Qingdao race cancelled.

[FordCosworthPanoz]

Originally Posted by Matt

it hasn't been called the IRL since 2007....

Actually, it has been known as the Indycar Series since 2003...

[Matt]

every time i see someone call it the IRL now, i can only think of the delusionals over at crapwagon.

[JohnSSC]

Purist: I have been to Mont Tremblant since 2005 and one of the big issues was and is getting the equipment in, which is one of the reasons we have not seen racing on that level there since. There is insufficient room in the paddock and the local roads leading to the the track itself can generously be described as "tight."

Areas such as race control are small (as in one room) and unless it has been added, there are no permanent structures for garages. I understand that you don't have this at street courses either, but when you add it it all together the infrastructure there is just not up to snuff for this type of event.

I am not an expert on track safety, but there is not much runoff room anywhere on the track and certainly the area around the bridge would not be viewed too kindly in that aspect. Yes, the bigger cars were going almost as fast but there is a bit more structure to protect the driver. I also believe that the overall track safety is a big reason that an event of this type does not happen there.

[JohnSSC]

Further note: The pit lane is rather short and narrow and having walked the track several times as well as having been taken around it by a driver at an event I was working there I know it is an awesome track but even an underpowered IndyCar is "too much" car for this track.

[D.R.T.]

Originally Posted by Matt

every time i see someone call it the IRL now, i can only think of the delusionals over at crapwagon.

Obviously its not limited to crapwagon anymore

Originally Posted by JohnSSC

even an underpowered IndyCar is "too much" car for this track

Do you mean like this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQYG5yJSidU

[JohnSSC]

Jeezum Crow! Yes, I KNOW there was a CART race there in '07. The fact of the matter is that there has not been another one because of the issues I pointed out. And yes, track safety IS a concern because some of the runoff areas are not up to par. And yes, some of the stories I heard regarding the difficulties in getting the equipment in and out of there indicated there was no great enthusiasm on the part of the teams to do that again.

The point here is that the track ownership is apparently not interested in making the upgrades needed to the paddock area and the return is most likely not commensurate with the costs.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Matt

every time i see someone call it the IRL now, i can only think of the delusionals over at crapwagon.

In January 1, 2011 the Indy Racing League LLC adopted as its trade name INDYCAR, with all official documents stating "Indy Racing League LLC, d/b/a INDYCAR. In my case I still call it the IRL out of habit.

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by mountainstar

Nascar definitely has it locked down when it comes to professional motorsport that is commercially successful and at least for the time being, that will continue.

The old Indianapolis had innovation in cars at different periods of it's life and let change happen. That kept the interest high. Turning into a one make formula has killed any chance of that interest being kept alive. There isn't anything newsworthy about indy or the racing league anymore. The track had it's time back in the 20th century and nothing lasts forever.

Road racing itself in the USA has grown. A significant number of circuits have been built for club racing and track driving and many have been refurbished or rebuilt. The only thing with road racing is that it's not as well organized at the professional levels. But underneath it is very healthy.

I think for the indy racin league and it's associated ilk, the ship has already sailed. tony george had to have it all and he did, but in the process he napalmed everything and there is nothing left to covet. Since his "vision" didn't work, the irl is now just a sad replicant of their previous hated CART which they railed against and opposed and now they try and fail to become.

What it needs is new ideas and new people, not the old braindead family at the speedway. The sport will never grow again until those people are gone.

Road racing will forever be dominated by tin-tops here. There's too much of a disconnect to make open wheeled road racing really big. I think sportscars can make it big, especially if the American presence is there.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Personally I think the cancellation of the race just shows how little real interest the Chinese have in motorsport in general. They jumped on the band wagon, when Bernie got them to join the exclusive F1 club but it hasn't brought them the rewards they wanted, only an annual sanctioning fee of $25 million and now the Chinese are making noises and are wanting out. Not surprising, considering there was never any grass roots motorsport following in China, in the first place.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by JohnSSC

Jeezum Crow! Yes, I KNOW there was a CART race there in '07. The fact of the matter is that there has not been another one because of the issues I pointed out. And yes, track safety IS a concern because some of the runoff areas are not up to par. And yes, some of the stories I heard regarding the difficulties in getting the equipment in and out of there indicated there was no great enthusiasm on the part of the teams to do that again.

The point here is that the track ownership is apparently not interested in making the upgrades needed to the paddock area and the return is most likely not commensurate with the costs.

I haven't posted much.. but the mention of the Tremblant circuit (one I'm deeply familiar with) provoked interest.

The 2007 Champ Car event was fantastic for spectators, and a pleasure to attend and photograph - really well done. There were significantly more spectators at that race than the Toronto IRL events have had since Champ Car died.

However, it amazes me that they were able to get all of that equipment into the paddock area when you see the road that leads into it. Tiny does not begin to describe it... The event was possible due to a large number of temporary facilities that were erected for the race - likely at great cost to the Champ Car series at the time. I do believe the 2007 Champ Car series likely had less equipment than the 2012 Indycar series. I don't actually think a huge number of upgrades would be necessary to the track as safe as your typical street venue - ie paving a few run off areas, but I can also see why the track owners wouldn't be interested in doing so. The track in its current form, is just fine for it's usual users. If they were going to do another big event, I think Indycar would have to make the proposal and foot the bill for the required costs, and be their own promoter (Just like Champ Car did).

[JohnSSC]

Thank you Jay! Your description of the paddock area is spot-on. It IS a great track, but far more suited to historics and such than it is for things like IndyCar - mostly due to the issues you described so well above.

[Purist]

And this is what saddens and somewhat angers me. Only the professional series get TV/media coverage, and those are the only events I can expect to get someone willing to be a driver for. So, if Tremblant sticks with amateurs, I can reasonably expect to never see another race from there again.

Honestly, is the Tremblant paddock any worse than Lime Rock? As for roads to and from the track, that's kind of out of the track's hands at the end of the day, and EVERY major road course here has that final stretch of two-lane you have to negotiate to get in and out of the place.

Finally, I found some race footage on YouTube at Tremblant from 1988, and if that's what the current owners had to start with, then they've done a HUGE amount of work at the track already, in which case, I don't buy the argument that they're uncommitted to making improvements.

[JohnSSC]

Purist: I have met the owner. Let me assure you that there is absolutely no interest in investing more money into the upgrades needed for top-level pro racing there. The track was not purchased with that as either a long or short-term goal.

And yes, I would say that the paddock is worse than Lime Rock vis a vis the ability to accomodate the teams, race control infrastucture and the TV.