Pictures of my (finally) finished Camaro for Camaroz

[Al Weyman]

Oh it does have a four bolt mains block as well.

[zefarelly]

Originally Posted by Al Weyman

Thanks Zef I appreicate that comment.

and hats off to you and anyone who does the lot, or even tries, as many of us do, its the only way I can afford to. when you get a result ( like top ten for me) and you've beaten a fat wallet racer in a faster car, it makes it all worthwhile

[dtype38]

And when you eventually get an outright win you won't stop grinning for a month

[Al Weyman]

Thanks guys.

That will be the day dtype but I think with the cc/weight regs in the CTCRC they have some nicely balanced equalised cars out there which meant I got some good action even though I was a couple of seconds down on the leaders. I must admit I got a particularly good buzz after swapping places a couple of times with a Mk 1 Lotus Cortina I managed to out power him out of the last corner at Pembrey to finish 4th.

[dtype38]

Nice one Al.

And never give up hope for the win. My first one came after three of the fastest blokes on the grid didn't come to a meeting, one of the other fastest had a mechanical problem in qualifying and had to start from the back of the grid, and the only other bloke quicker than me broke half shaft on the green flag lap. The one at the back caught me on the last lap and I only beat him by half the length of my bonnet! But a win's a win, as they say :-))

[Al Weyman]

Oh I did win my class once in the black car when the same thing happened at Mallory, the rest of the field fell off or broke down! At least I got to take home the laurel leafs even though I was not asked on the parade lap and I had to go up to race control afterwards and ask for them (well I did just managed to coast home myself).

[dtype38]

Exactly! And shame on the organisers.... I would applaud that as a well deserved class win. If anyone suggests it was by "default" then just point out that at least you can prepare a car that can do a whole race, then drive it on the black stuff all the way to the end

[Jeff Barley]

Hi Al!.. Bit late, but just wanted to say "Good luck" with the car.. She looks great.. Just keep her on the black stuff "y'all Bow Tie warrior!"
Jeff

[Al Weyman]

Thanks Jef, appreciate that.

[tigerbill65]

Al, if you can borrow a tyre temp gauge, this will help
tell you if tow and pressures are right , when you test it next/ race it.
also if you can increase the neg camber, within the rules of course.
does the outer part of the front tyre get trashed.

[Al Weyman]

I have a lot of negative camber on the car nearly 3 degrees as you will see when I stick some hard corneriing shots up when I get them,

I did this before I parked the car up over 10 years ago and it was handling great on street tyres on 16 inch diameter and wider rims but the combination of more weight on the front end and having to raise the suspension and narrower 15 inch diameter reims albeit with Dunlop so called treaded 'race' tyres seems to have introduced this understeer that I don't recollect it having before. In fact the last time I raced it was around the tight bends of Cadwell and as I recollect it felt real good and easy to get the rear end to step out.

The edges of the tyres are getting trashed and I have got to sort this as they are quite expensive to buy for what they are.

[thatorangething]

Hi Al, good to see that you're out racing. In reply to your question to myself on another thread, no progress on my IROC car, been too busy with LAK's Falcon & Griff recently and other customer work, at least i'm being paid to prep and support nice big V8s,at some spectacular meetings,so can't be all bad!
I have found the owner of two more IROC cars, at least one of which is in this country,maybe the other one too,not sure! So that makes at least five surviving cars from the Banjo Mathews chassised grid including mine,yours and IROC's own one. He also supported the story that many of the cars were lost at a racing school in the US. Any progress with yours?
Regards
Peter

[Al Weyman]

Hiya Orange thingy. I think Gerry Marshall died driving one but I don't think that and possible these others that have turned up are space framed Matthew's chassis but modified road cars that first replaced the Porche's. As I understand it from Penske Brian Rice only imported yours and mine to run in ASCAR.

I have made a big strides with it last weekend as it happens. You may remember I wrote some doughnut went mad with the plasma cutter and removed the rear steel panels to save about 20 ib max. Anyhow these panels are just not available for the post 76 and for the pre 76 they are about $400 a side! Also silly unobtainable bits like rear trunk hinges that are welded on etc etc. I bought a complete 1979 car off eBay which as much as I love Camaro's is going to have to donate it's rear end so I can get the project underway. Also another result it also has the very last model Z/28 bonnet and hood scoop which is the last one IROC ran when they disbanded. So hopefully I can get it back underway now.

