Brabham BT23

[Bryan Miller]

I have been to Goulburn , and returned with another Brabham.F2-8-65 , BT23B-1 according to David McKinney.Strange numbers on LHS. rear of frame.

[David Irwin]

To my knowledge BT23 were not built by Arch Motors, they were built by Racing Fabrications, thus the stamped number in the frame begins with 'RF'.

[allenbrown]

Is this the right place to ask about BT23C-11? Steve Mills has been in touch with me asking what became of her. He was with Cullen when the car was doing F2 events in 1970. For some reason, he can still rememebr the chassis number.

Anyone know?

Allen

[Chris Stanfield]

Originally Posted by allenbrown

Is this the right place to ask about BT23C-11? Steve Mills has been in touch with me asking what became of her. He was with Cullen when the car was doing F2 events in 1970. For some reason, he can still remember the chassis number.

Anyone know?

Allen

Back in the mid 70s ('74 or '75) I raced this car at Kirkistown (home of the 500 club) a couple of times. At that time it had a full race Kent engine (built by Holbay). That is to say, a full race 1.6 litre, but still the pushrod engine with about 170bhp (twin (45 DCOE?) Webers, dry sump, forged rods, pistons and crank, etc). The twin cam version, as used in Formula Atlantic at that time put out about 220 bhp, if I remember correctly. The car was actually owned by a car dealer called Noel Crymble. On my second outing (it was allowed to race in Clubmans "A", despite being rear engined) the engine self destructed and it wasn't completely rebuilt when the car went back to the owner. I think I still have a couple of pictures from then. It had a rear wing at the time.

I didn't score any points, so you can see how good I wasn't.

Chris

[David McKinney]

I have the 1990 owner as Mark Raymond (or Rayment) on this side of the Irish Sea

[Andrew Fellowes]

Originally Posted by David McKinney

I have the 1990 owner as Mark Raymond (or Rayment) on this side of the Irish Sea

BT23C-11
Mark Raymont, late 80's to 2003 with Holbay & Mk8

forgot to add now possibly in a museum in Europe

[Chris Townsend]

In January 1982 Autosport we have for sale by Northdown Racing of Ripley, Surrey, BT23C-2 [the ex Gethin/Don Godden car last seen for sale by Low Cost Racing in A/S in March 1973, and BT23-1, last seen being raced in Ireland by Maurice Stirling in 1973.

[Steve Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by Chris Townsend

In January 1982 Autosport we have for sale by Northdown Racing of Ripley, Surrey, BT23C-2 [the ex Gethin/Don Godden car last seen for sale by Low Cost Racing in A/S in March 1973.

Originally Posted by Allen Brown

I've been working through this thread identifying BT23 Sprint Brabhams
The one I can't identify is:

Brabham-Ford BT23C (1.6) - Maurice Ogier once in 1972

The BT23C should fit into our histories but I haven't been able to connect it.

Allen

Just got off the phone with Maurice Ogier in the Channel Islands. The BT23C that he ran was the ex-Lythgoe car that Peter Gethin drove - chassis 2. Ogier bought the car less engine and fitted a Vegantune TC which he sourced from Tommy Elton. When he sold the car on at the end of 1972 it went to Low Cost Racing.

[allenbrown]

Originally Posted by Steve Wilkinson

Just got off the phone with Maurice Ogier in the Channel Islands. The BT23C that he ran was the ex-Lythgoe car that Peter Gethin drove - chassis 2. Ogier bought the car less engine and fitted a Vegantune TC which he sourced from Tommy Elton. When he sold the car on at the end of 1972 it went to Low Cost Racing.

Just spotted another event that Ogier took in: BARC SW Gurston Down 25 Jun 1972 (MN 29 Jun 1972 p26) - he was third in class behind Geoff Inglis (Brabham BT14/21 s/c) and Bruce Dean (Lola).

[Alan Brown]

Has this advert been noticed before?

Autosport 26 February 1970: “Chris Jackson wishes to dispose of his fabulous Brabham BT23C/21B. Jig built at Racing Frames, new body. This car was professionally built and maintained regardless of cost, is better than new and ready to race in top class F3 having been fully tested and sorted, but is unraced.” [Chippenham Wilts]

[Andrew Fellowes]

Originally Posted by Alan Brown

Has this advert been noticed before?

Autosport 26 February 1970: “Chris Jackson wishes to dispose of his fabulous Brabham BT23C/21B. Jig built at Racing Frames, new body. This car was professionally built and maintained regardless of cost, is better than new and ready to race in top class F3 having been fully tested and sorted, but is unraced.” [Chippenham Wilts]

Autoline Garage is no more, the only garage on Bath Road being a BP servo and there seems to be no C Jackson living close by.
Maintained regardless of cost and unraced is an interesting combination.

