Audi LMP1 Discussion

[chernaudi]

The R15 had to run a set of flaps that ran from the inboard face of the front fenders to the diffuser stays to mask a part of the lower wishbone. Would the R18 need a similar feature or with the diffuser being the way it is and more of the front bodywork "shrink wrapped" over the front of car perform that compliance function.

And now a question of carry over between the R18 and the R15. Would anyone hazard a guess on what of the R18's bits have been/could be tested on a R15, since at least one R15 will serve as a R&D car for the R18 program?

[CTD]

any one who can read or translate the text and or data of the laptop screen?. It's clearly a sketch of the R18 with some text/numbers attached to different parts of the car.

Full picture from Mike's site:
http://www.mulsannescorner.com/audi_...01209-3619.jpg

[chernaudi]

Any one have any thoughts that the R18 was also designed in some ways for private teams to run? Pruett's Speed piece says that the R18 is about as modular and easy to work on as you can get with a modern LMP1 car, and that the R10 and especially the R8 was heavily studied.

Having a clean sheet of paper, Audi didn't have to deal with some of the compormises that they couldn't get rid of on the R15 last year, and the smaller engine and such makes for more room to work on things. And then there's the rumored "quick change" gearbox that combines the best of the R8's, the R10/R15's, and even seems to draw from the horrid Gemini gearbox that Reynard and Crawford used to use, though with Audi and Xtrac at the helm, hopefully it won't be nearly so problematic.

Could that bode well for the R18 to be in the ALMS and LMS with "importer" semi-works teams after this year, as well as the ILMC and the LM24?

[chernaudi]

Originally Posted by CTD

any one who can read or translate the text and or data of the laptop screen?. It's clearly a sketch of the R18 with some text/numbers attached to different parts of the car.

Full picture from Mike's site:
http://www.mulsannescorner.com/audi_...01209-3619.jpg

I can't tell you anything about what you're questioning, aside from the fact that it does resemble a sketch accessable from a link on Mike's site.

However, I did find more ammo for the fact that Audi may be playing mind games with anyone that looks at the photo. It seems that in the wide screen monitor, that Audi has just plastered random photos, and that nothing seems to be live footage.

Who knows, but considering that Audi has said next to nothing about the theoretically obsolcent R15 that will be raced at Sebring, I'd guess that the photo and it's removal was an obvious attempt at mis-information.

[pdxracefan]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

I can't tell you anything about what you're questioning, aside from the fact that it does resemble a sketch accessable from a link on Mike's site.

However, I did find more ammo for the fact that Audi may be playing mind games with anyone that looks at the photo. It seems that in the wide screen monitor, that Audi has just plastered random photos, and that nothing seems to be live footage.

Who knows, but considering that Audi has said next to nothing about the theoretically obsolcent R15 that will be raced at Sebring, I'd guess that the photo and it's removal was an obvious attempt at mis-information.

How about we just wait to see the car in action??

[Tim the Grey]

I really dobn't see Audi being daft enough to post actual screenshots from ANY windtunnel computers...

That looks like a composite of the car in a tunnel, and 2 guys in Audi kit, looking at computer screens which have data on them.

What's the betting the ACTUAL wind tunnel looks nothing like that picture?

Heavy PhotoShop editing, and plaster those screens with some road car data, to obfuscate, and get some people overheating, madly...

[MulsanneMike]

Originally Posted by Tim the Grey

I really dobn't see Audi being daft enough to post actual screenshots from ANY windtunnel computers...

That looks like a composite of the car in a tunnel, and 2 guys in Audi kit, looking at computer screens which have data on them.

What's the betting the ACTUAL wind tunnel looks nothing like that picture?

Heavy PhotoShop editing, and plaster those screens with some road car data, to obfuscate, and get some people overheating, madly...

No, that's Audi's tunnel. No reason to hide that. And indeed it does seem Audi did release these images inadvertently. But you have to ask, to what gain to the opposition? None. The data comes out of a wind tunnel that does not have a refined ground plane simulation. Thus, unless you know the offset to the real world, the information is completely useless to anyone. So other than some embarrassment, nothing has been given up.