[thatorangething]

Please read my last post again, and accept that the information came from the owner of the two other cars,not a second hand source... If he chose to lie to me in response to my very specific questions, would be very odd indeed, as he obviously had a great depth of knowledge and authority on the subject, and was keen to help. Not prepared to get further in to the subject on a public forum i'm afraid, would be an invasion of the owner's privacy. Call me on 07841 453975 to move on from here,only trying to help.
Regards
Peter

[devon kev]

Hi Al idont normally venture in this area but hey i like the pic's cracking car mate

[Al Weyman]

Here are some action shots from Pembrey (don't worry I managed to nail the Mini in the end . The mud on the front is after an excursion into a swamp after the tyres went off. I think the shots show the car rolling more at the back tending to lift a front wheel. I am hoping more roll stiffness at the back will help the situation. What do you think?



Pictures by Oliver Read

[Al Weyman]

Hey Peter sorry mate I was only relaying what I had been told, secondhand information eh, no wonder its not admissable in court, did not mean to ruffle any feathers. Look if we get enough of these IROCs together maybe we can do a demo race somewhere, now that would be fun. :-)

I will say this though and I will see if I can find the site on the net, during my research into the IROC cars I happened apon several so say 'genuine' cars in the states that I am afraid just were not, I think I have a picture of a purple one at home and it fooled me at first till I started looking carfully at the rollcage chassis members and it was not the real McCoy. I came acrss a red one and that was not right despite all his claims. Another bright yellow car I came across and even exchanged emails with the guy was also quite clearly not kosher. The guy reckon he was gonna spend a bundle on it to bring it back to condition but it clearly was not right and had the totally wrong cage and a GM floor! Like all this historic stuff you have to be careful, I once knew a guy who built a replica Maserati Birdcage for a customer who sold it to a ...... er maybe I had better leave that one there!

[Jeff Barley]

Originally Posted by thatorangething

Hi Al, good to see that you're out racing. In reply to your question to myself on another thread, no progress on my IROC car, been too busy with LAK's Falcon & Griff recently and other customer work, at least i'm being paid to prep and support nice big V8s,at some spectacular meetings,so can't be all bad!
I have found the owner of two more IROC cars, at least one of which is in this country,maybe the other one too,not sure! So that makes at least five surviving cars from the Banjo Mathews chassised grid including mine,yours and IROC's own one. He also supported the story that many of the cars were lost at a racing school in the US. Any progress with yours?
Regards
Peter

Hey Guys.. I have a confession.. I owned one of the other banjo matthews IROC cars that came to the UK.. Rescued it but then lost my storage and had to (gulp) send it to that great paddock in the sky.. must have been about 5 years ago now..

Jeff

[Al Weyman]

What exactly did you do with it Jeff, cut it up or what?

The reason I ask is the bloke I bought mine off bought it off a guy who tried to auction it and it never made the reserve (you?). I know my man told me the bloke was gonna break it and had already got a buyer for the rear axle. This would have been about 5 years ago. The odd thing is my car is a red orange colour same colour I guess as Peter's (thatorangethings) car which is presumable what Peter got the idea for his peusdo name.

Now my car is genuine I can guarantee that and it is marked up with the Banjo Matthews chassis number and IROC number. I also have original pictures of the car and an article from Road & Track where they road tested it and the roll cage etc is identical and is definitely the real Macoy.. So if the one you had is not mine or Peters and you destroyed it or broke it up well I am really confused now. If you did destroy it do you realise there is one of these (or was) in the Dale Earhardt display at the Corvette Musium so I was told by IROC, bad move I think if you did cut one up.

[thatorangething]

Hi all, I hope that it does turn out that the car you once owned, Jeff, is the car Al now owns. Would have been a shame to have lost one. Thankfully my car stayed within the racing world despite it's neglect for so many years.

My car is blue, Al, or at least the original colour is a dusky metallic blue, under the white paint that it ran in Thundersaloons (issues 1 & 4 of Rolling Thunder). The original colour exactly matches the colour the car had as Cover/centrefold in Custom Car, and in an article about Ascar in Street Machine in 1982.

'Thatorangething' dates back much earlier to a bright orange Citroen racer that i built back in the nineties, it became a common reference to our 'slightly unusual' car.
Cheers
Peter

[Jeff Barley]

Hi Al and Thatorangething..

I'll tell you what I know / recollect.. First up I asked a friend of mine to scrap the car because it was in a real state and I had lost the storage..Had too many other projects on the go :-( .. However I guess there is the chance that it was not scrapped and might have been sold without my knowledge..

Anyways.. This is what I have..

