ALMS 2012 Discussion

[Jonerz]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

24 hours of Road America. You could run it in the summer time.

It would be a fabulous few months for sports car racing. 24 Hours of Le Mans in June, 24 Hours of Spa in late July/early August and 24 Hours of Road America in August.

Chris

[AGD]

Originally Posted by Jonerz

I'd want the American 24 Hour race to be Daytona, because of the history, but since there is a greater chance of the ALMS throwing the ACO out than a non-Grand-AM Rolex 24 at Daytona...

1) I'd like it, but like Petit you would be trying to force-start history. So...

2) Why not just turn Petit into the Atlanta 24 Hours? (Although a track that could support 60, 70 or more entries going 24 Hours would be cool.)

Chris

Road Atlanta would make the most sense from a logical perspective. It already has a large fan base, Atlanta is well connected to the auto industry (Porsche NA being based there, etc.), IMSA would have to do something to Petit as they can't call it Petit if the ACO is kicked out, it's owned by Panoz so there's no worry about someone holding up IMSA's premier race to get a lower sanctioning fee (assuming Panoz is still owning this hypothetical no ACO series, I'm not sure if that could actually happen), and it has some weather flexibility. The only problem I guess is the size of the track. I'm sure we all remember the Daytona and Sebrings of old where there would be cars streaming through turn one for the first time on the first lap for like 3 minutes. You can't really have that at Road Atlanta. Then again, I'm not sure where all that many cars would come from these days.

[Jonerz]

Indeed. However, in a few years if the new IMSA series was to attract the amateur as much as it does the private, professional race team i wouldn't be surprised to see 70. There will be sixty some-odd at Daytona this year, and the DP class has had as many as a dozen more cars than are entered this year, so I'd hold whatever IMSA does without the ACO to the same standards. A premier prototype category, a cost-effective prototype category, a premier GT category, and a Grand-Am-GT-like sub-GT category could pull 60+...

"P1": 15
"P2": 10
"GT1": 15
"GT2": 20

Chris

[DeathOrGlory]

Definitely a long endurance event in Road America. 1000km, 1000mile, 12 hr, 24 hour it does not matter.

[JAG]

The sports car media does the best they can, but they are not numerous (not the English speaking ones at least) and they are stretched pretty thin as it is. Sometimes it's better to stick to the niche and do it very well rather than water down everything so nothing has any real importance.

If you're running a World Championship and expect manufactuers to spend tens of millions, and let's not forget privateers who need to raise sponsorship, they not only need increased coverage in the motorsport press, they need to start breaking into the mainstream with online reports from the likes of the BBC, Sky, national papers and the major (motor)sports sites, alongside increased coverage and features on TV, basically the kind of coverage Le Mans itself recieves

Le Mans is unique and draws media and fans who wouldn't otherwise be interested, but when you take the Le Mans package to these far flung places, attracting some of the increased interest for the whole championship has to be the goal.

Unless you read DSC or tune into RLM, ALMS coverage is limited these days, Autosport is down to half page reports in an 80-100 page magazine, you won't find much coverage beyond this.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by JAG

Unless you read DSC or tune into RLM, ALMS coverage is limited these days, Autosport is down to half page reports in an 80-100 page magazine, you won't find much coverage beyond this.

I reckon that SpeedTV.com has the greatest readership of any website that provides in depth coverage of the ALMS.

[JAG]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

I reckon that SpeedTV.com has the greatest readership of any website that provides in depth coverage of the ALMS.

I was thinking more about ALMS coverage in Europe beyond those listed, but you're right to point out Speed's coverage.

I do wonder how much of that is down to the dedication of the reporter, we'll see what happens next season but it does appear you have to jump through hoops to get actual TV coverage for anything but NASCAR on Speed. Being the official Le Mans broadcaster I would have though even streaming the WEC world feed via Speed's site would be a worthwile step.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

I reckon that SpeedTV.com has the greatest readership of any website that provides in depth coverage of the ALMS.

Not only do they provide the most ALMS coverage, but they provide the most WEC coverage than any other free English language outlet. If the WEC conflicted with ALMS and Dagys was told to cover the ALMS or vice versa, one series would have a major hole in their coverage.

And who really cares about F1 media who can't even be bothered to learn the names of the different classes and who could write about sports car racing in a negative light? Again, they'd rather rehash and fortify press releases talking about how "Button is going for the win at Montreal."

Originally Posted by JAG

I do wonder how much of that is down to the dedication of the reporter, we'll see what happens next season but it does appear you have to jump through hoops to get actual TV coverage for anything but NASCAR on Speed. Being the official Le Mans broadcaster I would have though even streaming the WEC world feed via Speed's site would be a worthwile step.

