Todd Kelly vs Glenn Seton

[hml2777]

now, I am not anti Toddler, but I am a Seto fan.

How did everyone view that overtaking move?

Wouldn't that episode previously brought down the ire of those CAMS people?

[marcus]

was great to watch but Im sure Glenn and DJ are none to impressed by it.

at one stage I thought Todd was going to just keep driving Glenn into a wall , a little over the top in my view and I hope someone has a quite word in his shell like to tone it down a bit for tomorrow.

nothing wrong with Love taps but that was borderline on going to far I feel.

[DNQ]

I thought Todd's "Keep bumping him til he gets out of the way" driving was pretty weak. I appreciate and enjoy a bit of biff-o, but not in the form of the trailing driver more or less just trying to tap the other car out of the way. Seto did a good job, but how can you defend agains that.

[DNQ]

Originally Posted by marcus

nothing wrong with Love taps but that was borderline on going to far I feel.

Sums it up nicely.

[hml2777]

I am really surprised he didn't get a penalty, but there is always that old time penalty, we will have to wait until tomorrow.

BTW, did you see Dick burst into fits of laughter at the Crash Bandicoots episode. What a pearler (Dick I mean)

[GTRMagic]

Mr Seton's car was impossibly wide for a long time there though... it was blocking for many laps, the thing not driving off the corners well at all (stuffed tyres from a too-early stop perhaps) such that the only way a pass could be executed was by forcing the driver off line, or indeed a seriously aggressive move... or both...

Mr Kelly could have wrecked his own race, with the smack in the bum of the #18 car making a nice pitched roof in the bonnet of the #22 car... could have damaged the cooling system for the engine or brakes... very very aggressive...

Good fun to watch though

[Scott75]

Give me a break, TK got passed fairly and squarely, it was great racing. Yet again the Ford boys having a whinge even when you are dominating. Your starting to sound like the New Zealand cricket coach.

[TCR-028]

Ramming someone out of the way is hardly "great racing" though - Unless of course you're of the opinion that the V8 Utes provide great racing too ??

FWIW though it was painfully obvious that Seto was holding up Mr. Kelly. Full credit to Toddler for not doing a Crash Bandicoot on him...

[rocket]

sure seto was holding kelly up but he was still using the main racing line except for maybe turn 9 & the entry to turn 9 had been narrowed from the oil left from bargs's crash so it was marginal. ultimately the final pass was clean after seto made a slight mistake it was just the lead up that was heading towards being unsportsman like

[HRT433]

I'll start by saying that I am a HRT supporter, so I wanted him to be in front of Seton, but I have always liked Seton (even if he does drive for the enemy). I thought it was a great battle, and quite entertaining. I particularly like the shot of Dick's reaction to the pile up that occured just after Toddler made the pass on Glenn, he was probably just glad his team wasn't involved in it, especially after a rough start to the weekend with both Grant Denyer and Steven having offs.

[MRJUCY]

I thought Toddler's continued bashing was over the top it was near the end of the race & Seton had every right to block. I was surprised the officials didn't have anything to say but ultimaely I was just glad it didn't end in tears cause if it wasn't Glenn driving it probably would have. I think the HSV car was obviously faster but he doesn't have the talent of Seton to actually race him & try to pass so instead relied on trying to drive him off the road.

[marcus]

I agree with the Orange Juice guy above

[Sandgroper]

Originally Posted by Scott75

Give me a break, TK got passed fairly and squarely, it was great racing. Yet again the Ford boys having a whinge even when you are dominating. Your starting to sound like the New Zealand cricket coach.

Well said Scott..........Its OK when its the other way around....Just Racing I believe.

[deeks6]

Bias declared - Ford fan!

Unlike baby destroyer, I can't find anything wrong with this. Seto IS a bit of a speed hump these days and if you are going to block THAT aggressively then you are asking for it. It was a bit like Radisich on Skaife at Adelaide a few years ago, and he rightfully didnt get a penalty either.
Seto is lucky that the accident that was always going to happen (when someone holds up a long train) didnt involve him.

[Venom XR]

Originally Posted by deeks6

...and if you are going to block THAT aggressively then you are asking for it.

Todd should cast his mind back to the old Canberra street race, where he blocked Craig Lowndes for 15+ laps. I don't remember Craig making mince meat of his rear bumper. Granted, in that scenario, it was a superior driver in inferior equipment trying to pass someone in better gear. But the length of time Todd blocked then was in excess of the number of laps Glenn would have blocked Todd for had he made the chequered flag in front. At the business end of the race, it's every man for himself. That Todd couldn't keep it clean just shows he still lacks a bit of driving class - though not lacking nearly as much as his brother...

Even Russell kept it clean at the end of last year riding Skaife's rear. It's not a difficult thing for drivers of their caliber to do - if they so wish.

[Suddy]

great to watch! TK was entitled to give him a hurry up, he never took him off so whats the problem ? Seto was the cork in the bottle.

