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Old 26 Jun 2011, 15:46 (Ref:2906389)   #1301
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Originally Posted by FordCosworthPanoz View Post
Yes, I know that, Im referring to the quality of endurance racing compared to the quality of Dull Tedious Mudane recently.
Well the new regs and BMW's involvement may lead to a more exciting DTM. It can't possibly get any worse...
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 15:49 (Ref:2906394)   #1302
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Well the new regs and BMW's involvement may lead to a more exciting DTM. It can't possibly get any worse...
why whats wrong with the dtm
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 15:52 (Ref:2906400)   #1303
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why whats wrong with the dtm
Everything?
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 15:56 (Ref:2906403)   #1304
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I can understand BMW's move to DTM. IMO DTM has the potential to be the #1 series behind F1 in Europe. Unfortunately DTM doesn't know how to run a series. If they copy some things from V8 Supercars and NASCAR they have gold in their hands.
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 15:59 (Ref:2906405)   #1305
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Originally Posted by FordCosworthPanoz View Post
I still cant believe that after races like Le Mans two weeks ago and now the race today, as well as DTM races like Lausitz this year where nothing happens, BMW as a factory effort is leaving endurance racing.
Even though BMW will give up their GT2 programme, they could always do it like Audi and compete with the Z4 GT3 next year.
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 16:03 (Ref:2906407)   #1306
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Yep and put their factory drivers in the Schubert cars.
Or Schnitzer running some Z4's like Abt.
In contrast to Le Mans/LMS it's for the N24/VLN no drama the M3 will not return.
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 16:07 (Ref:2906411)   #1307
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why whats wrong with the dtm
The cars are way too nimble and fragile for touring car racing as they´re way too aero-dependent. That leads to almost zero overtaking as all position changes happen in the pits basicly.

To make things worse the races are ruined by extremely strict stewards who penalise the slightest bit of contact, discouraging the drivers to actually try and overtake another car.

This hasn't gone unnoticed with the fans as spectator numbers have been cut in half in the last five years. The series is in desperate need of a fresh start with new rules, otherwise it´ll be dead in three to four years tops.
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 16:08 (Ref:2906412)   #1308
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Originally Posted by FIRE View Post
Yep and put their factory drivers in the Schubert cars.
Or Schnitzer running some Z4's like Abt.
In contrast to Le Mans/LMS it's for the N24/VLN no drama the M3 will not return.
The #76 Z4 has definetely shown that the car is finally competitive on the Nordschleife as well. It ran the same pace as the Manthey car during the night before its shunt...

Maybe Schubert will be bumped up a little with some DTM driver assistance from BMW in 2012.
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 16:09 (Ref:2906413)   #1309
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The cars are way too nimble and fragile for touring car racing as they´re way too aero-dependent. That leads to almost zero overtaking as all position changes happen in the pits basicly.

To make things worse the races are ruined by extremely strict stewards who penalise the slightest bit of contact, discouraging the drivers to actually try and overtake another car.

This hasn't gone unnoticed with the fans as spectator numbers have been cut in half in the last five years. The series is in desperate need of a fresh start with new rules, otherwise it´ll be dead in three to four years tops.
thanks
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 18:27 (Ref:2906486)   #1310
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AndrewF31 should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridAndrewF31 should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
All the results can be found here: http://adac.24h-rennen.de/Rennen-2011.3846.0.html

What a race. How I love the N24. Another brilliant year.

And great chat room all race long. Always full and with a great environment. Great way to spend 20+ hours following the best races in the world.

Too bad Lamy didn't take the gold. The future will tell what lays in store for him.

And parabéns Spyder. For the years and your favourite make's victory!
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 18:39 (Ref:2906495)   #1311
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arakis has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
Ferrari takes best lap by 2.5s , ~0.4s on a normal 1:30 track
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To launch a new FIA GT2 category based on strict technical rules, with limited wavers and ‘balance of performance' limited to success ballast. A category where GT manufacturers will prove through competition they can produce the best road going GT car.
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 20:05 (Ref:2906517)   #1312
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JAG should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridJAG should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridJAG should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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I can understand BMW's move to DTM. IMO DTM has the potential to be the #1 series behind F1 in Europe. Unfortunately DTM doesn't know how to run a series. If they copy some things from V8 Supercars and NASCAR they have gold in their hands.
Touring car racing has a strong local identity, DTM doesn't work outside Germany, likewise V8 Supercars would flop outside Australia.
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 20:16 (Ref:2906524)   #1313
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SuperGT might have a cure for that if they and DTM join up. Shame about the #88 LFA. up to 18th early then rear ended during a local yellow. Spent 2 hours in the pits repairing damage, fell back to 160th+, then finished 42nd.
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 20:19 (Ref:2906525)   #1314
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The DTM thing is kind of interesting to sports cars as well as rumors have it that the series will move much closer to GT-type cars due to the success of the GT Masters series.

BMW even talked about testing their future DTM car in the VLN about a year ago, I haven't heard anything about that since then though.
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 20:22 (Ref:2906527)   #1315
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Touring car racing has a strong local identity, DTM doesn't work outside Germany, likewise V8 Supercars would flop outside Australia.
DTM seems to do quite well at Brands Hatch and Zandvoort, as does V8 Supercars in New Zealand.
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 20:24 (Ref:2906529)   #1316
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Speed-King has a real shot at the podium!Speed-King has a real shot at the podium!Speed-King has a real shot at the podium!Speed-King has a real shot at the podium!
I wouldn't be all that surprised to see Audi, BMW and Mercedes all competing with their DTM-cars on the Nordschleife, if not next year then the year after...
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 20:34 (Ref:2906533)   #1317
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Like that Opel a few years back?
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 20:41 (Ref:2906537)   #1318
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Like that Opel a few years back?
Both the Opel and the Audi from 2003 & 2004 were based on (modified) DTM cars, yes.
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 21:10 (Ref:2906549)   #1319
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If they copy some things from... NASCAR...
Like spec bodies and carburetors?
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 22:47 (Ref:2906587)   #1320
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dxk1 should be qualifying in the top 5 on the griddxk1 should be qualifying in the top 5 on the griddxk1 should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Great win for the Manthey boys, nice comeback to a decent finish for the Hankook Ferrari.

DK
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Old 26 Jun 2011, 23:04 (Ref:2906594)   #1321
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Another onboard with Sean Edwards during Round 5 of the VLN, this time a quick one with only a little bit of traffic, fullscreen 1080p is a must for watching this video!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yOogH...layer_embedded
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Old 27 Jun 2011, 05:53 (Ref:2906647)   #1322
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Spyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSpyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSpyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSpyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
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And parabéns Spyder. For the years and your favourite make's victory!
Thank you Andrew!
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Old 27 Jun 2011, 09:45 (Ref:2906725)   #1323
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Some shots of the race
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Old 28 Jun 2011, 01:15 (Ref:2907102)   #1324
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Both the Opel and the Audi from 2003 & 2004 were based on (modified) DTM cars, yes.
Have to say I prefer the current N24 field to those years, and those cars had much more character than the Deutsche Taxicab Masters does now, and more exciting racing too.

I can't imagine this Super DTM M3 being a nicer car than the GT2 M3, so I view this as a step down if we go back to 03/04.
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Old 28 Jun 2011, 01:58 (Ref:2907107)   #1325
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skycafe is going for a new lap record!skycafe is going for a new lap record!skycafe is going for a new lap record!skycafe is going for a new lap record!skycafe is going for a new lap record!skycafe is going for a new lap record!
great photos racerspics!
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