite a few went to Sweden in period.

I expect all the gaps filled in by morning please.
Bryan.

Some more digging in Canadian race results for 1973 gives us the following updates on Brabhams

At Westwood, 27th May 1973
BT35s
Scott Mackenzie
Cam MacKenzie
Al Justason

At Edmonton Scott Mackenzie hurts himself in a shunt and the car passes later in the season to Rick Forest [who wins at Gimli R6, and places 2nd at Mosport, R7]

At Debert, R5, Roos races an Opert BT35, but at Mosport R7, he has a new BT40

Chris

Suppose I had better add a little confusion to the debate:o

I am the proud owner of BT35X-1, the late Sir Nicholas Williamson's hillclimb car.

I found the bits rusting away in the shed of a house that was being cleared, following a tip off from an acquaintance; the poor car was in a bit of a state as you can see from the pics.

I acquired the car along with a spare space frame and a few other bits. I can’t remember the number of the other space frame for certain, but I think it might have been BT35-17. I swapped this space frame, for bits that I needed to rebuild BT35X-1, with a chap who planned to rebuild it into a complete car, although I don’t know for certain if he actually did.

The spare space frame had been much modified at some point, the top rails of the engine bay were tapered quite sharply towards the rear of the car, rather than being parallel as they are on X1, and the engine mounts were quite different. I don’t know what engine had been used in this car but it certainly was not one of the ubiquitous Ford derivatives. All of the running gear of this car had been used in the construction of a space framed Mk1 Escort special saloon race car, which I also acquired at the time, and still own.

During the rebuild of BT35X-1 I started a dialogue with Sir Nicholas and I retain the letters that he wrote to me on the subject. The plan was to re-unite him with the car once it was finished. Sadly he passed away before the car was complete.

I am rather busy with other activities these days, but sooner or later I will re-unite the car with the hills it was built to compete on.

And this

and another:

...er

Chris Roden I saw one of your posts on the VSCC forum, how nice to see you here. -and photos as well!

Hi Chris,
Please could you confirm the chassis plate number for your BT35X. I am not sure if the correct format is BT35X-#XX?
Ian

Originally posted by HENDERZSON
Hi Chris,
Please could you confirm the chassis plate number for your BT35X. I am not sure if the correct format is BT35X-#XX?
Ian

Certainly, I will check when I next pay her a visit, could be a few days....

Chris.
Thank you for showing your car in the before and after stages.
Out of research , do the steering arms attach to the front uprights via 1 x 3/8'' bolt and 2 x 1/4'' bolts , or are there 3 x 1/4'' bolts holding the steering plates to the uprights. Mine and Ian Henderson's both have 2 x 1/4''.

I think , but stand corrected that the BT35 and BT36 had the latter , and the earlier cars the 3 x 1/4'' , or possibly this was a full conversion to 20'' front tyres.

Anybody know.???

Good to see you also recieved the lovely alloy firebomb bracket.
Did you get the alloy tube that carries the wiring loom front to rear.??

Bryan.

Chris .

Re. the other chassis , any more info on where it came from and went to would certainly assist.
If it was BT35-17 , I have absolutely nothing against that no.

Any one have any clues.???

Bryan.

Hi Chris,
I did see your BT35X twice in 1977 at hillclimb events driven by Peter Kaye. He won the UK 1.6L hillclimb championship that year with the car. FVA engine and some special front bodywork and later style rear wing.
Ian

Interestingly , I was just looking at an advert. M.R.E. inside front cover Autosport 27/1/1972.
For Sale .
1] BT35 Holbay R71 ex Brendan McInery, which should make that BT35-1 , which went to Gerge Pinhol, and for sale again 28-10-1971 , and now again for sale Jan 1972.
3]ex. Randy Lewis BT35.

Regards Bryan.

Just surfing, I remember a BT35 in West Aus raced by Dominic Mannello & true to his heritage it ran a Fiat twin cam. This was mid 70s.

Cavvy,

The Dominic Mannello car is a BT35/36 bodied rebuild of the ex Fred Wheelhouse BT23 type Jane /Repco car from Victoria , car is now owned ,still in Western Australia by Neil McCrudden.

Bryan Miller.

I've been working through this thread identifying Sprint BT35s.

The ones I can't identify are:

Brabham-Ford BDA BT35 (1.6) - Tim Painter once in 1977 (shared with Andy Fraser?)
Brabham-Ford BDA BT35 (1.6) - Andy Fraser once in 1977 (shared with Tim Painter?)
Brabham-Cosworth BDE BT35 (2.0) - Bob Marsland once in 1973

The BT35s should fit into our histories but I haven't been able to connect them. Thanks

Allen

Currently awaiting replies on the following:

a) Tim Painter/Andy Fraser BT35 sprinted in 1977

b) Chris Seaman's Brabham 'whatever' which he still owns

Will post results as soon as they appear in my in tray :cool:

The correct chassis number for the BT35 sprinted and hillclimbed by.....
Rob Turnbull, Andy Fraser and Tim Painter is BT35-06
This information has come from Marcus Pye who compiled the FIA forms for the car.

Hope tha closes another loop hole. :cool:

Are you still looking for information on the Jimmy Fuller BT35? I saw 8mm cine film of it racing in Guyana in 1972 when I was in Antigua last week (and Jimmy drove past in his Evo7 when we were in the baggage check in queue at the airport!).

I have ben doing another trawl through and noticed there is a heck of a lot of incredible detail especially about F2 cars/chassis numbers/entrants etc.

I assume ('Never Assume') you all have access to this information? :unworthy:


PS Guess what - It's :Snow:

PS Guess what - It's :Snow:

Ummm, Steve your are welcome to it, unless its on top of a nice hill with plenty of pubs, then thats another matter.

29C here today, -it was over 40C last week, Happy Festive Season to all,

Bryan I am looking forward to your visit, which expensive hotel would you like to eat at, -after passing my car for its C of D and Log Book?

Steve ,

Having another trawl through ?????? please enlighten us poor Colonials .

Anuauto , thanks that is the car I saw at Autosport Int. a few years ago on the AA stand , nearly a sister to my BT35-8 .

Some months ago BT35-10 was for sale by bidding on ebay in the U.S.A. the link has now closed , does anybody have a contact to find out what happened to the car.?????????