[v8race1]

I remember a lot of whinging about the gravy train effect, follow the leader for fear of penalties syndrome, so I find it remarkable that now we have some real, excellent racing that some seem upset. It was great to see a full-on battle between these two, real on the edge racing, one blocking in desperation the other using intimidation in the hope of passing.
For me that was the highlight of the race as it was "racing". I commend these two for displaying a proffesional attitude in their racing not like the air head mentality "crash" displays in the heat of the moment.
more I say more!!!!

edit bad spelling mistake

[KE30MAN]

Seto only blocked on one corner of the track, turn 9. I thought it was quite clean. Glenn knew that Todd had a faster car and I am sure if Todd had of put it in the right place at the right time, Glenn wouldn't have turned in.

Having said that he just 'nibbled' him when he could have unloaded him. His brother on the other hand...

[GTRMagic]

But it depends where the driver behind hits the driver in front.

If you hit cleanly, full bumper to full bumper, the car in front will know you are there, but the car being hit generally wont get unloaded sideways....Rusty perfected this manoeuvre...

Crash Bandicoot tends to try and get past, and tap the extreme right or extreme left of the rear bumper of the car in front, so the car being chased does get unbalanced, and either has a moment, or ultimately spins... usually within close proximity of the walls....

Its all experience...

[XJR14/WSC95]

I feel that the HSV car was much faster at that point of the race however I think TK was using Seto as his pracking point a little too much. He would have never pased him if he continued to attack like that unless he totaly pushed Glen out of the way.

[deeks6]

Originally Posted by Venom XR

Todd should cast his mind back to the old Canberra street race, where he blocked Craig Lowndes for 15+ laps. I don't remember Craig making mince meat of his rear bumper. Granted, in that scenario, it was a superior driver in inferior equipment trying to pass someone in better gear. But the length of time Todd blocked then was in excess of the number of laps Glenn would have blocked Todd for had he made the chequered flag in front. At the business end of the race, it's every man for himself. That Todd couldn't keep it clean just shows he still lacks a bit of driving class - though not lacking nearly as much as his brother...

Even Russell kept it clean at the end of last year riding Skaife's rear. It's not a difficult thing for drivers of their caliber to do - if they so wish.

You make a good point about driving class...granted that Toddler is not in the class of CL, MA, MS, RA but is'nt that the point? If you were Seto with a potential lunatic on your bumper, would,nt you just concede the 3 points instead of risking 70 something and hitting the wall?
As they say in NASCAR "you get raced like you race" - so all the other drivers know that Toddler is fair game in the same situation - and he can't whinge about the same treatment then.

[HSE2]

Originally Posted by deeks6

You make a good point about driving class...granted that Toddler is not in the class of CL, MA, MS, RA but is'nt that the point? If you were Seto with a potential lunatic on your bumper, would,nt you just concede the 3 points instead of risking 70 something and hitting the wall?
As they say in NASCAR "you get raced like you race" - so all the other drivers know that Toddler is fair game in the same situation - and he can't whinge about the same treatment then.

What you have to understand is that Seto has become some what of a walking door mat to his fans. For years he has come under attack for not fighting for position and doing exactly what you suggest in letting the opposition past. For certain drivers out there it’s no longer a matter of just three points. One could argue the same for Todd.

Apart from NZ where he held up Marcos, in recent years it has appeared as though he has no fight left in him. He is a target to people saying he is past it. You aren’t going to prove those people wrong by doing what you suggest no matter what points are at stake. To professional drivers there shouldn't be a risk of being put in the fence. This lunatic you speak of shouldn’t be an issue.

Glenn has a new team and a new sponsor and like everyone else has to race to earn his keep. Yesterday showed he could still race for position cleanly when provided with a car that is half decent. The race was really only between the two of them until a combination of the fight and Glenn’s tyres allowed the others to catch up. Seton could have stitched Todd up several times and didn't. I also believe the harder taps were not intentional on Todd’s part- that is it is just part of close racing against someone that has tyres at the end of there life. Todd should have been cleaner in a car that had proven speed and for what ever reason he couldn't achieve that, but I saw nothing in it that would cause the stewards concern.

[Rowdy]

Spud1 I am with you. Kelly was applying all sorts of pressure to a guy most would have thought would let him by after 1 or 2 hello's on the bumber. He never tried to turn him around. Seton showed he has still got some of the qualities that made him champion in the way he withstood the pressure for so long. Halfway through this battle I was thinking it would be cool to see Todd in an SBR car next year

[cow]

Originally Posted by Scott75

Give me a break, TK got passed fairly and squarely, it was great racing. Yet again the Ford boys having a whinge even when you are dominating. Your starting to sound like the New Zealand cricket coach.

Now their is no need to use name like that

[HSE2]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

But it depends where the driver behind hits the driver in front.

Even being hit squarely IMO can unload the car in front especially if they are already on the edge. It has more to do where the contact takes place in the braking area. That extra hit of momentum on a car that is already unsettled due to brake bias or off tyres can have the same affect as being hit off centre. We have seen it before where the smallest of centre taps is enough to send the car in front into a similar situation as having too much rear brake. The front is anchored or tying to pull up when unwanted force is applied to part of the car that is already in the process of being light or lifted.