I was aware that there were two ex-IROC camaros in the UK at that time, both were imported (in the late 1970's) by Brian Rice and Tony wolfe.. They also imported an ex-dirt-track '69 camaro (who the last owner convinced everyone was actually an ex-circuit racer, but the less said about that the better.. ) and a mustang.. and thats another story.. Both IROC's were ex-Banjo Matthews chassied cars, but built/ ran by Penske..

One was imported by Tony woolf and had been owned by Gerry Hibbert..There is a connection with a UK race team (ABRAXAS RACING) who I believe a guy called Paul Nash was involved with.. I don't know if they ran the car for Gerry..It was eventually stored at AC cars in Hammersmith (Andy Chester) from whom I bought it as a basket case.. It was all there but in real sad condition..This was a spare IROC that was available for general use if any of the regular cars were lost/ damaged.. I have a note that it was driven by Whittington (?) Regatoni and Andretti at some point

The other IROC was owned by Jim Mensley who had bought it from Brian Rice.. I believe that IROC was an ex-Unser car (Jim ran it as #18).. Jim sold it to Richard Scantlebury, who sold it to Terry Fletcher, who sold it to Roy Yates. Roy sold it to paul Heritage and it then ended up with Andy Reossi.. I saw photos of that car when it was "Orange" or maybe "red"..

Does any of this help you guys?

Jeff

[thatorangething]

Hi Jeff, mine's the Hibbert car, and is still stickered up as was in Thundersaloons. Car is quite distinctive as it still has it's IROC Norris industries steel rims on the front, but with low profile tyres, and massive 3-piece rims on the back, with biiiiig slicks! Was stored at Brands - apparently for eight years or so- until JP took over and sold everything in a big clearout.
Tony Wolfe described my car, which was once his car, as IROC car 10, the spare car.The other - Al's one - as car 11. He helpfully supplied me with the copies of Custom Car and Street machine. He also put me in touch with Robin Gray, who set my car up for UK circuits and looked after it for some time.
It later ran as car 43 according to the 1989 Thundersaloon programmes that came with the car, With Hibbert/Prior as drivers, car now has Hibbert/Ralph on the screen. Would be great to find pictures of either car in Ascar or Thundersaloons, and of course the '78,'79,&'80 IROC championships. Any video footage from any of those series would be fantastic. Thanks, it's interesting to see a bit more of the puzzle! I also wonder where the engine that powered my car to a 51.3 round Brands in 1989 went to?!

[Jeff Barley]

Yep, thats my car!.. I was one of the Directors of Brands before it was sold to JP.. The car was stored at BH for a couple of years but she started to get in the way because we were always having to move her around . She had sat on an old huge trailor but was still awkward to move..
I asked Chris Epstein (Who ran the Automotive Section) to scrap it but that was some time before JP bought the circuit(s)..It was never owned by JP or the Group.. Sounds like Chris sold the car instead of scrapping it which is a bit of a suprise..

[Al Weyman]

Ah right that makes sense Peter, easy to jump to conclusions, I must have had orange cars on the brain as mine was orange when I got it and the one IROC renovated for their 25th anniversary display at Daytona was also orange, I have some shots of that somewhere, I think the obsession with orange was because the car Dale Earhardt had a brief excursion in was the orange one. The original colour of mine was in fact a not very inspiring light camel beige bit like the old Cortinas. I will put it back to that colour for the sake of orginality.

I see in this months MotorSport there is a shot of Niki Lauda sitting in an IROC in 1978 apparently he qualified well and lost the clutch at the start.

I still say these cars have more history at least as far as famous bums behind the wheel than any other car I can think of and that is why IMHO they are worth renovating and I am certainly going to do just that! Funny enough my mate who I bought it off felt the same way and that is the reason he boiught it because he could not bare the thought of it being broken up.

Actually as far as having a current racing life the earlier production based cars are probably more usable than ours as they could race in FIA historics but heck from what I have read the real halcyon days of IROC really started with the introduction of the Banjo Matthews cars.

[Al Weyman]

Sorry guys I was writing my last post before I read yours.

That was very interesting stuff Jef thamks a lot a big help.

Peter as I said I have a copy of a Road & Track article on the car and I also have several Havoc videos with the cars in action including the massive shunt when Mario was driving the black car and lost it the front of the field with predicable consequences, i.e takes out half the field. Funny enough Al Unser was driving my beige car that day so that checks out, he missed the main carnage and escaped with a ding in the door (there is still a slight dent in the roll cage now which may well have been collected then). There is some good in car footage from my car as well.

I also have a cd with some original posters from the era featuring the championship. I am in the graphics business and I will run you one off if you like (free of charge), it is a little grainy as I have had to reproccess it as the picture was not perfect but it is still pretty good.