Andrew , what do you mean which expensive hotel , ALL of course, plus spending money at the Casino naturally.

Bryan.

Bryan,

Re BT35-10, if you look at my message to you last March, I had proposed to send you pictures of the car obtained from the seller. As I was mentioning, lots of details were wrong on this car. If you want, I can look in my records for the details of the dealer. I can still send you the pics. I had made an offer for the car but it was not accepted. I don't know what happened afterwards. Send me your email address by private message and let me what you want me to do.

Regards.

phdm

PHDM,

Thank you message on the way.

Bryan.

Scottish Hillclimb Championship Events:
1972 Kinkell 25/03 Gray Mickel 1st; Agnes Mickel 6th
1972 Doune 30/04 Gray Mickel 6th; Agnes Mickel 10th
1972 Fintray 13/08 Gray Mickel 2nd; Agnes Mickel 3rd
1972 Kinkell 07/10 Gray Mickel 1st; Agnes Mickel 7th=
1973 Kinkell 24/03 Gray Mickel 3rd=
1973 Doune 17/06 Gray Mickel 8th
1973 Fintray 08/07 Gray Mickel 3rd; Agnes Mickel 4th
1973 Fintray 19/08 Gray Mickel 1st; Agnes Mickel 2nd
1973 Kinkell 13/10 Gray Mickel 3rd; Agnes Mickel 10th
1974 Rumster 26/05 Jim Campbell 7th
1974 Fintray 11/08 Jim Campbell 4th
1974 Rumster 25/08 Jim Campbell 2nd
1974 Kinkell 06/10 Jim Campbell 9th
1975 Kinkell 23/03 Jim Campbell 5th
1975 Doune 27/04 Jim Campbell 3rd
1976 Rumster 30/05 Jim Campbell 4th
1976 Fintray 27/06 Jim Campbell 2nd
1976 Fintray 08/08 Jim Campbell 2nd
1976 Kinkell 16/10 Jim Campbell 1st
1977 Kinkell 20/03 Jim Campbell 1st
1977 Doune 24/04 Jim Campbell 2nd
1977 Rumster 29/05 Jim Campbell 2nd
1977 Doune 19/06 Jim Campbell 10th
1977 Fintray 26/06 Jim Campbell 1st
1977 Fintray 07/08 Jim Campbell 1st
1977 Rumster 28/08 Jim Campbell 2nd
1977 Kinkell 09/10 Jim Campbell 2nd
1978 Doune 23/04 Jim Campbell 4th
1978 Rumster 29/05 Jim Campbell 3rd
1978 Fintray 18/06 Jim Campbell 4th
1978 Doune 25/06 Jim Campbell 9th
1978 Fintray 06/08 Jim Campbell 1st
1978 Rumster 27/08 Jim Campbell 2nd
1978 Kinkell 14/10 Jim Campbell 2nd
1978 Scottish Hillclimb Champion - Jim Campbell

The car was then sold on.

In 1979 there was a Brabham in the Scottish Championship run by Ron Cumming, could this have been BT35-44? :s

I have the Brabham BT35-35 of Mike Hawley going first to:

Tony Harrison - 1973

And then:

David Render for 1974/75/76

Can't pick up its trail after Render but will keep digging.

:cool:

BT35-6 I have this chassis passing through the following:

1974 until 1976 Rob Turnbull

1977 Andy Fraser/Tim Painter

The car then is sold on out of the National Hillclimb and Sprint arena. :cool:

35-44 I remember well when Fred Edwards from Warboys in Cambridgeshire had it.
Where is it now?

Didn't Harper end up with 35-35 in '91?

Andrew,

BT35-44 , the ex Gray and Agnes Mickel car is now in the U.S.A. with / via Dave Irwin.

Bryan.

BT35-35 was for sale in Glouceshire [ spelling ] 1990/1.

I don't think we have found it after that.

Bryan.

Thanks Bryan, if I'd read my notes more closely I might have realised that. The Edwards family had a lot of fun with that car, in those days I called in a couple of times to see them, they had a number of other cars but that I think was the only Brabham.

BT35-35 was raced in the German Open in the nineties.
It was in F2 configuration when raced by John Harper in Euro F2 but was later converted to F3 spec.

The following is a list of Brabham drivers in the aforementioned championship:

1972
Gray & Agnes Mickel in BT35-44
Iain McLaren in a BT35X

1973
Gray and Agnes Mickel in BT35-44

1974
Bob Snelson in a BT35
Jim Campbell in BT35-44

1975/1976/1977
Jim Campbell in BT35-44

1978
Jim Campbell in BT35-44

:Santa: :Santa: :Santa: :Santa: :Santa:

2nd Rd British F3 Championship

55 Jan Persson - BT35/Team Gekas-Klader
56 Jorgen Jonsson - BT35/Team Mum for Men

:cool:

BT35-5 .

For sale at www.carclassic.com

Stated to never have been entered in a race , two owners from new and only used by two French drivers for private use.
I have the name of Jean Louis La Fosse against this car in my notes.

Still fitted with Novamotor MAE 1000cc.

Bryan.

BT35-5 was offered for sale at the 2004 Bonhams Monaco auction by.."a private French collector...who has owned it for 18 years. The car has been used for track-days and local hillclimbs"
Assuming it's the same car - and photos suggest it is - it seems carclassic.com have ignored whatever pre-1986 history it might have had

Autosport in early 71 F3 reports gave the following chassis nos for BT35s
1: Brendan McInerney, used later in season by Jorge Pinhol and then a rent-a-car by MRE in 1972
2: Colin Vandervell
3: Jean-Louis Lafosse, this car offered for sale but not sold at Brooks Goodwood, 1999
4: Chris O'Brien, retained 1972 until BT38 delivered
5: Bernard Lagier [team mate to Lafosse] to Jannick Auxmery in French F3 1972.

So history completely ignored, as usual...

Like Bryan, I have 35-5 as Lafosse's number
The 1999 Goodwood catalogue entry for BT35-3 does not mention Lafosse as the original owner (or anyone else for that matter). This car was deep purple and gold at the time of the sale; the 2004 Monaco and 2005 carclassic.com one is red
No-one seems to claim that either of these cars was raced in period....

