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Old 15 Sep 2002, 16:40 (Ref:380791)   #1
JAG
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JAG should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridJAG should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridJAG should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
New F1 Tech. Rules

When do you expect the new F1 tech. rules to be introduced.

Speeds in F1 are now becoming out of control especially with the tyre wars. 225mph down the straight at Monza, Wow.

I would like to see V6 N/A engines (the V10s are so loud they are not enjoyable to listen to anymore)

Slick tyres and downforce halved.
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Old 15 Sep 2002, 16:43 (Ref:380797)   #2
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Isn't that called F3?

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Old 15 Sep 2002, 16:45 (Ref:380798)   #3
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"V10s are so loud they are not enjoyable to listen to anymore" Say again? I concur. 1.4 l na 4 cyls engine... ooops, that's not good either. That's my Corolla...
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Old 15 Sep 2002, 16:52 (Ref:380806)   #4
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The sportcar Judd V10 sounds smooth like an F1 engine from the early 90s. Todays F1 engines are undeniably impressive but they do not sound as good as a Ferrari V12, Cosworth V8 or V6 Turbo from the 80s.

Some turbo F1 cars were at the Goodwood Festival and they sound awsome.

The Panoz V8 is LOUD but is a pleasure to listen to especillay when you Porsche flat 6s, Judd V10s etc.

F1 needs a variety of engine sounds like the old days. The best sound modern F1 engines in my opinion are the Ferrari V12 and the old Mugan V10.

Last edited by JAG; 15 Sep 2002 at 16:55.
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Old 15 Sep 2002, 16:54 (Ref:380808)   #5
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Yes!!!! That's the point!!! They don't sound like a Ferrari V12!!!!! But the engines in 2007 will surely do sound better!!
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Old 15 Sep 2002, 17:00 (Ref:380814)   #6
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Cars are not too fast. If we are talking about the pinnacle of motorsport worldwide then it should have FAST cars. Sadly the cars are fast, but the fast tracks are cut.... (Hockenheim forever!)
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Old 15 Sep 2002, 17:07 (Ref:380819)   #7
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Don't get me wrong I love the fast cars. However sportscars are being pegged back slighlty to maintain current speeds so they do not get out of control and F1 will soon follow.

I'm just interested in the way the rules will go. Will the engines be totally different? Will slicks come back? Will downforce be cut?

F1 will cut speeds eventually but they also have to formulate rules that can improve the racing i.e. allowing cars to follow close behind like in Cart etc. without dramtically affecting the cars.
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 00:36 (Ref:382042)   #8
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I seem to remember hearing about this before. Wasn't it going to be max 2500cc and six cylinders (which means V6). 2.5L V6 engines might sound a bit better that 3000cc V10's and after a little development, not a whole lot slower.

V12's are the best sounding of all, but V6's are good too. I remember the Group A touring car days... while the Jag XJS V12 had the best sound, the Alfa Romeo GTV6 wasn't far behind.

I'd rather they slow the cars than destroy the tracks (too late some would say).
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 00:48 (Ref:382046)   #9
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What they should do: Cut the downforce, widen the chassis, give back slicks, effectively remove all driver aids.

What they will do: Cut displacement, allow ABS.
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 01:11 (Ref:382050)   #10
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* Reduce downforce - yes
* Widen chassis - will this create more passing.... or maybe less passing? It certainly won't slow them down.
* Return to slicks - I'd agree, but then again, I'm not so sure that the grooved tyres of late 2002 have much less grip that the slicks of several years ago.
* Remove driver aids - yes, as much as possible.

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Old 17 Sep 2002, 02:03 (Ref:382060)   #11
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Eliminate grooves in tyres. That is all.
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 02:34 (Ref:382069)   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lee Janotta
What they should do: Cut the downforce, widen the chassis, give back slicks, effectively remove all driver aids.

What they will do: Cut displacement, allow ABS.
CART....such a dull formula with just two companies coming up with the chassis
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 02:44 (Ref:382071)   #13
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Originally posted by alfasud
* Reduce downforce - yes
* Widen chassis - will this create more passing.... or maybe less passing? It certainly won't slow them down.
* Return to slicks - I'd agree, but then again, I'm not so sure that the grooved tyres of late 2002 have much less grip that the slicks of several years ago.
* Remove driver aids - yes, as much as possible.
Widening the chassis won't reduces speeds on it's own, but it's necessary if we're to take away downforce, to maintain cornering stability... The wider track will give the cars more mechanical grip in corners. I don't think slowing cars down really needs to, or should be, a goal in the rulemaking process. The FIA is still overreacting to a horrible weekend that happened 8 years ago at _one_track_.

On the slicks vs. grooves... The grooved tires today probably have as much grip under their optimum conditions as the last slicks in '97. But the range of conditions in which they're at their best are much narrower... There's much greater variation between brands... It used to be just a matter of designing the best sidewall and mixing the best compounds... Now there are all sorts of variables in tire construction. It's too damn complex, and we end up with a situation where a manufacturer gives up and just tailors their tire to one team's requirements.

