ROCKINGHAM - what is our opinion?

[chunder]

I am not a racer so feel free to lambast me but I know a bit about the place.

Its shame it hasnt taken off but we are not Yanks so we dont go for the same things as they do.

ASCAR could have been very good, but it was completely mismanaged and utterly shockingly promoted in the early days, hence now why its full of washed up hot rodders.

The CART thing was an abject failure as the track wasnt allowed to be bhuilt the way it should have been, with more banking and a shorter distance.

I think its cards are marked which is a shame ciz as a fcility its second to none.

Also sad to hear comments from other formula, but in Rockinghams opinion the oval formulae are why people are going to watch, even on an RS day! and you are on their turf, they seem to think they are the best thing since sliced bread, weird that isnt it!!

[R59]

Ahem!

Not lambasting but....

I am not a washed up hot rodder. Neither is 2006/2007 Hot Rod World Champion Carl Boardley. And neither is multiple world champion Colin White who almost won Class1 in the Britcar 24hrs at the weekend.

And I don't think Hunter Abbott, Duncan Gray, Skid Carrera, and others would fit that bill either. None of US have raced HotRods (to my knowledge) - Hunter : British GT's, Duncan : twice European Formula 3000 Champion with Fred Goddard Racing, Skid : Ferrari Maranello Challenge, Me : Britcar V8 Supercars, Dunlop Track & Race Cars.

The CART thing was only a failure for one thing. CART.
They were (and still are) losing money. Coming over here at the time when they were in deep doo doo cost them a packet.

More banking and shorter distance would have made it more favourable for NASCAR. As I understand it, it was input from CART people that made it how it is.

I do feel for the guys in the Ford Saloons, and the Fiesta's. The organisation was abysmal the more you look at it, and when you consider the sacrifices we(the V8's) made - losing our "build up" - part of the razzamataz that is our kind of racing, and losing 6 laps out of our second race because of delays in our refuelling session, I still can't understand why they managed to lose something like 20 minutes out of the meeting.

I would hazard a guess - lack of manpower - being most of it.

There are NOT ENOUGH people prepared to wear orange! And because of that, motor racing meetings often run on skeleton crews of marshals, which leads to delays in clearing up after incidents, and the inevitable curfew infractions.

Yes, most of the people who regularly attend Rockingham come to see the oval formulae. At present, to see the pickups, and to hear the v8's!! And especially see the winners do donuts!! We are there to entertain the crowd.

Though at this meeting in question - they (the majority) came because they were Ford enthusiasts and wanted to see John Steward racing.. (I just couldn't resist that one - as his is a Ford Taurus(!)!).

We should draw a line under this, and let the MSA's report help us learn from the mistakes and make sure that it does not happen again.

[JohnMiller]

Originally Posted by racing59

twice European Formula 3000 Champion

I think not...

[R59]

1997 & 1998 : http://www.duncangray.co.uk/f3000.shtml

Your thoughts on F3's on the Oval would be appreciated John....

[chunder]

Sorry mate, but crowd figures speak for themselves, people just dont wanna watch it! Despite the alleged quality of the grid, the disparity between the laptimes suggests otherwise! Any time I ahve been the racing has been strung out after about 5 laps!

I used to know a few people that did the racing in ASCAR and they were so hamstrung with what they could do with their cars that they left the series. For many reasons, eitehr the team wouldnt let them dial the car in coz they were pay drivers, or they were getting a little too close to their better know team mate!

I beg to differ about Colin by the way, he was a top talent a few years back but ASCAR seems to have knocked a bit of speed off bless him, but fair play to him for racing at all after what happaned a couple of years back.

Its a damn shame about the track but we are not Americans and we dont need entertaining like that, we dont get silly about "wrecks" and have no ownership issues with Ford and Chevy.
Besides, we already have that sort of racing and it happens just about every Saturday night at a short oval near you!!

[mini1400]

Originally Posted by racing59

There are NOT ENOUGH people prepared to wear orange! And because of that, motor racing meetings often run on skeleton crews of marshals, which leads to delays in clearing up after incidents, and the inevitable curfew infractions.

Well there are according to Dave P. At the marshal's training at Brands he said 'come along to Rockingham, it's a great venue, but we we can run meetings with less than a dozen people'.

I did the BTCC there this year, the facilities for the crowd are great, but for the marshal - nowt...

[Chigley]

I did the BTCC there this year, the facilities for the crowd are great, but for the marshal - nowt...

The BTCC event was promoted by Rockingham and run by BARC, both of whom have withdrawn interest in the racing side of the circuit.

but for the marshal - nowt

OK, what do you call dedicated transport to sign on, dedicated transport to post, free lunch provided by the organiser, gauranteed finish on time thanks to curfew, each post having a hut for shelter and keeping personal kit dry, flaggies having purpose stands to flag from (no standing in puddles). The oval having the UK's only working land line so that everyone is aware of what is going on instantly.

Stop being blinkered! Attack the organisers and promoters, not the circuit.

[JohnMiller]

Originally Posted by racing59

1997 & 1998 : http://www.duncangray.co.uk/f3000.shtml

Your thoughts on F3's on the Oval would be appreciated John....

Ok Rob.

The Germans did it for a couple of years I think, but not this year. My recollection is that Joey Foster's big, near career-ending accident in 2006 maybe ended any remaining enthusiasm.