14/03/71 Mallory Park Lombank F3 Race:
Brendan McInerney raced his BT35 (White) whilst the following BT35s were NON-STARTERS:- Colin Vandervell (White/Green/Red) ; Chris O'Brien (Blue/Orange).

03/04/71 Brands Hatch Shell Super Oil British F3 Championship Race:
Once again McInerney was in his White BT35 Qualified on 2nd row and finished 6th; Vandervell practiced but crashed and did not race; O'Brien qualified on the fifth row; Jean-Louis Lafosse qualified on the 4th row; whilst Bernard Lagier was the slowest qualifier. NON-STARTERS were Jonas Qvarstrom; Ulf Svensson; Ingvar Petterson; Randy Lewis; Pierre-Francois Rousellot; and Alan McCully.

08/05/71 Silverstone GKN Forgings Trophy Race:
Again there were McInerney, O'Brien and Vandervell entered, they all qualified but didn't feature in the results.

22/05/71 Monaco F3 Grand Prix
The following BT35s were entered:
Dietmar Floer; Jean-Louis Lafosse; Pierre-Francois Rousselot; Brendan McInerney; Jonas Qvarnstrom; Colin Vandervell; and Ulf Svensson.

10/07/71 Croft Rothmans International F3 Race
The following BT35s were entered:
Conny Andersson; Ulf Svensson; Jan Persson (DNS); Jorge Pinhol (DNS); Ingvar Pettersson; Chris O'Brien; Jorgen Jonsson (DNS); Jonas Qvarnstrom (DNS); Lothar Schorg. Schorg was in a BMW Shnitzer powered Vienna Race Management entered version.

16/07/71 Silverstone Shell Super Oil Championship F3 Race
Pinhol; Lagier (DNS) Lafosse; Pettersson; Jonsson; O'Brien; Schorg; Randy Lewis; Persson; Svensson; Palm; Rousselot; Vandervell; and Peter Hull were all entered in BT35s.

21/08/71 Oulton Park Shell Super Oil Championship F3 Race
In BT35s were:

Jorge Pinhol (DNS); Colin Vandervell (4th); Jean-Louis Lafosse; and Pierre-Francois Rousselot.

All of the above taken from the programmes plus the annotated contemporary notes. :cool:

It is great to see such a load of knowledge re brabhams.. I helped out Rob Turnbull with his BT35 BDA on hillclimbs when I was young, we came 10th in a 1600cc car .. no idea what chassis number that was ..

Anyway I make wheels, split rim type, to fit Brabhams (march and Lola also) What I wanted to know is the offsets .. does anybody know the correct offsets for early brabhams ? They are perfect for all cars up to BT 38 when the look changed .. We sell a lot of these but I am always being asked re the correct offset.. if somebody knows this or where I can go,.. great .. Lola would be useful too ..

thanks

Doug

Doug,
I own BT35-8 , I have 9's and 13's for wets and 10's and 14's for dry and will measure from the back mounting face to a straight edge across the rear of the rim.
Not all of mine are genuine Brabham , neither are a lot of other peoples except they do not realise it.
Some of mine are Palliser , nearly identical , unless you know how to spot the difference.
Are you o.k. for March measurements as I also have a 74B , but only front 10's , my two sets of rears are period Dymags , 15's.
Also have 5 x Melmags 2 x fr. 3 x r. 10's and 14's.
can measure all if required.
Bryan.

Andrew,

Marsland is also quoted in F2R 3 races earlier at Nivelles as racing a BT35, so the BT36 may not necessarily be so (or vice versa or course)

Andrew,

As I mentioned above, Marsland's quoted in a BT35 at Nivelles, this may be more likley as I think he drove a BT35 in the 1972 Phoenix Park race, but I haven't got a report to hand to comfirm..

Jeremy I am sure you are right, sorry I didn't mean to ignore your suggestion!! -with such a plethora of ancient BT36’s it all highly unlikely, Autosport lists the reason that Marsland was at Monza was because he was on his way to a hill climb in with his “BT36”

What was the attraction of Monza? Was there good start money that attracted so many?

One of our other contributors here with good Swiss contacts has offered to find out about Amweg, or is this a name that means anything to anyone?

And another surfaces,

I have been contacted by Bob Slusher from Oregon in the U.S.A. who advises BT35-18 used by Scott Mackenzie in the Canadian Atlantic/Players series in 1974 and crashed at Edmonton June 1974 , thence used as a spares car for teams other BT35 , then dismantelled and stored untill sold to Doug DeFresne , Portland Oregon 1979 , thence purchased by Bob Slusher , Oregon Sept. 2005.

Bryan, Why do I like finding out about BT35s more than BT36s Miller.

Bryan, Why do I like finding out about BT35s more than BT36s Miller.


Because some BT35’s are mechanically challenged? ;)

Mr. Fellowes ,

Consider yourself excommunicated.

Mr. Miller.

:rofl:

Confined to cloisters do instead?

:rotate: :rotate: :rotate:

And another one turns up , completely un molested , www.racecarsdirect.com has for sale BT35-46 , looks like it was put away in the 1970's and forgotten about.
The name on the advert is Claudio Stranges in Italy.
The car is in full F3 spec with airbox , MK 8/9 Hewland and 8''s and 10''s.

Bryan.

And another one turns up , completely un molested , www.racecarsdirect.com has for sale BT35-46 , looks like it was put away in the 1970's and forgotten about.
The name on the advert is Claudio Stranges in Italy.
The car is in full F3 spec with airbox , MK 8/9 Hewland and 8''s and 10''s.

Bryan.

I wonder if thats a misprint for Claudio Langes ??

Dan,

No , no misprint that is the name on the email contact.
Bryan.

This post is to mark the point at which this BT35 thread was split out from the giant Brabham BT28-BT29-BT30-BT35-BT36 thread. Much gratitude again to John Turner.

Allen

More research has turned that BT35-18 was original to Bill Eagles of Dominion Textiles and campaigned in `72 in F2 then sold to Scott Mackenzie when Bill ordered a new BT40. I believe I have located Mr. Eagles in Alberta and will chat him up soon.

