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14 Jun 2011, 00:41 (Ref:2898501) | #776 | ||
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My post relating to the population comparison of Austin to Melbourne was more in assessing the number of taxpayers a loss or subsidy would be drawn from. Given the revenue figures that were projested to be shared amongst the teams over the next 10 years I think we can safely assume that the race will cost double the present figure to sanction by then. The documents were made available; briefly; by a Texas court under freedom of information laws there. Are they still available? |
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14 Jun 2011, 00:58 (Ref:2898508) | #777 | ||
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Wait till they see the night life. It ain't Indianapolis ToTo. If that ain't enough there is always... Hey, somethings you just have to find out about by yourself.
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14 Jun 2011, 01:04 (Ref:2898510) | #778 | ||
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17 Jun 2011, 20:07 (Ref:2901112) | #779 | ||
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It looks like Austin taxpayers will not get stuck with making an annual contribution to Bernie's rights fee. According to this article, the state will pay him $25M/year and the promoters will contribute $4M/year. However, this deal still seems confusing. The source of the $25M/year is the state's Major Events Trust Fund and that money can only be formally requested by a city where a ""major event" is taking place. The sponsoring city is expected to put up part of the cost of funding the event. So one is left to wonder exactly how will the deal work. Is it definitely true that the Tavo and Red will be paying the $4m/year and not the city?
New deal for Austin's Formula One calls for no contribution of city funds Proposed arrangement lets taxpayers off the hook for races, city officials say. By Eric Dexheimer and Sarah Coppola AMERICAN-STATESMAN STAFF Published: 9:44 p.m. Thursday, June 16, 2011 City of Austin officials say they are nearing completion of a contract with organizers of the Formula One race scheduled to begin in Austin next summer that would eliminate nearly all local taxpayer support for the event. The city's new arrangement would not affect the estimated $25 million annual subsidy state officials have committed to providing to support the internationally popular race. But it could deflate concerns of local critics who objected to using city taxpayer money to support the race. But if approved, the new agreement would have Formula One promoters place an estimated $4 million into a state trust fund account every year for the 10-year duration of the contract. The local payment is necessary for Formula One promoters, led by Austin's Tavo Hellmund and supported by auto magnate Red McCombs, to leverage a $25 million state subsidy through the Major Events Trust Fund, an economic development program administered by the comptroller's office... Last edited by BobHWS; 17 Jun 2011 at 20:18. |
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18 Jun 2011, 00:25 (Ref:2901197) | #780 | ||
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Today the temp was 105F ..
The latest construction pics from Austin, they have one year from today to complete the facility... http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-photos/6698//?page=2 They will do it! |
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18 Jun 2011, 00:37 (Ref:2901202) | #781 | ||
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20 Jun 2011, 17:23 (Ref:2902476) | #782 | |
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20 Jun 2011, 23:24 (Ref:2902628) | #783 | |||
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21 Jun 2011, 00:10 (Ref:2902639) | #784 | ||
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I heard from a friend that worked on the TV crew (U.S. contract employee) at Montreal they were saying that the USGP may be done in conjunction with Brazil later in the year.
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21 Jun 2011, 00:11 (Ref:2902641) | #785 | ||
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21 Jun 2011, 21:03 (Ref:2903128) | #786 | ||
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It's time for Tavo and Red to clinch the deal with the State of Texas and get it to commit to handing over $250M over the next ten years to pay most of Bernie's rights fee. So they released a "study" that supposedly shows the "direct economic impact" of the race on the Austin economy. However, as an economist quoted in this article points out (and as I've pointed out above), such "studies" are viewed very skeptically by academic economists.
Study projects large economic windfall from F1 race By Eric Dexheimer AMERICAN-STATESMAN STAFF Tuesday, June 21, 2011 A Formula One race in Austin next year would generate just under $288 million in direct economic impact for the area, according to an estimate released Monday by promoters of the race. That spending would produce $26.6 million in new tax revenue for the state, according to the study. The numbers are crucial to F1 race promoters' efforts to secure $25 million in public incentive payments from a state program designed to lure large, primarily sporting events to Texas for their economic development potential... The study released Monday was written by Don Hoyte, a former economist for the comptroller's office who now runs a company that produces economic impact studies and advises trust fund applicants on how to secure money through the state program... ...Opponents — among them economists — have responded that studies purporting to calculate tax revenue attributable to individual events are imprecise at best and wildly inaccurate at worst. "I've read hundreds of these things," Craig Depken, an associate professor of economics at the University of North Carolina at Charlotte who specializes in measuring the financial impact of large sporting events, told the Statesman last year. "I don't think I've seen one that wouldn't be panned by economists. They are all very rosy projections." |
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21 Jun 2011, 22:07 (Ref:2903166) | #787 | |||
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21 Jun 2011, 23:46 (Ref:2903215) | #788 | |||
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Bob how many tickets did they sell for Canada? do you know by any chance, or what were the attendance figures for the last three years... |
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22 Jun 2011, 02:54 (Ref:2903245) | #789 | ||
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I don't know the exact numbers, but the race has been officially announced as a sell-out the last three years that it was held (2011, 2010, 2008). News media generally report 100,000 3-day tickets sold each year. In my experience, almost all seats are actually filled for qualifying and practice and, if the weather is nice, most seats are filled for Friday practice. So, in general, race day attendance is 100,000+ and 3-day attendance is about 300,000.
