Villeneuve Boycotted !!!!!!!

Run Free · 1 Jul 2001, 12:46 (Ref:111725)

Well, another retirement for Jacques, due as usual to mechanical problems.

Jacques said recently that maybe he will be FORCED to quit bar: and is evident, from the start of the season, that someone at Bar is trying to make this happen.

SHAME ON BAR !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

EERO · 1 Jul 2001, 14:02 (Ref:111736)

Considering that Craig Pollack has a long time personal relationship with JV and that the team was created around the Canadian driver, this is a completely ridiculous statement.

davebreen · 1 Jul 2001, 14:08 (Ref:111739)

Yep dont think you can blame JV's season on this conspiracy theory that someone in BAR wants him out. Blame the mechanics, blame the engineers, blame bad luck, but someone within the team trying to get rid of him!, the idea seems laughable

Don K · 1 Jul 2001, 14:09 (Ref:111740)

Quote:

Originally posted by Run Free
Jacques said recently that maybe he will be FORCED to quit bar: and is evident, from the start of the season, that someone at Bar is trying to make this happen.

Evident?
Let me guess ...

The team managemant, who had the nerve to allow a fast driver to join the team?
The engineers, who had the nerve to provide his team mate with a competitive car?
His team mate, who had the nerve to beat him in two of the three races in which both drivers managed to finish?

jimclark · 1 Jul 2001, 14:12 (Ref:111742)

And the same is happening to MH over at McLaren, is that correct?

Better yet, and in combination, this thread is ridiculously laughable!!!

Ralf's Girl · 1 Jul 2001, 14:53 (Ref:111769)

The entire team, and its politics, is built around Villeneuve - so why would they sabotage the team's chances in order to get rid of Jacques?

Hardly likely, is it?

Gerard · 1 Jul 2001, 15:17 (Ref:111778)

In an interview which Jacques had with Dutch station RTL5 on saturday, Jacques said he will be at BAR next year.
And I don't think he's making this up, so there you go!

Run Free · 1 Jul 2001, 15:48 (Ref:111797)

Quote:

Originally posted by Ralf's Girl
The entire team, and its politics, is built around Villeneuve

That's not true: he never had a number one status.
This year he also have not the team first number (#9)
And, like it happened in 1999, from the beginning of the season he has had lots of mechanical problems, AND PANIS HAD NOT ! If Bar was a team built around Villeneuve, as you said, Villeneuve should have always the best car, like at ferrari TGF has, but he has not.
If bar was a team built around Villeneuve, he should have the exclusivity of the T-car, as TGF has at ferrari, but he has not.
If Bar was built around Jacques, he should have the most of the media hype, but he has not. If the team was built around him, he should be the second driver to go aut for qualifying, but he's not. So, what?

I remember that part of the team tried to take control of it from the beginning, trying to oust Pollock: don't forget that Jacques is a charter member of the team as well...

Don K · 1 Jul 2001, 15:58 (Ref:111799)

Quote:

Originally posted by Run Free
That's not true: he never had a number one status.

I see.
So last year Zonta was their number one?

Don K · 1 Jul 2001, 16:07 (Ref:111803)

Quote:

Originally posted by Run Free
This year he also have not the team first number (#9)

I think this had been covered a couple of weeks ago. Are you trying to tell us that you posted on those threads without even looking at the answers from the other forum members?

Don K · 1 Jul 2001, 16:09 (Ref:111804)

Quote:

Originally posted by Run Free
And, like it happened in 1999, from the beginning of the season he has had lots of mechanical problems, AND PANIS HAD NOT !

Panis had to retire in Malaysia, Monaco, Canada and Europe with mechanical problems.

EERO · 1 Jul 2001, 16:14 (Ref:111805)

Quote:

Originally posted by Run Free

That's not true: he never had a number one status.

Never???

Gt_R · 1 Jul 2001, 16:15 (Ref:111807)

Run Free...it seems like few, if any, of your arguments stand...

Run Free · 1 Jul 2001, 16:36 (Ref:111816)

Quote:

Originally posted by Don K
Evident?
Let me guess ...

The team managemant, who had the nerve to allow a fast driver to join the team?
The engineers, who had the nerve to provide his team mate with a competitive car?
His team mate, who had the nerve to beat him in two of the three races in which both drivers managed to finish?

Fast for sure, but slower than Jacques....
A competitive car? For sure a more competitive car than Jacques' one, as he has had less than half the mechanical problems Jacques had!
Panis to beat Villeneuve?

Who is ahead of the other in the driver's standings? Who has beaten the other in qualifying? Villeneuve, obviously!
And Panis was able to stay ahead of Villeneuve in ONE ot the TWO race that both finished only because Jacques had to make an extra pitstop due to a puncture, that happened when Villeneuve was well AHEAD of Panis, as usual!

That said, yours is not an argument: you've not responded to me.

Run Free · 1 Jul 2001, 16:44 (Ref:111820)

Quote:

Originally posted by Don K
Panis had to retire in Malaysia, Monaco, Canada and Europe with mechanical problems.

And Jacques had mechanical problems in Australia, Malaysia, Brazil, San Marino, Spain, Austria, Canada, France...