Bob Slusher
Oregon

And another surfaces,

I have been contacted by Bob Slusher from Oregon in the U.S.A. who advises BT35-18 used by Scott Mackenzie in the Canadian Atlantic/Players series in 1974 and crashed at Edmonton June 1974 , thence used as a spares car for teams other BT35 , then dismantelled and stored untill sold to Doug DeFresne , Portland Oregon 1979 , thence purchased by Bob Slusher , Oregon Sept. 2005.

Bryan, Why do I like finding out about BT35s more than BT36s Miller.

Bob,
In your email to me a while ago you advised BT35-18 badly crashed 1974 and used as spares donor for their OTHER BT35 , can you find out anything at all about that one as well please , where did it come from , where did it go , ch # etc.
Bryan.

BT35-18 not, I think, new to Eagles
Throughout 1971 he races a Chevron B9/15 - and if he'd got a new BT35 you'd think he'd race it. Then appears at Sanair 28.5.72 in a BT35 that Canadian Motorsport Bulletin for July 72 describes as 'ex Robertson' - so I think we've found Brian Robertson's 1971 car.
The Scott MacKenzie cars were owned by Tom Moore of AstroSports. After McKenzie's accident in 73 Ric Forest ran very well in them/it.

Bob - If you do trace Bill Eagles please can you ask about the Chevron and the BT40?

Chris

Andrew,

As I mentioned above, Marsland's quoted in a BT35 at Nivelles, this may be more likley as I think he drove a BT35 in the 1972 Phoenix Park race, but I haven't got a report to hand to comfirm..

Any leads as to the chassis number of this car. Marsland drove a BT35 in the British Sprint Championship in 1973 so it has to be the same chassis!

:)

Steve

Marsland also appears in occasional Atlantic races with this in late 71 and I think
it is a late season build, but have no idea about the number beyond that.
If we could get some more chassis numbers for F3 BT35s that might close some
gaps.

Chris

Bob,
In your email to me a while ago you advised BT35-18 badly crashed 1974 and used as spares donor for their OTHER BT35 , can you find out anything at all about that one as well please , where did it come from , where did it go , ch # etc.
Bryan.

Brian:

Email bits from Scott Mackenzie indicate that he sold the "other" car to Mathews. That would make it either #19 (doubtful) or #33. He said "the second car was red had been run by Motul - I bought from Fred Opert". Without the logbook for #18 I am at the mercy of the memory of others and I do so appreciate those memories. Hope this helps.

Bob Slusher
Oregon

BT35-18 not, I think, new to Eagles
Throughout 1971 he races a Chevron B9/15 - and if he'd got a new BT35 you'd think he'd race it. Then appears at Sanair 28.5.72 in a BT35 that Canadian Motorsport Bulletin for July 72 describes as 'ex Robertson' - so I think we've found Brian Robertson's 1971 car.
The Scott MacKenzie cars were owned by Tom Moore of AstroSports. After McKenzie's accident in 73 Ric Forest ran very well in them/it.

Bob - If you do trace Bill Eagles please can you ask about the Chevron and the BT40?

Chris

Thanks Chris!

And the quest for the history of #18 takes yet another turn. Several points here in no particular order:

Who was Brian Robertson and is he still with us? I would like to contact him for more history.

Mr. Mackenzie also indicated that Rick Forest ran one of the team's cars following the shunt of #18 at Edmonton. Judging by the damage to #18 Rick most certainly did not run this car. More likely the other team car.

The names Tom Moore and Autosports did not come up in my contacts with Mr. Mackenzie. Can you shed some light upon these. This research for correct history of #18 has taken on the importance of the quest for the holy grail.

Logbook - logbook. Who has the logbook?

I am grateful for your time and interest.

BTW, I believe Mr. Eagles contact informaton will be.
Bill Eagles
119 Midvalley Dr Se
Calgary, AB
(403) 201-3195

If you have the chance to chat him up, John Hafkenschiel (Brabham Register) asks if he still has the nose of his BT40 hanging over his desk? John knows someone who needs that nose for a restoration.

Peace,

Bob Slusher
Oregon

Who was Brian Robertson and is he still with us? I would like to contact him for more history.
Brian Robertson was a (the?) North American Brabham - and later Ralt - importer
To be quite honest, I don't think I ever knew if he was Canadian or from the US - certainly around 1980 he was based in the Greater LA area, but that wouldn't stop him being Canadian

I am very slowly putting all the information together for the BT35's and will list as , where we are now a.s.a.p.
Bryan.

When Robertson drove the car it was entered by, and I guess belonged to, Fred Opert.
Tom Moore's Astrosports outfit sponsored Forest in the BT35, and I got the impression both from Forest and reading Canadian magazines, that he owned
the car. Forest already had a stake in a March 722 with Al Lader, that he couldn't
afford to run, and I'd be surprised if he could have afforded to buy another [older] car rather than use the cash to run a competitive 722. I've got to go back to Ric
with queries on the 722 so will confirm.
Robertson was definitely Canadian as he scored points in the Canadian championship whereas NW USA drivers like Lader could run, win money, but not get points.

Bob: Many thanks for Bill Eagles's address, will contact him!

Chris

When Robertson drove the car it was entered by, and I guess belonged to, Fred Opert.
Tom Moore's Astrosports outfit sponsored Forest in the BT35, and I got the impression both from Forest and reading Canadian magazines, that he owned
the car. Forest already had a stake in a March 722 with Al Lader, that he couldn't
afford to run, and I'd be surprised if he could have afforded to buy another [older] car rather than use the cash to run a competitive 722. I've got to go back to Ric
with queries on the 722 so will confirm.
Robertson was definitely Canadian as he scored points in the Canadian championship whereas NW USA drivers like Lader could run, win money, but not get points.

Bob: Many thanks for Bill Eagles's address, will contact him!

Chris

Chris, Bryan and others. My thanks go to you as you direct the research history of this car. I do appreciate your enthusiasm and your time. My thanks.

Research show only about 30 Brian Robertson's in the LA area. Can we narrow this down a bit somehow? A contact friend perhaps or a middle name?

Early in my research I received direction that both Rick Forest and Bertil Roos took over driving of the Mackenzie team's "other" car on a contract basis and then just until the end of the season. A Canajun friend contacted Bertil and spoke with his housekeeper (?) and reported back that Bertil did not recall the name Scott Mackenzie, so that may provide some leading in the matter. Clearnes in the matter of car/team ownership during this time is clouded at best.