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22 Jun 2011, 14:29 (Ref:2904276) | #790 | ||
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yup, we aint no Turkey here, or China, or this or that.....
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22 Jun 2011, 21:33 (Ref:2904460) | #791 | ||
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I think that for China and Turkey, a large part of the issue is probably the ticket prices for the F1 race itself. Watching the V8 Supercars event from Shanghai in 2005, there looks to be a fair number of people in the main grandstand at least.
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22 Jun 2011, 23:43 (Ref:2904530) | #792 | |||
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From an auto mag:
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23 Jun 2011, 00:34 (Ref:2904536) | #793 | |||
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When I read that "As of now, there is no public transportation to the track and only one decent two-lane road (FM 812), which will be restriped to accommodate race-day traffic," I can't get the image of Kramer repainting the lines on his adopted highway out of mind. |
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23 Jun 2011, 01:29 (Ref:2904541) | #794 | ||
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From the Statesman today 22 June 2011. "Local lawsuit filed against state’s Formula One subsidy". The legal brief filed: http://bit.ly/iBqGWZ. The comments: http://bit.ly/jZRvBJ.
What we have here is: Who's money is it? There will definitely be losers here. To be continued... Last edited by ujoint; 23 Jun 2011 at 01:38. |
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23 Jun 2011, 13:07 (Ref:2904740) | #795 | |||
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Think about this for a second, Bernie won't even talk to you unless the money gets flashed in his face, so whoever did that initial flashing of money has not told the government about the pursestrings required or who in the end is responsible for shortfalls, which is usually a sign the math doesn't work out. Last edited by Flyin Ryan; 23 Jun 2011 at 13:21. |
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23 Jun 2011, 14:03 (Ref:2904750) | #796 | ||
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on the other hand the group building the track believe that one of the purposes of this state event fund is to provide funds to events which will in turn generate enough additional taxes to offset the state's contribution. in an ideal world it will be at minimum a revenue neutral subsidy....this of course remains to be seen.
what we do know is that so far they haven't received any gov't money, yet the owners/developers are still going ahead with construction. i imagine a lot of people have already dug deep into their own pockets to start building something that only has positive implications for motor sports at large in the region. so far all the money which has been spent is theirs and still they get condemned for trying to get access to public money which is only there for events like this. go figure! one would hope that they have a plan in place to borrow the money in case the state backs out. if their numbers are to be believed (even half believed) then they should have no problem securing the additional funds and in the end may be able to secure a better deal from BE (something comparable to Montreal's sanction fees) because they are on their own and F1 needs a race in the USA. |
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23 Jun 2011, 14:21 (Ref:2904752) | #797 | |||
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The way that Montreal got a better deal ($15M/year vs. Austin's $25-30M/year) was to call Bernie's bluff when he tried to triple their rights fee after the 2008 race. Montreal told Bernie they could live without F1 and so they lost the race in 2009. A year later, under pressure from the teams and the falling popularity of races in nontraditional locations, Bernie realized that F1 needed Montreal more than Montreal needed F1 and so he had to give Montreal the same deal ($15M/year) that it had offered during the negotiations in 2008. I think it's the only time in Bernie's life that he lost a negotiation. Now that the track is under construction and the investors have sunk a lot of money into it, Bernie has them in his pocket. Presumably, he also has a contract stating that his rights fee will be $25-30M. The exact number is not sure because it's not clear if Bernie gets just the $25M from the state or the $25M plus the $4M from the city or the promoter. |
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23 Jun 2011, 14:25 (Ref:2904754) | #798 | ||
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It cannot be good news for Tavo when the editor of a major American car magazine like Autoweek warns the city that it is making a big mistake getting into bed with a man like Bernie.
An Open Letter to the Austin, Texas, City Council and the citizens of that fair city By DUTCH MANDEL on 6/22/2011 As the editorial director of America's largest racing magazine and a guy who has grown up around racing and racers, who has worked for a professional race team and who was weaned on horsepower and Castrol fumes, I have two words for the Austin City Council and its constituents before Thursday's vote to bless the proposed 2012 Austin Grand Prix: Run away... |
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23 Jun 2011, 14:43 (Ref:2904761) | #799 | |||
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23 Jun 2011, 15:27 (Ref:2904785) | #800 | |||
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