[Panozfan]

Does that picture look shopped to anyone else? It looks like the picture in the upper right of the bigger monitor is a still image of what we are seeing with the tires turning. How are the tires turning if they are sitting on the ground with nothing to spin them? The moving road part is in the middle of the car. If you look at the other photos, like the one with the guy putting smoke on the car, the wheels are not moving but the road part is under the car.

[Danny_GT2]

Can't wait to hear what she sounds like at max revs! Haha, all 5000 of em! I'm sure it'll still eat petrol alive, bit confused bout the petrol teams, have the max cc's of petrol cars changed with all the new (worse) ACO regs or have the engine capacities remained the same, just less power??

[92scotland]

And if you look at the reflection of the car, the wheels aren't moving. It has definitely been photo shopped, there's no doubting that.

[chernaudi]

I still think that Audi has, as with many of their road car photos, have used the magic of photoshop. I'd have to say that some of the studio shots may've been re-touched in photoshop--in some of the head on views, you can see refections of the lighting rigs in the windshield. Either the R18 was photographed on a while background that eveloped only the rear and one side of the car, or the whole background was PS'd.

As for the windtunnel photo, both the R18 in the window, and for all we know, the photo of the same car in the wide screen monitor--and maybe the areo data--could be photoshopped and the whole photo could be a composite photograph that Audi made to make it look like a leak, so even if they accidently released it, it would befuddle the opposition, in more ways then one.

Who knows, but it seems to be a composite photo and if you know where to look you can see the differences. Anyone who's seen enough manips of tabloid photos and those of Kristen Stewart and Rob Pattinson can tell the difference between a real photo and a fake. Same goes with duplicate handwritten letters and paintings. One's the real thing and may be worth millions, the other is a convincing fake worth at most a few hundred dollars or euros.

[MulsanneMike]

Originally Posted by Panozfan

Does that picture look shopped to anyone else? It looks like the picture in the upper right of the bigger monitor is a still image of what we are seeing with the tires turning. How are the tires turning if they are sitting on the ground with nothing to spin them? The moving road part is in the middle of the car. If you look at the other photos, like the one with the guy putting smoke on the car, the wheels are not moving but the road part is under the car.

The Audi tunnel has rollers under neath the wheels with a partial belt going down the middle. This is pretty common, think of it as a "poor mans" full scale rolling road. The Aerodyn tunnel in Mooresville, NC, only has spinning wheels. It goes for something like $1500/hour. WindShear in Concord, NC, is the bee's knees, a full scale rolling road, but it costs something like $4500/hour. Audi corp has little need to develop such a facility given it's limited use for road cars.

Having said all that, there is definitely some Shopping going on there. But I don't see the point of it being a deliberate release. There's absolutely nothing Audi can gain from it. And as said before, nothing that a competitor can gain. Given the ground plane simulation in the Audi tunnel, and in discussions I've had with those close to the R15 and discussing specifically development methods, I know it for a fact that there's a tendency to not consider their full scale tunnel particularly accurate. This isn't to say it doesn't have a use to Audi. It's an instrument that they've developed a working knowledge of. And only Audi knows how it's relevant to what's going on out on the race track. With out the "code", the information is useless.

[chernaudi]

Now something that's more definite than the debate on what Audi will/won't do with the R15 for Sebring. Marshall Pruett has reported on his Twitter that he's written an article to soon be released on Speed.com about drivers' impressions on the R18 and some more tech bits.

[Audi Racer]

Where is the article that Marshall Pruett Promised us on the Audi R18. If this is a way to give Speedtv.com more publicity it's working. I have been on that site everyday this week.

[Audi Racer]

He promised us it would be released this week didnt he. I have been on speedtv.com everyday this week. Anyclues. Did AudiSport abduct him and his family lol.

[MihokS5]

I'd also like to know where this article is. I was really looking forward to it last week and need some new R18 info to drool over...

[rich07]

Originally Posted by Audi Racer

He promised us it would be released this week didnt he. I have been on speedtv.com everyday this week. Anyclues. Did AudiSport abduct him and his family lol.

Well that explains why I saw Dr Ulrich and a couple of guys carrying a large sack out of Pruett's house the other day and here I was thinking they were just helping Pruett on garbage day. .

[chernaudi]

Marshall's alive and well--this week was the Grand Am Daytona test, and Marshall and Robin Miller are pursuing the Firestone Indy Car pullout rumors.