Oh for a simple logbook to surface in the back drawer of someone involved with this car. Naw, too easy!

Peace,

Bob Slusher
Oregon

Upstairs in the store is an F3 BT35 no chassis plate but has Sandro Cinotto's name on the cockpit. It belongs to an Italian customer and has the original gearbox but a later 2 litre F3 twincam

Bob

There are people with Ralt RT4s around on this forum who have been in contact with Brian Robertson. They may be able to give you an address. He's not too helpful on the Ralt front - which is a bit of a p****r as he was only the North American distributor for a decade and a half.

I've got almost all the Canadian results for the two "McKenzie" cars.

Chassis 18. 1973: 3 June: Edmonton, Scott McKenzie terminates car; 27 May Westwood, McKenzie 11th; 1972: 15 Oct, Mosport, Bill Eagles appears, probably retired; 1 Oct: Sanair, Eagles 8th; 10 Sept: Debert, Eagles 10th; Trois Rivieres, probably ran, don't know result; 6 August Gimli, Eagles 12th; 23 July Mt Tremblant: Eagles 7th; 9 July Westwood, Eagles 9th; 25 June Edmonton, Eagles 14th; may have run non champ race at Sanair 4 June; 28 May Sanair, Eagles DNS; 1971: 3 Oct Westwood, Robertson DNS conditions too bad; 19 Sept Mosport Robertson 6th; Trois Rivieres 29 Aug [Molson Ch race], Robertson 3rd; 28 Aug [Players Ch race] Robertson 2nd; 15 Aug Mt Tremblant, 3rd; 1 Aug Mt Tremblant Robertson 1st; 11 July Mt Tremblant Robertson 2nd; 4 July Robertson 1st; 20 June Edmonton Robertson retired; 30 May Robertson 2nd. Bear in mind that Opert had more than one BT35 so Robertson may have used other chassis that no.18 in the season [esp as Opert team rotated plates...] However, we do know that Eagles car had been used by Robertson fairly regularly in the 1971 Canadian season

"The other car"
1973: 6 Oct: Watkins Glen, Dave McMillan [0 laps, engine]; perhaps ran Elkhart Lake; 20 Aug: Mosport, Ric Forest 2nd; 5 Aug Gimli, Forest, 1st; probably ran Debert 16 July; 2 July Mosport, Forest 6th

A log book won't give you these races as they weren't SCCA organised

Chris

Chassis 18. 1973: 3 June: Edmonton, Scott McKenzie terminates car; 27 May Westwood, McKenzie 11th; 1972: 15 Oct, Mosport, Bill Eagles appears, probably retired; 1 Oct: Sanair, Eagles 8th; 10 Sept: Debert, Eagles 10th; Trois Rivieres, probably ran, don't know result; 6 August Gimli, Eagles 12th; 23 July Mt Tremblant: Eagles 7th; 9 July Westwood, Eagles 9th; 25 June Edmonton, Eagles 14th; may have run non champ race at Sanair 4 June; 28 May Sanair, Eagles DNS; 1971: 3 Oct Westwood, Robertson DNS conditions too bad; 19 Sept Mosport Robertson 6th; Trois Rivieres 29 Aug [Molson Ch race], Robertson 3rd; 28 Aug [Players Ch race] Robertson 2nd; 15 Aug Mt Tremblant, 3rd; 1 Aug Mt Tremblant Robertson 1st; 11 July Mt Tremblant Robertson 2nd; 4 July Robertson 1st; 20 June Edmonton Robertson retired; 30 May Robertson 2nd. Bear in mind that Opert had more than one BT35 so Robertson may have used other chassis that no.18 in the season [esp as Opert team rotated plates...] However, we do know that Eagles car had been used by Robertson fairly regularly in the 1971 Canadian season

Chris:

You are truly amazing! Take a cool pint out of petty-cash for your work on this one.

My sincere gratitude to you for compiling all of this data for me. You get one "Done Good" and two "Ata Boys" for this. Is there something I can do for you in return?

Peace,

Bob Slusher
Oregon

Simon,
AM number by any chance ?
Bryan.

http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/swphotographic/images/6-picture1.gif

Rob Turnbull in his BT35 at Prescott in 1976

:burn:

AM 71-39 (could be 89 -even at a push 69!) It has been there a long time. Cockpit is original polished gel-coat red and drivers name is Cinotti.

AM 71-39 (could be 89 -even at a push 69!) It has been there a long time. Cockpit is original polished gel-coat red and drivers name is Cinotti.

In 1971 at the British GP meeting at Silverstone Sandro Cinotti was entered in a Brabham-Alfa Romeo by the Jolly Club. He was a none starter or qualifier. No mention of the model of car in the programme.

In 1972 at the Monaco GP Cinotti was again entered by the Jolly Club. The chassis was still a Brabham but there was no chassis type or engine listed. He was again a none starter or qualifier.

No further sightings!

Bob mentions that the "other" McKenzie BT35 [the one that survived] had
been run in Motul colours and was bought via Fred Opert.
Motul didn't sponsor anyone in FB in 1971/72 as far as I know, but they did
sponsor people in European F3 didn't they? Wasn't Lafosse or Lagier backed
by Motul in 1971?

Chris

Bob mentions that the "other" McKenzie BT35 [the one that survived] had
been run in Motul colours and was bought via Fred Opert.
Motul didn't sponsor anyone in FB in 1971/72 as far as I know, but they did
sponsor people in European F3 didn't they? Wasn't Lafosse or Lagier backed
by Motul in 1971?

Chris

Chris:

In close review of my notes from Mr. Mackenzie he mentions that the "other" car did not have the pull out of the corners like the BDA in #18. The "other" car had fuel injection. Am I wrong that fuel injection was not allowed in the UK FA cars but was allowed here in the states with SCCA? Mr. Mackenzie does not recall any of the chassis numbers for either car but did offer that the roll stiffness of the bars were a problem and that beefyer bars were certainly in order to be competative with March cars of the era.

Peace,

Bob

Bob mentions that the "other" McKenzie BT35 [the one that survived] had
been run in Motul colours and was bought via Fred Opert.
Motul didn't sponsor anyone in FB in 1971/72 as far as I know, but they did
sponsor people in European F3 didn't they? Wasn't Lafosse or Lagier backed
by Motul in 1971?

