[Team] Team 'Lotus' ?

[bjohnsonsmith]

This is the BBC's take on it:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/form...e/13572332.stm

However there seems to be a contradiction; according to the BBC article,

"Team Lotus were allowed to continue running under that name while Group Lotus will keep the black and gold livery, but cannot use the famous badge in F1."

but according to the Judgement Summary on Group Lotus's website,

"Group Lotus has goodwill associated with the name “Lotus” in Formula 1 and is free to compete in the sport under that name using the Lotus roundel"

Somewhat confusing.

[Paradise City]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

This is the BBC's take on it:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/form...e/13572332.stm

However there seems to be a contradiction; according to the BBC article,

"Team Lotus were allowed to continue running under that name while Group Lotus will keep the black and gold livery, but cannot use the famous badge in F1."

but according to the Judgement Summary on Group Lotus's website,

"Group Lotus has goodwill associated with the name “Lotus” in Formula 1 and is free to compete in the sport under that name using the Lotus roundel"

Somewhat confusing.

There are two distinct badges, a logo for Cars, the badge for Team, similiarily designed but distinctive.


Group/Cars are hurt but not completely out. They can use Lotus sponsorship to advertise their cars on the Renault but they'll never be the iconic "Team Lotus" nor can they use Team's heritage unless there are buyouts or whatever.

Although far from an ideal position Team is in the better position. They can call themselves Team Lotus and their F1 chasis is a Lotus. They can also have the option to call themselves Caterham Team Lotus.

I'm less sure about this but they may even have the option to market certain Caterham models as Caterham Team Lotus in the same way that Renault labeled certain Renault Clio's models with the brand Williams.

I presume there will be a buy-out of Group some time in the future. Their business model is very unsound and it depends how much taxmoney the Malaysians are willing to sink into the Group Lotus WorldWide Racing program.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Paradise City

There are two distinct badges, a logo for Cars, the badge for Team, similiarily designed but distinctive.

Here's the Team Lotus roundel,



and the Lotus roundel,


They are very similar, especially from a distance and also if the car is going at speed. However that doesn't really deal with the apparent contradiction as to whether Lotus can use the roundel or not.

[TrapezeArtist]

From my reading of the report (I couldn't face reading the actual judgement) I'm not sure whether Tony Fernandes's cars can be called Lotus. Clearly they can call their team Team Lotus but Group Lotus have the right to the name Lotus in Formula 1. So if Team Lotus can't call their car a Lotus, do they have to call it a Team Lotus?

It seems the judge thinks his legal colleagues haven't quite relieved the participants of enough money yet, so he has left things sufficiently ambiguous to suck them into a Round 2. I just want to bang their heads together.

[wnut]

Originally Posted by TrapezeArtist

From my reading of the report (I couldn't face reading the actual judgement) I'm not sure whether Tony Fernandes's cars can be called Lotus. Clearly they can call their team Team Lotus but Group Lotus have the right to the name Lotus in Formula 1. So if Team Lotus can't call their car a Lotus, do they have to call it a Team Lotus?

It seems the judge thinks his legal colleagues haven't quite relieved the participants of enough money yet, so he has left things sufficiently ambiguous to suck them into a Round 2. I just want to bang their heads together.

I thought that's what legal systems were all about lawyers appointed judges to make further work for the legal profession.
His honour should be commended on actually writing up his judgement and not making everyone wait for 3 years to have the reasons enumerated.

[medius]

Originally Posted by TrapezeArtist

From my reading of the report (I couldn't face reading the actual judgement) I'm not sure whether Tony Fernandes's cars can be called Lotus. Clearly they can call their team Team Lotus but Group Lotus have the right to the name Lotus in Formula 1. So if Team Lotus can't call their car a Lotus, do they have to call it a Team Lotus?

Yes they can call it a Lotus.

The High Court delivered its verdict on the Lotus naming issue on Friday - when Mr Justice Peter Smith declared that Team Lotus was allowed to keep its name and use the Lotus chassis moniker in F1.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91788

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by Paradise City

There are two distinct badges, a logo for Cars, the badge for Team, similiarily designed but distinctive.

Although far from an ideal position Team is in the better position. They can call themselves Team Lotus and their F1 chasis is a Lotus.

On the contrary. A Mark is an identifier... something that uniquely distinguishes the user of it from other things. The reason this court case happened was to clarify which one of these two parties would have the right to use the Lotus Mark in Formula One. The judgement maintained the [unacceptable to the parties] status quo by not resolving that matter. All it means is that the dispute will be carried forward to the appeals process. Neither TL nor GL are in 'better positions' following this case... and as has been said, I believe their chassis can be only be called a 'Team Lotus' and not a 'Lotus'.