F3s may well be certified to race on the oval but I really can't see there would be any interest from those who might be able to afford to do it.

Brush the wall hard enough with one side of the car and with front wing, nosebox, rear wing, 2 corners, wheels, sidepod etc. etc. and you'd be at £20k - for a Dallara F3 of any age.

PS Good bloke Duncan maybe, but he has never raced in European Formula3000 - in fact I don't think Fred Goddard's team did either...

[R59]

Sorry John, too many letters. Drop the PEAN. It was the Euro Formula 3000 (wasn't that a BRSCC run thing?).
Euro, European, hey, what's a few letters. I used to have a car registered with NASA.

OK on the Germans and the oval with F3 - you are the man that would know more than me. I don't do cars without a roof anymore. (except you might get me in a F5000 car....)

[JohnMiller]

Originally Posted by racing59

Sorry John, too many letters. Drop the PEAN. It was the Euro Formula 3000 (wasn't that a BRSCC run thing?).
Euro, European, hey, what's a few letters.

IIRC he raced an F3000 in BOSS, which is not exactly F3000 racing!

[Suze]

Originally Posted by JohnMiller

Ok Rob.

The Germans did it for a couple of years I think, but not this year. My recollection is that Joey Foster's big, near career-ending accident in 2006 maybe ended any remaining enthusiasm.

F3s may well be certified to race on the oval but I really can't see there would be any interest from those who might be able to afford to do it.

Brush the wall hard enough with one side of the car and with front wing, nosebox, rear wing, 2 corners, wheels, sidepod etc. etc. and you'd be at £20k - for a Dallara F3 of any age.

Re F3 on the oval - I went to Germany last year so to add a few quick thoughts in.

I think Joey was unlucky - there are some here who will be able to explain the next bit better than I, but I shall try. As I understand it, there is a particular angle [possibly being perpendicular?] that a car can hit a wall and have devestating consequences, but to get that exact angle can obviously be "hard." If you do hit at that angle, it can cause everything in the rear of the car to be pushed forwards eventually ending up with the driver's lower back, which can cause a break and other injuries. I believe this is what happened in Joey's case but please correct me if wrong, as this is second-hand as I was travelling through Germany to the circuit at the time.

I say Joey was unlucky, because I don't think that accident was "the fault of the oval" - there's a small chance of hitting at that angle and the results could have been very different if it was otherwise, and I've known it happen to others [Alan Robinson who races in F Vee and FF broke his back from similar, and is now back racing].

Anyway, on to the actual "show" of F3 on the oval.

The Lausitz is a couple of hours by train from Berlin, so in terms of what's around it there isn't really that much. There's a great bar [with good beer and proper German "stodge food"] overlooking the track where you can sit, eat and watch everything - that is a good start.

The pre-race buildup was entertaining too. All of the cars with all of the drivers were sat in the pitlane at whatever specified angle with the German gridgirls dressed up in traditional gear. There were bands marching down the pit straight with the local cycling club, scalextrix club, football team, shooting club etc etc - all of the local clubs and organisations - following and it proved to be quite entertaining.

The F3 races themselves were great as well, close racing and I believe there was a little contact between cars / a car and a wall as well with no accidents or costing £20k. The Germans put on a good show, the races were close and entertaining, the atmosphere was great and everyone there seemed to enjoy it - I know we did.

[Aysedasi]

Interesting thread.

Not my scene normally, but interesting thread, nevertheless.

Now - what was the topic?

[mini1400]

Originally Posted by Chigley

OK, what do you call dedicated transport to sign on, dedicated transport to post, free lunch provided by the organiser, gauranteed finish on time thanks to curfew, each post having a hut for shelter and keeping personal kit dry, flaggies having purpose stands to flag from (no standing in puddles). The oval having the UK's only working land line so that everyone is aware of what is going on instantly.

Stop being blinkered! Attack the organisers and promoters, not the circuit.

Didn't get transport to sign on, didn't get a (free) lunch, nowhere to get a breakfast at 7:30am, no toilet facilites that you could get to between sessions...

OK, you get a hut for shelter and proper flag stands...

Not being blinkered, just my observations from the one time I've marshalled there.

[brickkicker]

Originally Posted by mini1400

Didn't get transport to sign on, didn't get a (free) lunch, nowhere to get a breakfast at 7:30am, no toilet facilites that you could get to between sessions...

OK, you get a hut for shelter and proper flag stands...

Not being blinkered, just my observations from the one time I've marshalled there.

There is transport layed on, not sure how you missed it, the lunches are normal available at the back of the pit garages, maybe no one told you (we all know the BRSCC isnt always the best with there comms) have to agree with the toilet issue, luckly you are not normally out on the bank for to long however when the BTCC were there I did see toilets out there. If you want a good breakfast you should try the gredy pig which is down the road (much better than any circuit breakfast) and there is always McD's but you cant always get food that early at a number of circuits.

[Chigley]

Not being blinkered, just my observations from the one time I've marshalled there.

That was a BTCC meeting and not a "proper" Oval Rockingham meeting. With it being the first BTCC for three years there were many things overlooked, or not done.........

[flagwaver]

Chigley I don't feel that a free bus to post is a perk. On the oval it is a neccessity or you would get even less marsals than you do now.
Lunch is hit and miss. Other circuits have radio links to all posts and a place to store kit. So Rockingham doesn't offer me any more than other circuits do. Better than some I grant you, but not as good as others.