Chris

Chris:

Tid-bits about the "other" car. The race number (still on my fuel tanks) was #94 while the number on the "other" car was #96 as shown on the photo's from the Mathews collection. Greg Mathews notes "the car was sold last year to ex-professional racer Bobby Brown who is currently campaigning the car and in many cases is beating up on competitors that are running 4-valve engines." I imagine Mr. Brown (?) would have the necessary documents and plate for this car. Is there a way to track him down? Anyone know of him?

Peace,

Bob

... the car was sold last year to ex-professional racer Bobby Brown ... Is there a way to track him down? I can't give out his email address but I'll be happy to forward an email to him.

Email me at allen@oldracingcars.com

Allen

Thank you. That effort would fill the void of informaiton on this "other Mackenzie car" ; likely to be either chassis BT 35/ #19 or #33. Any additional historical information form Mr. Brown would be appreciated.

Peace,
Bob Slusher

I received a nice reply from Bobby Brown. He is on holiday for the next few weeks but on return will have a look at both BT 35's (he has two?) and forward the numbers to us. He does not believe the red car (acquired from the Harry Mathews collection) has a number plate but the other car might be chassis #10. More in a few weeks.

Bob Slusher

I always thought that chassis 33 was the BT35 in the Matthews Collection
It was the number given on the website. Was there another?

Would like to learn more about Mr Brown's chassis 10. At a guess another ex Opert
team car...

Sadly, we can't attribute all the 1971 results that I gave for Brian Robertson in 1971 to a single car. Apparently Al Justasson had another ex Robertson BT35 in the 1972 Canadian series, so some of them were perhaps achieved in this car, about which we know nothing else.

Interestingly, 94 was the number carried by Dave McMillan's BT35 at Watkins Glen in Oct 1973, by Forest's BT35 at Gimli in August 73, and by McKenzie when he went agricultural at Edmonton, which suggests chassis 18 had been perhaps been rebuilt.
[These numbers are taken from entry lists and official results [in the case of Watkins Glen], rather than race photos, so might have been changed at Gimli or Edmonton] Race no 96 in the Edmonton list is taken by Bob Newton's March 71BM; no 96 in the other two.

Chris

[QUOTE=Chris Townsend]I always thought that chassis 33 was the BT35 in the Matthews Collection
It was the number given on the website. Was there another?

Another of the several Mathews web pages shows chassis #19 (red w/ gold) in their stable during the restoration of chassis #33.

http://www.mathewscollection.com/brabham/brabham_BT35.htm

Peace,

Bob Slusher

I always thought that chassis 33 was the BT35 in the Matthews Collection
It was the number given on the website. Was there another?
Chris
So did I 'till I went back and had another look, and it looks like an AM number, 71-33, not a chassis number.
Would you agree?
http://www.mathewscollection.com/sale/sale_race_BT35.htm

So did I 'till I went back and had another look, and it looks like an AM number, 71-33, not a chassis number.
Would you agree?
http://www.mathewscollection.com/sale/sale_race_BT35.htm

Hmmm. An interesting point well taken. Very likely an AM number. Am I correct that there is no factory cross reference listing AM to chassis numbers? Perhaps a call to Greg Mathews would make it clear what the chassis number may be.

On another subject: Your adivce would be appreciated here.

I suppose most of us would love to have a vintage photo of our car at speed or in the pits and I am no exception (full drool mode). How does one go about finding the stray snap or magazine file photo or ?. I am at a complete loss as to how to go about it.

Little or no correlation between chassis & AM numbers, I guess this would put it as an earlier chassis, low teens perhaps?

Well for photo’s you could start with Ted, they tell me he has a couple, next how about the Klemantaski Collection, http://www.klemcoll.com/

Was 71-33 owned at one stage by a Mrs Downer in California ????.As for photos I have very little USA Material apart from can-am (whatever that is)

I think we need to put that one to bed as AM71-33. Chassis no. unknown at this point.

Bryan I do have a chassis No against this thats why I asked the question above.

(snip) As for photos I have very little USA Material apart from can-am (whatever that is)

Ted:

The photos I seek would be from largely Canadian F2/FA event between May, 71 and June `73. Thanks to Chris Townsend we have a complete listing of events and dates from which photos would be sought. Can you assist us?

Peace,

Bob

Bob

I'll PM you Chris Waddell's email address. Chris documented a lot of these races for
Canadian and American magazines. I don't know if he goes back to 1971/2

Chris

Bob. Sorry no Canadian material either(apart from a couple of Can -ams)

I suppose most of us would love to have a vintage photo of our car at speed or in the pits and I am no exception (full drool mode). How does one go about finding the stray snap or magazine file photo or ?. I am at a complete loss as to how to go about it.Bob

I'd recommend Tom Schultz for US photos. He only covered Road America in the early 1970s but there were big FB events there in 1971 and 1972.

I don't think he'll mind me publicising his email: t-jschultz at msn dot com. Tell him I sent you.

Allen

Thank you all for suggestions to pursue photo's.

A friend has a set of wheels available for purchase. Can someone indicate the proper backset I should be looking for in the BT 35?

Many thanks,

Bob Slusher

They should be the 4 spoke pattern with the spokes sloping outwards as opposed to fronts that are flat.

Bob

What colour scheme was on your number 94 fuel tanks.
The last colour given for this car is purple and gold [with that number] at
Watkins Glen in 1973

Chris

They should be the 4 spoke pattern with the spokes sloping outwards as opposed to fronts that are flat.

Thank you Ted. Very helpful. These wheels I believe have the flat fronts which the seller says are correct for Chevron. Thank you for the confirmation. Too bad for me.

BTW, I found the measure backset for the Brabham wheel at 3.875" to be the correct backset.

Bob

Bob

What colour scheme was on your number 94 fuel tanks.
The last colour given for this car is purple and gold [with that number] at
Watkins Glen in 1973

Chris

Hi Chris:

Both fuel tanks with #18 are black with stylized white numbers. Judging by the body filler they had been through a bump or two prior to painting. My rear wing is gold. No other body panels came with the boxed car. Mr. Mackenzie recalls this car was originally dark green and gold. He also recalls selling Mathews the body panels for #18 just before the sale of the rest of the car. Are the used purple body panel shown on the Mathews site correct for #18 but with the number 96? It does leave one to guess what was up during those times with numbers.

