How much are Lewis (and the rest) worth?

[Chiefy]

I've been reading my AutoHebdo again (French Autosport) and a perplexing snippet has caught my eye on the subject of (love him or hate him) Lewis Hamilton. The magazine reads, and I quote:

According to the British tabloids, McLaren would be assured of Lewis Hamilton's services until 2012 for the moderate sum of 93,000,000€.

Lewis says:

I've always said that I would be happy to stay with McLaren for the rest of my career if they want me.

My question: If Lewis Hamilton would be so happy to stay with the team that has part-funded and -crafted him for the last decade, why would he need almost one hundred million euros to do it? McLaren, doubtless, would have to expect some bloomin' good results for that kind of money - and it's not like they haven't already invested in those by aiding him through the junior formulae.

So is Lewis worth it? Does he deserve it? And are F1 drivers being paid too much in the 21st century?

[Adam43]

*failing to see an issue here*

[Chiefy]

Well I did ask a question - but it's okay, you don't have to reply.

[johntt]

Time for an economics lesson.

When something is scarce it attracts a high price becasue of its rarity, when something is in plentiful supply it has a low price because there is plenty of it about.

Something that is scarce is top-level sportsmen. i.e. drivers of Lewis Hamilton's skill level. Because there are so few people who are that good, there is little in the way of alternatives for teams who want a driver of that standard, so those who are of that standard can charge a lot of money for their services.

Something that is common is people who are capable of flipping burgers in a fast food joint. Theres lots of people who can do this with a bit of training and employers know that there are many out there they can choose from if the current guy quits. Therefore they can pay a small amount.

[GolddustMini]

Originally Posted by Chiefy

I've been reading my AutoHebdo again (French Autosport) and a perplexing snippet has caught my eye on the subject of (love him or hate him) Lewis Hamilton. The magazine reads, and I quote:



Lewis says:



My question: If Lewis Hamilton would be so happy to stay with the team that has part-funded and -crafted him for the last decade, why would he need almost one hundred million euros to do it? McLaren, doubtless, would have to expect some bloomin' good results for that kind of money - and it's not like they haven't already invested in those by aiding him through the junior formulae.

So is Lewis worth it? Does he deserve it? And are F1 drivers being paid too much in the 21st century?

lets face it everyone apart from me is overpayed in the 21st century!

i guess hes worth alot, but be wary of anything that has "according to british tabloid" preceeding anything. whether hes worth a reported £93m to mclaren over the next 5 years is all a question of whether he performs for them and brings in results and thus the money to the team, schumacher would have been on something similar or higher depending on whether the figure is a straight earnings from the team or whether it includes income from personal sponsors and ventures.

[JeremySmith]

Originally Posted by Chiefy

My question: If Lewis Hamilton would be so happy to stay with the team that has part-funded and -crafted him for the last decade, why would he need almost one hundred million euros to do it? McLaren, doubtless, would have to expect some bloomin' good results for that kind of money - and it's not like they haven't already invested in those by aiding him through the junior formulae.

So is Lewis worth it? Does he deserve it? And are F1 drivers being paid too much in the 21st century?

Because that is what McLaren are happy to pay him....The real point of this thread is?

[Chiefy]

Originally Posted by JeremySmith

Because that is what McLaren are happy to pay him....The real point of this thread is?

Sorry to be pedantic - but we could answer most questions in this way and close all threads after two or three posts, and when people do it renders their posts more pointless than those to which they are replying. I'm not here to Lewis-bash, if that's what you're thinking. I'm just striking up debate about drivers, how good they are and whether their pay deals and/or contracts are an honest reflection of that, in the opinions of, well, us guys. If it's not something you want to talk about, then don't. If you think it's harmful to the atmosphere, then close it. But don't moan at me for seeming pointless. The point is a discussion. And frankly that should be obvious.