However, I doubt that the article will turn up much--remember that the drivers and team members that are quoted in the article are paid by Audi AG. Like when Allan didn't elaborate much in the Autosport article and Beniot has said that the R18 sufferers the same visibility/windshield distortion issues as the 908 did, but it seemed that he didn't offer much up about the car elsewise.

Hopefully Mr. Pruett will have some surprises when he gets the article released, as he has more rumors and facts about the R18 as well, and may've gotten some more out of the likes of one Mr. McNish about driving it.

[chernaudi]

Is it me, or could Audi have a high downforce package ready for the R18 for the non-LM ILMC rounds? Of course, there's the holes drilled in the front fenders for what appears to be a twin set of dive planes in the press shots, and it seems that they'll be fairly agressive (al la Audi R15 and Acura ARX-02 perhaps), but that's not really what's got me.

In the press shots, the fin drops down from the engine intake to the wing mount pylon? Could it be that Audi also has a rear deck with a taller fin to allow for a taller wing mount strut and thus a higher rear wing setting? And could the pylon be a change-out item or is there a whole rear tail section for HD circuits (the way that the wing endplates mount to the rear of the car)?

[MulsanneMike]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

Is it me, or could Audi have a high downforce package ready for the R18 for the non-LM ILMC rounds? Of course, there's the holes drilled in the front fenders for what appears to be a twin set of dive planes in the press shots, and it seems that they'll be fairly agressive (al la Audi R15 and Acura ARX-02 perhaps), but that's not really what's got me.

In the press shots, the fin drops down from the engine intake to the wing mount pylon? Could it be that Audi also has a rear deck with a taller fin to allow for a taller wing mount strut and thus a higher rear wing setting? And could the pylon be a change-out item or is there a whole rear tail section for HD circuits (the way that the wing endplates mount to the rear of the car)?

Why wouldn't they have all that already? Car's out testing and the aero kits are all developed at the same time.

[gwyllion]

Perhaps chernaudi is a bit confused because last year Audi raced the R15+ in a low downforce/drag configuration in Spa, as preparation for Le Mans. The high downforce package was supposedly only developed and tested by Joest, because Audi Sport was too busy with the R18.

[chernaudi]

Acutally, the HD package for the R15 basically canibalized bits from the '09 R15, modified to fit the new bodywork, although Joest ran the HD add ons (dive planes and rear deck gurneys) at Paul Ricard, which made the decision to not use the items at Spa all the more strange in spite of Audi Sport's reasoning.

As for the R18, the press photos of the car clearly show it basically in an LM-spec, all though it has holes drilled in the front fenders to have dive planes pop-rivited onto the fenders, and rear wing seems to be a little low for a non-LM set up, and the sloping profile of the fin seems to support that Audi may have something different for a non-LM package, namely a taller wing pylon and a fin to match.

What seems to be interesting is that Pruett hinted that Audi may be using the rear fender extensions as an aero tuning device, even though the seem to be a fixed mold in the press photos.

Could this be where Audi has designed entirely different bodywork for LM and non-LM events, or at least different enough that there are significant variations between specs?

Also, McNish and TK have commented on the Audi R18 at the Autosport show--I haven't seen the video yet, but I doubt that there's anything ground breaking yet. After all, Peugeot and AMR may be listening.

However, Quattroholic has the video and it's nearly 22 minutes long, along with Allan discussing the R18 and one where Allan and Anthony Davidson joke around.

http://www.quattroholic.com/2011/01/...an-mcnish.html

[gwyllion]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

Also, McNish and TK have commented on the Audi R18 at the Autosport show--I haven't seen the video yet, but I doubt that there's anything ground breaking yet.

Indeed no new info. McNish did say that they are very early in the development process and that they have not yet started major test. That explains why the car will not be ready by Sebring...

[chernaudi]

I've been waiting for an interior photo to show up. Of course, that might be a ways off if Audi hasn't done much testing yet. It looks like the R18 uses a steering wheel similar to the 908?

I also wonder what came of the test they did allegely in Florida last month?

[MihokS5]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

I've been waiting for an interior photo to show up. Of course, that might be a ways off if Audi hasn't done much testing yet. It looks like the R18 uses a steering wheel similar to the 908?

I also wonder what came of the test they did allegely in Florida last month?

I'm also dying to see an interior shot!