Peace,

Bob

Thanks again to Allen Brown for putting me in touch with Bobby Brown owner of two BT-35 cars. He acquired BT-35/10 from Frank Costey of Westminis, Colorado; green and yellow, photos are available on web search under images BT35. His other car is the Mathews restoration shown on Harry Mathews well documented site and is confirmed as AM 71-33 as no chassis plate was fitted when purchased.

This week Bobby contacted Fred Opert (New Jersey) to ask for records of who he sold cars to. Fred reply'd he does not recall and advises that contact be made with Brian Robertson the Brabham agent for Fred in Canada in those days.

Who here has a good working relationship with Mr. Robertson and could follow-on with this thread? Bobby Brown would also like to confirm the correct chassis number for his AM 71-33 and perhaps the history for the car which he races regularly on the right coast.

Cheers,

Bob

Bob

Does Bobby Brown have a log book for BT35-10?
This car should have CASC plate 512 on it somewhere - it was known in Colorado club racing in 1988 but that's as far back as I go on it.

If Brian Robertson's been as good in keeping his Brabham records as he was with Ralts we're in for a tough time. I'd suggest that we're better off pestering Opert to open his vaults for USA sales and doing the Canadians by a process of elimination!

Chris

Chris,
BT35-10 is the car that was offered on ebay about 18 months ago , PHDM sent me a lot of photos after it had been deleted from the site, from memory , as I telephoned the agent , the car was somewhere in the Rocky Mtns at that time.
Lost track of it now.
Bryan.

Bob

Does Bobby Brown have a log book for BT35-10?
This car should have CASC plate 512 on it somewhere - it was known in Colorado club racing in 1988 but that's as far back as I go on it.

If Brian Robertson's been as good in keeping his Brabham records as he was with Ralts we're in for a tough time. I'd suggest that we're better off pestering Opert to open his vaults for USA sales and doing the Canadians by a process of elimination!

Chris

Chris:

I forwarded your comments and request onto Bobby Brown and also requested the contact number for Fred Opert in the hope that one of us could chat him up and perhaps prime the information pump.

Bob

Bob

Does Bobby Brown have a log book for BT35-10?
This car should have CASC plate 512 on it somewhere - it was known in Colorado club racing in 1988 but that's as far back as I go on it.

Chris

Chris:

Mr. Brown thanks you as he did find the CASC plate #512 in the car as you directed. He did not mention a log book but did note that the car is now for sale.

Bob

This car seems to have gone from Jim Campbell (1978 Scottish champion) to Chris Dowson for 1979.

BT35-44 Was the Mickel hill climb car fitted with FVC and FT200 G box.It was owned for a long time by the late Fred Edwards.

Did Peter Kaye have two BT35s? I have him in BT35-23 in 1976 at Shelsley Walsh and Gurston Down. Appoarently he had BT35X-1 in 1977.

Did Peter Kaye have two BT35s? I have him in BT35-23 in 1976 at Shelsley Walsh and Gurston Down. Appoarently he had BT35X-1 in 1977.

According to 'the black book' Kaye ran a BT35 in 1976 which became a BT35X in 1977.

http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/srwpho/images/3-picture2.gif

Peter Kaye in 1976 at Harewood.

If Kaye had BT35-23 in 1976 what was its provenance?
Did it have a BDA in it?
Is this the ex Marsland car, last seen sprinting in 1972?
Is it perhaps the BT35-BDA that crops up in Irish Atlantic in 1974 and then
disappears again
[Could be both!]

Chris

Did Peter Kaye have two BT35s? I have him in BT35-23 in 1976 at Shelsley Walsh and Gurston Down. Appoarently he had BT35X-1 in 1977.Thanks for these identifications Alan. Despite the stress you're causing Chris, they are very helpful and most welcome :laugh:

Peter Kaye had BT35X/1 since 1974 (co-driven with Robert Sunderland 1974/75) says David (http://www.ten-tenths.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1538355&postcount=22), so is it possible that BT35X/1 actually carried the plate BT35/23?

Allen

If Kaye had BT35-23 in 1976 what was its provenance?
Did it have a BDA in it?
Is this the ex Marsland car, last seen sprinting in 1972?
Is it perhaps the BT35-BDA that crops up in Irish Atlantic in 1974 and then
disappears again
[Could be both!]

Chris

It was entered as a BDA engine in '76.

1971 A/S Oct 28th p.59 BT35 Jorge Pinhol 3,200. Norma Robb 01 908 2808 day, John Stanton, Marlow 3870 evenings.

1972 A/S Feb 17th p.42 BT35, Jorge Pinhol, Low Cost Racing

Not sure if we've had both of these before.

Over at the '' other place '' is a loveeerly photo of the two BT35's of Torsten Palm and Stig Blomqvist complete with their Mennen sponsored transporter.

Bryan.

Bryan, please post the link; it's relevant here (and I can't find it!).

In the meantime, Keith Norman's BT35 at Brands Hatch Superprix, 7 May, 2006:-
http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/1183/brandshatchhsccsuperprix67may2.th.jpg (http://img355.imageshack.us/my.php?image=brandshatchhsccsuperprix67may2.jpg)

http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/1493/brandshatchhsccsuperprix7may20.th.jpg (http://img355.imageshack.us/my.php?image=brandshatchhsccsuperprix7may20.jpg)

Over at the '' other place '' is a loveeerly photo of the two BT35's of Torsten Palm and Stig Blomqvist complete with their Mennen sponsored transporter.

http://forums.autosport.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=2352495#post2352495
Post no.293

Henk has come up with lots of great photos, here as well,
http://forums.autosport.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=31078&perpage=40&display=&pagenumber=33
Post 1298 onwards

Thanks Andrew , only you know how bad I am with computers.

Peter Shaw's BT35, Brands Hatch Superprix, 7 May, 2006

http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/1493/brandshatchhsccsuperprix7may20.th.jpg (http://img463.imageshack.us/my.php?image=brandshatchhsccsuperprix7may20.jpg)

http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/5360/brandshatchhsccsuperprix7may21.th.jpg (http://img463.imageshack.us/my.php?image=brandshatchhsccsuperprix7may21.jpg)

http://img281.imageshack.us/img281/1493/brandshatchhsccsuperprix7may20.th.jpg (http://img281.imageshack.us/my.php?image=brandshatchhsccsuperprix7may20.jpg)

Get ready John 'cause I am going to get picky again!!. I would love to see the UK ban modern advertising as is done here in Oz. Spoils the look of the car.