NASCAR pays bills. ALMS and WEC does not. The ILMC race from China had 33 viewers watching the official ACO Dailymotion stream. Infomercials that SpeedTV airs gets more viewers. Ok, there were more viewers on Audi and Peugeot's website, but still the infomercial would probably win especially if you just look at the markets where Speed airs.

ILMC highlights were on Speed's web streaming service, Speed2. Of course, that has a fraction of member ISPs than ESPN3 even and a lot less promotion from the big sister network than ESPN3. It's essentially RacefansTV with less access.

[FstrthnU]

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...up-in-the-air/
Risi has apparently not TOTALLY ruled out a full season ALMS (or Grand-Am) program. They're still trying to secure funding. They say they'd rather do a season in the ALMS, but they weren't pleased with the fuzzy rule changes last year (Corvette's fuel flow restrictor was specifically named). They say that they don't like Grand-Am that much, but as it stands they'll at least have a "fair chance" in the series.

[AndrewF31]

From the article, I think Risi wanted ALMS and/or LM, but doesn't have the funding for it yet.
And as you mention, he doesn't seem to like Grand-Am all that much apart from the tyres and the Rolex 24.

But when you see that part "I'm at a different place in my life at the moment,", I understood it as "I'll wait until January 18 for ALMS+LM(?) funding but if I don't have enough money I'll go with Grand Am or nothing.

Wouldn't it be nice to see Vilander and Beretta in ALMS? With Gimmi in the Enduros.

[fieldodreams79]

Originally Posted by AGD

1) Should there be a new American 24 Hour race, 2) Not counting Daytona or any other track IMSA has no shot at racing at, which track would you want it to be at?

Originally Posted by Jonerz

2) Why not just turn Petit into the Atlanta 24 Hours? (Although a track that could support 60, 70 or more entries going 24 Hours would be cool.)

Originally Posted by AGD

Road Atlanta would make the most sense from a logical perspective.

For a 24 hour race at RoadATL, you'd have to start the race on Friday or have it end before 8am Sunday morning. Noise ordinance/blue laws prevent ANY race engines running between 8 and noon on Sundays.

I'd vote for Road America as well; the length of the circuit and the history would make it a draw. How about running through the kink at night?

[Articus]

Someone get Bruni in and ALMS Ferrari again. He won my approval when he took pole at Petit Lemans and Win against the BMW's and not even Melo in his Risi Ferrari could get near that.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by fieldodreams79

For a 24 hour race at RoadATL, you'd have to start the race on Friday or have it end before 8am Sunday morning. Noise ordinance/blue laws prevent ANY race engines running between 8 and noon on Sundays.

Stupid blue laws. What if they invited Reverend Boogity, Boogity, Boogity to give a Sunday morning prayer? Would that work?

[Jonerz]

I believe that Giuseppe thought that the spec tires make for an interesting challenge, not that he prefers it to essentially customized factory tires from Michelin.

Chris

[AGD]

Originally Posted by Jonerz

I believe that Giuseppe thought that the spec tires make for an interesting challenge, not that he prefers it to essentially customized factory tires from Michelin.

Chris

As far as Risi goes, BoP killing a series? Especially the politicized waiver variety? Whoa, who would have thought of that?! I do agree that the Ferrari in particular gets the crap end of BoP. The thinking in prototypes is that the privateers don't have a chance. In GTE, the privateers chances are greatly diminished because of BoP even when they have the best cars. I guess the same is true in Grand-Am as well with BoP, but that is sports car racing is floundering. Do you choose series A with massive BoP, series B with massive BoP, or series C with massive BoP?

As far as tires go, I suppose having a spec tire in a GT series does present some interesting challenges to the team. Ultimately, I want to see tire battles though. Of course, I'm not so sure if Michelin has the best Ferrari tire at the moment. JMW's Dunlops have been quite good and of course the Dunlops on the BMWs have been quite good. Falken is making a lot of noise on the Porsche side of things.

[Jonerz]

Originally Posted by AGD

As far as Risi goes, BoP killing a series? Especially the politicized waiver variety? Whoa, who would have thought of that?! I do agree that the Ferrari in particular gets the crap end of BoP. The thinking in prototypes is that the privateers don't have a chance. In GTE, the privateers chances are greatly diminished because of BoP even when they have the best cars. I guess the same is true in Grand-Am as well with BoP, but that is sports car racing is floundering. Do you choose series A with massive BoP, series B with massive BoP, or series C with massive BoP?