PS: even if Panis had not to retire in Monaco or Europe, he was in the back of the field, had no hope for points and was MILES behind Villeneuve....

Mania · 1 Jul 2001, 16:48 (Ref:111822)

Cmon - just face the facts.

No one is out to sabotage Villuneuve - he`s just having a rotten season - partly because he has a team boss who knows more about big business than he does of F1 - an engine supplier that is looking to ditch the team - and partly because Jacques himself - isent that good anyway.

The BAR team is the most expensive failure in the history of F1. If someone could spend the same amount of money thats been spent on the BAR team on a team like Minardi or Prost for instance - they`d both be challenging for race wins by now.

Don K · 1 Jul 2001, 16:49 (Ref:111823)

Quote:

Originally posted by Run Free
That said, yours is not an argument: you've not responded to me.

Well, before my post the only post you made was your opening statement, which clearly does not include a question.

In my post I implicitely asked you who you meant by "evidently someone at BAR".

And you still haven't answered that question!

Don K · 1 Jul 2001, 17:07 (Ref:111831)

Quote:

Originally posted by Run Free
Panis was able to stay ahead of Villeneuve in ONE ot the TWO race that both finished only because Jacques had to make an extra pitstop due to a puncture, that happened when Villeneuve was well AHEAD of Panis, as usual!

Brasil: 4.Panis, 7.Villeneuve
Spain: 3.Villeneuve, 7.Panis
Austria: 5.Panis, 8.Villeneuve

**Bononi** · 1 Jul 2001, 18:25 (Ref:111845)

Am I having the feeling that JV is embarassed driving a bad... ooopss... BAR ?????
Wasn't his choice to go into that ?
Being forced to leave something he built up ?

Oh... maybe if he swaps seats with Marques

davebreen · 1 Jul 2001, 18:56 (Ref:111849)

Think its time you give up on this one RunFree. Your the only one who has posted who feels that someone is trying to bring down JV from inside BAR. Personally I think JV is in the same vain as Zanardi, great in CART, not up to the job in F1. I know he won the WDC, but in that car i think even Marques would have had a fair chance at winning. Jury is still out on JPM, maybe he will make a more successful crossover

Jay · 1 Jul 2001, 19:27 (Ref:111855)

davebreen, you do remember that Jacques Villeneuve won a World Championship right?

IMO, BAR have the best driver lineup of any of the teams. Two drivers that are capable of winning races, given the right equipment. If these two were with Ferrari, they would clean up even more than TGF and Rubens...

Yet they are both struggling with a car that can't keep pace with the Saubers! To say that Olivier Panis is a better driver than Jacques Villeneuve based on this season would be ignoring the fact that Jacques is actually ahead of Olivier in the points. One weekend Jacques will be ahead, the next it will be Olivier. The problem is that they are competing for 8-12 places on the grid, when they both could be competing for 1-3 given the right cars.

I say BAR would be smart to keep their current pair of drivers, and fire some of their engineers!

Run Free · 1 Jul 2001, 22:26 (Ref:111911)

Quote:

Originally posted by davebreen
. Personally I think JV is in the same vain as Zanardi, great in CART, not up to the job in F1. I know he won the WDC, but in that car i think even Marques would have had a fair chance at winning. Jury is still out on JPM, maybe he will make a more successful crossover

THIS IS THE MORE RIDICULOUS POST I'VE EVER READ ON THIS FORUM!
JPM was on pole in his first race, like Villeneuve? NO! He has a winning car, but is unable even to match the pace of RS, and is constantly slower than him both in qualifying and in the races! To make a more successfull crossover than Villeneuve he should have won his title this year, stating that JV won it in his second year!
And if even Marques would have a fair chance to win the title with 97 Williams, why the higly rated HHF did not win?
C'mon davebreen, your is not reasoning, your is BASHING! Don't be ridiculous!

davebreen · 1 Jul 2001, 22:59 (Ref:111919)

Okay, okay. I am being very harsh on JV. He is a good driver, but you have to admit Run Free that there is NO conspiracy in BAR to out him. That is pure fantasy. As for HHF not performing in a williams, everyone has a bad season, just look at JV this year!!!

Alan Jones · 1 Jul 2001, 23:44 (Ref:111925)

Cospiracy?

Come on, BAR and Honda have both got to pick up the pace, they have clearly gone backwards this year as has Jordan. 10 races in and still having breakdowns is just not good enough and RD at Mac must be thinking the same thing.

Sorry Runfree, no offence intended but you have to lay off on the ole' beer before writing in the forum!

Gt_R · 2 Jul 2001, 10:08 (Ref:112020)

Runfree:"THIS IS THE MORE RIDICULOUS POST I'VE EVER READ ON THIS FORUM!"

Ermm...Runfree..try reading the first post of this thread...

Jay: "To say that Olivier Panis is a better driver than Jacques Villeneuve based on this season would be ignoring the fact that Jacques is actually ahead of Olivier in the points."

I remembered not too long ago, somebody said that statistics are not a good judgement of a driver, even if he wins 3 WDC with different engines. But to be fair, Panis is not better than Villeneuve, but neither is JV much better, if any, than Panis.

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