If the above car is BT35-6 as I assume it is, then the colour is wrong too. Bryan shouldn't it be the same as your car? (BT35-8 as on the r.h.s. in this photo.)
http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/8548/bt356b5tv.th.jpg (http://img157.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bt356b5tv.jpg)
Eastern Creek 2003 and I wish I had a close up as all the signage is as per Mallory in '72.

Andrew,
That is the purist in you coming out.
Yes I believe BT35-6 was very similar in colour to BT35-8.
As you know over here it is not mandatory to present your car in one of the cars period livery , it should be , but that is only my own opinion , I dislike nothing more than seeing a'' flock ''of Brabhams all painted dark green with a yellow stripe, amazes me as much as every Lotus 23 seems to be green with yellow wheels.
Bryan.

Get ready John 'cause I am going to get picky again!!. I would love to see the UK ban modern advertising as is done here in Oz. Spoils the look of the car.

Hey, I'm just the illustrator! As we've said on another thread (BT30), we need to get the 'modern' history right, too, as history is continuous. The new livery is part of that history, and whether that spoils the looks is an opinion based on how you remember them. I don't necessarily disagree with you or Bryan, but I think this is an area where we factually point to the differences rather than express a critical opinion. I'm just hoping that Neil Glover (BT30), for example, is not put off from joining us and posting as a result of your remark, Andrew. The argument for originality of liveries, or the acceptability or otherwise of more recent ones would be a good thread to start in either of our history forums, but not, I think, here! :)

Ok colour schemes aside, sorry Neil, not your fault if thats what the rules allow in Europe.

1. How many BT35’s were built in 1972?

2. How many went to Italy?

In 1971 I can only find one, Andrea Zucchi at Monza Sept. 19th. The following year at Monza there were several BT35’s. Where did they come from, 2nd hand ex UK, or new?

1972 A/S March 16th p.2 Adelmo Bignami. Pino Pica, Alessandro Pesenti, Keiz Lange, Jurg Dubler.
1972 A/S April 27th you can add Carlo Giorgio and Pesenti Rossi.

Not sure if I have the last one correct but I don't have my Autosports to hand.

NO Bt35s were built in 1972 Certainly the last batch appear to have gone to Italy mainly for Jolly Club. I have Nos 45-49 going there.Not sure about 47-9 but am sure about 45-6

If Bob Gerard's BT35-43 doesn't appear until October, that would suggest that the Jolly Club cars were delivered after the end of the Italian season and therefore not seen until 1972.

Chris

Ted,
I beg to differ that no BT35's were built in 1972 .
Refer my post # 41 this thread re the Mickel car BT35-44 , ''new for the hills in 1972 '' , and also the letter supplied by Ian Henderson of the U.S.A. signed by Ralph Bellamy stating the roll-over bars on 5 cars coplied with the 1972 FIA regulations, post # 76.

Also BT35-47 has a 1972 AM number.

Or are you suggesting these were laid down in late 1971 and given 1972 AM numbers.
Bryan.

Bryan. Im amazed that 35-47 has an am72 No. Have you seen it inthe flesh ???? 35-44 has an 71 No.It goes to show that you learn something new every day. The regs for 72 would have been published in 1971,giving constructors 12 months notice.

Ted,

No , I haven't seen it myself, but is reported as AM 72-7, and given the age of the information and source , would have no reason to not accept the numbers.

Could this have something to do with Bernie E. owning Brabhams at this point and running the company in a different style to Ron , doing deals to clear surplus stock etc before the new Geoff Ferris BT38's came on stream, you know the new broom scenario.

Bryan.

Bryan's own BT35-8; pictures taken today! (Looks great, Bryan!)
http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/3092/brabhamsandother0519jl.th.jpg (http://img63.imageshack.us/my.php?image=brabhamsandother0519jl.jpg)

http://img331.imageshack.us/img331/8736/brabhamsandother0530hd.th.jpg (http://img331.imageshack.us/my.php?image=brabhamsandother0530hd.jpg)

BT35-43 is for sale on www.racecarsdirect.com ,as the ex Nick Overall car ex Bob Gerrard.
Bryan.

Maybe 35-47 required a replacement chassis from Arch during 1972.With 49 cars built I would have thought that there would have been some demand .
Ian

That sounds very plausible Ian.

I am attempting to identify the correct types and values for the Smiths gauges for the BT 35/B. Supplied with the car were the rev counter to 8k and a single water temp gauge in Celsius. I am guessing that the missing dual pattern gauge is oil pressure and oil temperature though I can find no reference to that combination on any Smiths www site.

I have found a dandy oil pressure/ water temp in Celsius that would do nicely allowing the replacement of the single gauge with a oil temp. But, what is correct for the dash?

Peace,

Bob Slusher

Bob,
In period I believe that Smiths did make an oil/temp/pressure guage for racing cars , you will have to use the dual guage you have found and use the water temp for oil temp instead , it can't bother the guage , temperature is temperature .

Tachometer , 8000rpm, depends what engine and specification of said engine , anything with a BDD/E/F/G series would need at least a 10,000rpm unit. Even a good all steel Twin-cam will go well past 8000rpm.

Yes , F. degrees would be period correct , but difficult to find unless you rob an MGB or MG Midget , Spitfire etc.

Bryan.

I am attempting to identify the correct types and values for the Smiths gauges for the BT 35/B. Supplied with the car were the rev counter to 8k and a single water temp gauge in Celsius. I am guessing that the missing dual pattern gauge is oil pressure and oil temperature though I can find no reference to that combination on any Smiths www site.

I have found a dandy oil pressure/ water temp in Celsius that would do nicely allowing the replacement of the single gauge with a oil temp. But, what is correct for the dash?

Peace,

Bob Slusher

Bob, check out a company called Greengauges. They are a British company but have outlets in the USA. They bought the rights to Smiths instruments and do customised gauges so should be able to replicate the one or ones you want.

:cool:

Dash panel w