As far as tires go, I suppose having a spec tire in a GT series does present some interesting challenges to the team. Ultimately, I want to see tire battles though. Of course, I'm not so sure if Michelin has the best Ferrari tire at the moment. JMW's Dunlops have been quite good and of course the Dunlops on the BMWs have been quite good. Falken is making a lot of noise on the Porsche side of things.

Agreed on the tire war, racing is as much about diversity and smart engineers, designers and fabricators as it is pit strategy and car control - sports car racing used to be the pinnacle on account of the technical freedom and diversity.

And whoever could have railed against BoP before Giuseppe... hmm...

Chris

[Matt]

Originally Posted by AGD

As far as Risi goes, BoP killing a series? Especially the politicized waiver variety? Whoa, who would have thought of that?! I do agree that the Ferrari in particular gets the crap end of BoP. The thinking in prototypes is that the privateers don't have a chance. In GTE, the privateers chances are greatly diminished because of BoP even when they have the best cars. I guess the same is true in Grand-Am as well with BoP, but that is sports car racing is floundering. Do you choose series A with massive BoP, series B with massive BoP, or series C with massive BoP?

As far as tires go, I suppose having a spec tire in a GT series does present some interesting challenges to the team. Ultimately, I want to see tire battles though. Of course, I'm not so sure if Michelin has the best Ferrari tire at the moment. JMW's Dunlops have been quite good and of course the Dunlops on the BMWs have been quite good. Falken is making a lot of noise on the Porsche side of things.

You say BoP too much.

[DistortedSmile]

So the Corvette has even more waivers than the BMW? I find that very interesting and somewhat hard to believe.

[Accident]

Originally Posted by DistortedSmile

So the Corvette has even more waivers than the BMW? I find that very interesting and somewhat hard to believe.

Not sure about how true that is, but when the RLL BMW was changed over to the same spec as the Schnitzer BMWs didn't they lose a lot of waivers?

I imagine the earlier M3 had more waivers, back when the gearbox was in the wrong place and etc.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by Matt

You say BoP too much.

Hey, I wish I did not have to say it!

Originally Posted by DistortedSmile

So the Corvette has even more waivers than the BMW? I find that very interesting and somewhat hard to believe.

Where did you read that? It may be true, but I don't know. BMW had the new fueling system, but Corvette got the temporary waiver that offset the advantage I guess. I reckon that Corvette will develop a new fueling system over the offseason, but RLL may feel like they are owed one. Ahh, politics. Isn't that why we all watch racing?

[DistortedSmile]

Originally Posted by AGD

Hey, I wish I did not have to say it!



Where did you read that? It may be true, but I don't know. BMW had the new fueling system, but Corvette got the temporary waiver that offset the advantage I guess. I reckon that Corvette will develop a new fueling system over the offseason, but RLL may feel like they are owed one. Ahh, politics. Isn't that why we all watch racing?

It was mentioned in the Risi interview linked in the previous page.
One would think BMW has the biggest BoP-wagon, considering how much of a brick the M3 road car is compared to the cars it competes against in GT2.

[DeathOrGlory]

Speaking of SPEED, they're handling the Grand-Am coverage for the whole season.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by DistortedSmile

It was mentioned in the Risi interview linked in the previous page.
One would think BMW has the biggest BoP-wagon, considering how much of a brick the M3 road car is compared to the cars it competes against in GT2.

Whoops, I must have skipped over that paragraph. As for the Ferraris not having any waivers, wasn't there a width waiver last year? The rule was changed for 2012 I think so he might be right for 2012. Still 30+ vs. 1 or 0. I can see why he would be mad. Granted, it's not a new issue.

[DistortedSmile]

Originally Posted by AGD

Whoops, I must have skipped over that paragraph. As for the Ferraris not having any waivers, wasn't there a width waiver last year? The rule was changed for 2012 I think so he might be right for 2012. Still 30+ vs. 1 or 0. I can see why he would be mad. Granted, it's not a new issue.

I'm sure he could've gotten some weight or restrictor breaks if he just asked nicely.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by DistortedSmile

I'm sure he could've gotten some weight or restrictor breaks if he just asked nicely.

That might be his intent. Maybe he is talking about the rules publicly and waffling over where to race in the hopes that the ALMS will give him some charity regulations to help him make up his mind. Still, I'm not sure if it will work. Corvette, BMW, and Porsche buy ads during telecasts and all of that stuff. Risi and Ferrari do not. Any advantage they get might be short lived. It's hard to say.