Andrew

[Andrew Fellowes]

Originally posted by Chris Townsend
and BT23-1, last seen being raced in Ireland by Maurice Stirling in 1973.

Chris

I bought BT23-1 from Jon Bradburn in late 84. He drove it a couple of times in HSCC events painted white, a colour he liked. Bradburn & Wedge were on the brink of collapse thanks to a massive loan from the bank to expand their business. -a time when the banks were throwing the stuff around. I see he has quite a few cars for sale these days!

[Chris Townsend]

Looking forward to the BT23s. I know that 23-8 [built with an Alfa engine for Galli] was still extant in Italy a year or two back.

Chris

[Andrew Fellowes]

OK, so who is going to start the BT23's? I know zilch apart from owning BT23-1 in 1985, ex Sir Jack, Tommy Reid and still in the UK, -?

[Chris Townsend]

ok Andrew, Bryan et al, shoot holes, add things to this!

BT23

1: Works car 1967 for Brabham. Sold to Tommy Reid and retained to 1970. Then Walter Kinnear. To Nelson Todd 1971. Maurice Stirling 1973.

2: Works car 1967 for Hulme and Gardner.1969 Picchio Rosso for Enzo Corti. 1970 Vittorio Brambilla

3: Works car 1967 for Gardner. 1968: Xavier Perrot. Destroyed in accident at Nurburgring? !969 by Perrot

4: Winkelmann 1967 for Rees. 1968 Walter Habbeger. 1969 Bruno Frey [this number sometimes ascribed to Corti's car which was given the wrong plate at a rebuild]

5: Winkelmann 1967 for Rindt and van Lennep. Taken by Hulme to 1968 Tasman and written off.

6: Witley Racing Syndicate 1967 for Robin Widdows. this car or chassis 9 to Canada 1968 for Dave Webster.

7: Mitter, 1967. to Norbert Linderman 1968, then Helmut Gall 1970, destroyed in accident

8: Nanni Galli 1967 with Alfa engine. 1968 Giorgio Pianta. 1969: Etienne Vigoureux as F3 car.

9: David Bridges for Brian Redman. This car or 6 to Canada in 1968.

23C

1: Works car 1967 for Brabham/Gardner. 1968: Frank Williams for Piko Troberg/Harry Stiller [as F3]/Piers Courage/Laurence Brownlie. 1969: Williams - Graham McRae/Alistair Walker. 1970: Walter Kinnear [described as ex Courage/Walker]

2: Lythgoe: Gethin 1968. 1969 Whitmore for Don Godden. For sale by Low Cost Racing 1.3.73.

3 Not known

4: Chris Lambert. ?Destroyed in Lambert's accident at Zandvoort 68

5: Winkelmann 1968 for Rindt. 1969: Ec. Ecosse: Graham Birrell
1973: Joe Applegarth

6: Max Moseley 1968. 1969: Peter Parnell [ZA]; 1970: Arnold Charlton

7: Williams 1968 for Courage. 1969: Roly Levis

8: 1968: Kurt Ahrens. 1969-70 Bernd Terbeck. 1977. Bill Morris

9: 1968: Church Farm Racing for Bell, 1968-9 Laurence Brownlie

10: 1968: Malcolm Payne. 1969 Garth McGilliwie [ZA] 1970 Tony Dean
1971: Rod Pickering. 1972: Bob Howlings. 1973: Bob Snelson

11: Winkelmann 1968 for Rees and Mitter. 1969: Bill Ivy, then to Brian Cullen after Ivy's bike crash. Kept by Cullen until end 71

12: Williams 1968 for Manfredini. 1969: Williams for Guthrie then sold to Bob Gerard for Widdows/Hart. 1970: Gerry Tyzack. 1971: Maybe Robin Darlington

13 Not built

14: Williams for Carlos Piaretti in Temporada

15: Eduardo Copello in Temporada

16: Williams for Juan Manuel Bordeu in Temporada. 1969: Williams for Courage and Ickx, then sold to Alistair Walker. 1970: Walker then sold to Gagliardi. 1971: Perhaps the Marcello Gallo BT23C running as F3 in 1971

17: Jorge Cuperio in Temporada. 1969: Perrot replacing w/o 23. 1970 Baron Robertson and 1971 then Kelvin Cameron . Have my doubts about the NZ thing

Chris