[Leighton Irwin]

When you look at what mediocre baseball players and basketball players make, to say nothing of the stars, yes the F1 drivers are worth it. Check out the salaries of a good quarterback, running back or receiver in the NFL.
F1 drivers (and all drivers) are putting their lives on the line far more than the other highly paid athletes.
Golfers like Tiger Woods make huge money but at least they have to win it. Then the endorsements roll in.
I do not know what soccer stars make but I expect it is pretty darn good money.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by Chiefy

Sorry to be pedantic - but we could answer most questions in this way and close all threads after two or three posts, and when people do it renders their posts more pointless than those to which they are replying.
...
And frankly that should be obvious.

Well if we are being pedantic, JeremySmith could have closed the thread if he wanted to! The way you phrased your original post alludes to a suggestion that he shouldn't get that money. Jermery's and my post alludes to the fact that in the world we think this is irrelevant and all is fine with the current situation - we wanted to contribute our opinion and did so in a similar way to your post and effectively as you have obviously understood! My point was that there is nothing perplexing about it at all. So, if we are being pedantic, it is you who are trying to stop certain posting and moaning. I'm sorry that I don't see any issue here (and said so).

Now, Lewis and his pots of cash that he is going to get...
(lets stick to the thread topic...)

[Chiefy]

Roger that, message understood.

[ralf fan]

It isn't a question of him 'needing' the money to drive the car but a question of principle. The sponsors and the team make huge profits a small chunk down to Lewis' success. He is well known and so is extremely marketable. It is only fair that Lewis gets a slice of the profit that the team is making due to his success on track.

[Knowlesy]

Until 2012, so that's five seasons (if it means until the end of 2012).

Just under twenty million euros a year then. Err....what was Schumacher on again?

I must admit, I'd have thought the figure would be higher, although I suppose this is flexible depending on success.

Whatever, McLaren are the ones offering the money and they will offer what they deem necessary. Does Lewis deserve it? McLaren think so and I don't think he's going to demand they pay him less!

All sports people are overpaid to an extent, they have been for a long time, but the market allows it. It's all relative to exposure and stuff like that. Lewis is marketable and will therefore command a higher salary automatically, without having to demand it.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

Just under twenty million euros a year then. Err....what was Schumacher on again?

Exactly! If I were Lewis I'd be having some sharp words with my manager.....or my Dad.

[JeremySmith]

And that is just what McLaren are going to pay him..Goodness! imagine once all the moneys from endorsements are added to that figure..Ralf was earning $20 Million at Toyota I think, and Michael well..


http://www.canada.com/topics/sports/...f-2791138de113 This fills in the blanks..

[Super Hans]

Originally Posted by Chiefy

My question: If Lewis Hamilton would be so happy to stay with the team that has part-funded and -crafted him for the last decade, why would he need almost one hundred million euros to do it? McLaren, doubtless, would have to expect some bloomin' good results for that kind of money - and it's not like they haven't already invested in those by aiding him through the junior formulae.

You have to bear in mind that the deal (to back Hamilton) was beneficial to both parties, and not just altruism on McLaren's part. Hamilton got to climb through the ranks in premium machinery, without having to seek funding, and McLaren got first dibs on a future superstar.

[Mr V]

Originally Posted by Chiefy

My question: If Lewis Hamilton would be so happy to stay with the team that has part-funded and -crafted him for the last decade, why would he need almost one hundred million euros to do it? McLaren, doubtless, would have to expect some bloomin' good results for that kind of money - and it's not like they haven't already invested in those by aiding him through the junior formulae.

So is Lewis worth it? Does he deserve it? And are F1 drivers being paid too much in the 21st century?

Well, for a start, McLaren must have offered it (providing that your magazine is accurate) and Lewis would be a mug to decline it.