We take away diffusers, limit the wing elements, give the cars more mechanical grip, and they'll be able to follow each other right thru the fast corners without having to back off the throttle due to losing downforce... The driver in back will be better able to "get a run" on the car in front, and then will be able to slingshot past, and pray that he's got the grip to get thru the next corner while holding the position.

And if we force the teams to use a spec, sealed engine control system, we can finally get rid of the driver aids. People who think the word "spec" has _no_ place in F1 are just going to have to get over it. F1 basically ran with a spec engine package for a decade, and it was one of the most competitive eras in the sport's history...
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 03:07 (Ref:382079)   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lee Janotta
I don't think slowing cars down really needs to, or should be, a goal in the rulemaking process. The FIA is still overreacting to a horrible weekend that happened 8 years ago at _one_track_.
True, but speeds are increasing and if it's a choice of slowing the cars or butchering the tracks, then let's slow the cars.

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[i]And if we force the teams to use a spec, sealed engine control system, we can finally get rid of the driver aids. People who think the word "spec" has _no_ place in F1 are just going to have to get over it. F1 basically ran with a spec engine package for a decade, and it was one of the most competitive eras in the sport's history...
Hmmm..... Ferrari, Repco, Matra, Alfa Romeo.... I give up, which 10 years were these? As someone else commented, let's not turn F1 into CART.
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 06:55 (Ref:382139)   #15
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Re: New F1 Tech. Rules

Quote:
Originally posted by JAG

Speeds in F1 are now becoming out of control especially with the tyre wars. 225mph down the straight at Monza, Wow.

I would like to see V6 N/A engines (the V10s are so loud they are not enjoyable to listen to anymore)

I wanna see ‘em doing 325!!!!!

As for the loudness…… turn your volume down (or get better ear defenders). I do think they should have a noise level test. If it doesn’t make your ears bleed at 200 meters - then they are excluded!

Isn’t this all part of what F1 is about?
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 07:03 (Ref:382147)   #16
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Re: Re: New F1 Tech. Rules

The loud sound was because of it's exhaust...everytime they managed to lengthened the rpm, the shorter the exhaust would be.
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 07:37 (Ref:382166)   #17
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Re: Re: Re: New F1 Tech. Rules

Quote:
Originally posted by Jukebox
The loud sound was because of it's exhaust.
And there was me thinking it was the in-car-stereo! Amazing what you can pick up here!!!!!!

Does anybody know if there’s a ‘grown-ups’ version of 10 tenths?
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 07:44 (Ref:382168)   #18
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Re: Re: Re: Re: New F1 Tech. Rules

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Originally posted by alchemy


And there was me thinking it was the in-car-stereo! Amazing what you can pick up here!!!!!!

Does anybody know if there’s a ‘grown-ups’ version of 10 tenths?
ahh..another dumb one i see

You know what...people like you that don't think twice before replying are the one who's goin to get humiliated by their own replies in the end.

Engines too do produce sound and do you need me to explain how that sound is generated?

Last edited by Jukebox; 17 Sep 2002 at 07:44.
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 07:50 (Ref:382173)   #19
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New F1 Tech. Rules

Quote:
Originally posted by Jukebox



Engines too do produce sound and do you need me to explain how that sound is generated?
Yes!
(thinks:- this’ll be interesting!)
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 07:56 (Ref:382177)   #20
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: New F1 Tech. Rules

On second thoughts..i'm not even going to bother wasting my time with you.
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 08:09 (Ref:382190)   #21
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Re: Re: New F1 Tech. Rules

Quote:
Originally posted by alchemy
Isn’t this all part of what F1 is about?
What? Making noise? I suspect that Formula 1 is about cars that run fast not that make loud noise... but of course I might be mistaking...

Last edited by Red; 17 Sep 2002 at 08:12.
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 08:17 (Ref:382196)   #22
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there's no way driver aids will ever go. F1 is not a drivers championship (hasn't been for at least the last 10 years), its all about the highest technology. If you want to see real racing in its most pure form go to your local karting track.
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 08:44 (Ref:382226)   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by alfasud
* Return to slicks - I'd agree, but then again, I'm not so sure that the grooved tyres of late 2002 have much less grip that the slicks of several years ago.
They may be about as "grippy" as the tyres of '97, but ask yourself, if development of those tyres in 1997 had carried on, how much more grip do you think that the tyres would give out today? A complete surface that is touching the track (proper slick) has to give more grip than a tyre with 40mm of it's surface (grooved tyre) not touching the track imo.

Last edited by Mr V; 17 Sep 2002 at 08:46.
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Old 17 Sep 2002, 09:23 (Ref:382263)   #24
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The cheapest way is to cut 4 cylinders off the existing engines - make the engines 1.8 litre V6's. That will slow them, I guarantee it!!


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Old 17 Sep 2002, 09:28 (Ref:382267)   #25
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Re: Re: Re: Re: New F1 Tech. Rules

Quote:
Originally posted by alchemy


And there was me thinking it was the in-car-stereo! Amazing what you can pick up here!!!!!!

Does anybody know if there’s a ‘grown-ups’ version of 10 tenths?
Alchemy, thats the funniest thing i've read on here for a while, thanks!
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