FWIW, if that article is accurate, McLaren have got Lewis (comparitively) cheap. He would be on 23.25 million euro's per season, he got within a point or 2 of Kimi who is on (reportedly) 50 million euro's per season

[cptkablamo]

jeez...I remember a time when Senna was on a million a race (from memory) and that was soooooo expensive...how times change

[Oldtony]

OK, someones got to do it. I think Lewis, and most other F1 drivers are ridiculously overpaid. They are not a commodity in under supply, when has F1 ever had a shortage of young drivers coming into the sport and going as quick, or quicker than the people they have replaced. Lewis himself is a prime example. IMHO you could go to GP2, A1GP, and other formulas and replace the whole current F1 driver line up and probably not slow the racing down at all.
If Alonso reckons he is worth 0.6 secs per lap (and that's his ego talking) what are the engineers, aerodynamicists, data people who save whole seconds worth? Yet we currently have the situation where to save costs the work they are doing is supposedly an expensive waste, while drivers get huge salaries for a very limmited contribution.
It's the celebrity/ego thing that has been generated by the media around the drivers. A drivers worth is not related to his ability as a driver, but on his ability to attract sponsor dollars.
The best cost saving measure for F1 would be a driver salary cap. Say 1million Euro per season plus 100,000 Euro per point scored. Still a nice little earner and it has a degree of incentive built in. There would also be a fair few bucks on the side from personal endorsements.

[Greenback]

Fabio Capello is paid 6 million pound a year for seating on the bench watching football.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by Greenback

Fabio Capello is paid 6 million pound a year for seating on the bench watching football.

He'll probably get around the same sort of figure when he manages the England team,although he probably won't be watching football when he sits on the bench.

[Ralf's Girl]

Originally Posted by Chiefy

So is Lewis worth it? Does he deserve it? And are F1 drivers being paid too much in the 21st century?

Lewis Hamilton, like any other sportsman, is worth whatever his employer at the time wishes to pay him. Look at footballers - some of them are on astronomical wages, but if their club has the means to pay them that much, then let them get on with it.

Whether somebody "deserves" these wages is another issue - it could be argued that nobody really deserves to get millions of pounds a year, whatever job they do. But racing drivers are working in one of the sporting world's more dangerous occupations, so if anybody deserves to get paid a lot, it's probably them. Add to that the fact that Hamilton's success is good for McLaren and its various sponsors, and to them it probably makes perfectly good business sense to pay him a lot.

[davyboy]

Lewis Hamilton is a super rare comodity... there is only one of him after all. He's also highly sought after by the teams and their commercial supporters. There's a limit to what they will stump up and to what he'll accept. Somewhere around that is what he's paid.

His salary is not a direct measure of his driving capability, his personality, his nationality or anything else. Its purely economics - demand and supply in a free market.

To have it any other way would be to suppress the free market and introduce capping. Maybe the thread topic ought to have been... "should driver compensation capping be introduced into Formula One" [within the context of general budget capping].

[JohnSSC]

Hmmm. F1 a "free market?" It is the only market at this level!

I am with Oldtony on this one except I have this nagging issue about how much others in the Team make. For example, what would a Sam Michael make in comparison to a Nico Rosberg? Or a Ron Dennis in comparison to Patrick Head or Lewis? What compensation are the owners of the teams able to extract?

It may be that what Lewis is paid is in line with other key players on the team. Interesting topic, but it would be even more interesting if we had a contextual basis on which to compare. Heck, on some teams the driver is not paid by the team but by the sponsor they bring. This kind of clouds the issue as not all teams are on the same footing financially.

[werner]

I have no doubt that the best engineers and designers in F1 earn a decent salary, with 6 zero's that is.

[WebberForWDC]

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

All sports people are overpaid to an extent,

But the tennis players, runners and swimmers really are the best, as they have to beat everyone else (assuming they're aren't 3 top swimmers in the same category and only two spots for pre-selection to the world championship and a potential winner has to miss out like poor Alice Mills ).

Meanwhile access to lavish golf clubs and go-karts is rather more limited , and access to millions to fund F3, F Renault and Gp2 adventures even more so.