Prospective new teams for the FIA F1 World Championship.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Richard C

I just read the article and as best as I can tell, the suit is in the opposite direction. It sounds like Andretti created a legal entity for the new facility (Cardinal XLIII) and Cardinal hired a firm to manage the project (Bradford Allen Reality Services) and that the design/build firm (Dillon) contacted Bradford Allen about late payments and Bradford Allen tried to terminate (or reduce) the contract with Dillion. In short, contractor is suing Andretti (Andretti representative). Or maybe I read the intent of your post backward.

Sounds like rich people drama to me.

Richard

The first paragraph of the article outlines what is happening and the lawsuit is being brought by Dillon Construction Group against Cardinal XLIII, who are the firm in charge of the project for the new facility.

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by Alan52

I think FOM is more concerned with placating the existing teams than acting in their own interest.The Andretti team is a no brainer from their point of view but they are at best cold towards the idea.

I think they are trying to do both. Keep existing teams happy and expand the season and number of teams. But you can't make everyone happy. It will be interesting to see what happens. It's an uphill climb on all fronts. Andretti may not make it in!

Richard

[GTRMagic]

So.. in the BE days.. you might imagine Mr Andretti and the Gainbridge people would have already met with the Renault board by now and effected a sale of the race team, and an engine supply from Renault past 2026..

The work experience team in the management structure of Alpine right now may be overjoyed not to have operational responsibility, reporting to some very trigger happy board members..

[Richard C]

Interesting article from AMuS...

https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/...1-einstieg-v1/

Basically saying that FIA requirements are one that Andretti should be able to clear. Then comes F1 (FOM) approval. But that F1 from a commercial perspective must respect some prior EU directives. In short, those directives might make it difficult for F1 to arbitrarily say "no". Or if they do say "no", Andretti might be able to push the point to make it happen in advance of new 2026 Concorde where the rules may change in a way to make it even hard to get in for anyone.

Richard

[Tourer]

Team applications moving through process at FIA - may even see outcomes next week.

FOM process then to start, may take months.

I expect we'll get a few similar articles / statements / conjectural pieces between now and when any successful team applications are announced as done deals.

[Alan52]

Hearing that Alpine has found grounds to cancel Andretti’s engine deal so making his application untenable.Favours for 9 friends.Will they now agree to loosen development restrictions for Renault power unit?

[steve_r]

If true then that is clearly a message that F1 is a closed shop. The sport being run as a monopoly / exclusive club.

I know F1 teams have always been self serving, but this is taking it to a whole new low.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Alan52

Hearing that Alpine has found grounds to cancel Andretti’s engine deal so making his application untenable.Favours for 9 friends.Will they now agree to loosen development restrictions for Renault power unit?

I haven't found anything on the usual motorsports news outlets that confirms this.

[billy bleach]

Originally Posted by Alan52

Hearing that Alpine has found grounds to cancel Andretti’s engine deal so making his application untenable.Favours for 9 friends.Will they now agree to loosen development restrictions for Renault power unit?

No doubt Cadillac will step into the breach and build an engine….. Honestly I cannot think of a single reason why this project should go ahead.

[peebee2]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

Honestly I cannot think of a single reason why this project should go ahead.

That's because they really are very few and very far between.

[Alan52]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

I haven't found anything on the usual motorsports news outlets that confirms this.

Joe Saward’s blog intimates it.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Alan52

Joe Saward’s blog intimates it.

That's not the same thing as confirming.

[Teretonga]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

That's not the same thing as confirming.

Joe is not often wrong.
If that is his scuttlebutt there is probably a fire of truth generating the smoke....

[Tourer]

Andretti the only one of the prospective teams still in the running but yet to complete the FIA process and evaluation.

If Andretti gets approved by the FIA, off to F1 for more evaluation.

[P38 in workshop]

Originally Posted by Tourer

Andretti the only one of the prospective teams still in the running but yet to complete the FIA process and evaluation.

If Andretti gets approved by the FIA, off to F1 for more evaluation.

Which might well have the effect of getting the FIA off the hook should F1 decide to reject them and legal matters get under way.A World Championship is hardly living up to it's name if a franchise system is implicitly in operation and prevents competition.Both US anti trust and EU competition regulations might be used to start a battle.If the FIA gives the nod,they avoid becoming embroiled.


The optics of rejecting American institutions like GM,Cadillac and the Andretti dynasty wouldn't be great in a nation where the interest is growing rapidly and so many national flags are proudly flown.

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by P38 in workshop

Which might well have the effect of getting the FIA off the hook should F1 decide to reject them and legal matters get under way.A World Championship is hardly living up to it's name if a franchise system is implicitly in operation and prevents competition.Both US anti trust and EU competition regulations might be used to start a battle.If the FIA gives the nod,they avoid becoming embroiled.

You could be right but personally I have no problem with a robust process to admit teams to the World Championship - should be something that only the very best can qualify for. Many sports have a similar approach (even the Olympics) so to me it kinda fits.

I suspect that anti-trust laws are likely being complied with - in the US a similar system exists in many elite sports and I think that the FIA and FOM cleaned up their processes in Europe after some cases there.

Originally Posted by P38 in workshop

The optics of rejecting American institutions like GM,Cadillac and the Andretti dynasty wouldn't be great in a nation where the interest is growing rapidly and so many national flags are proudly flown.

Agree with this, but then they shouldn't get in just because they're American. If Andretti doesn't get in, it WILL be harder to explain in the US, where "World Champion" is sometimes used to describe winners of national championships. I expect for that reason that IF Andretti doesn't get in, there'll need to be clear reasons given, so that it can be explained.

Personally I hope that Andretti does get in. Will be interesting to see how the team goes designing and building its own cars for the first time - quite a significant challenge.

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by P38 in workshop

The optics of rejecting American institutions like GM,Cadillac and the Andretti dynasty wouldn't be great in a nation where the interest is growing rapidly and so many national flags are proudly flown.

Not really sure that would have the impact you think it would nationally. You don't see much Haas gear but rather the usual suspects at any of the races. And Caddy despite their efforts isn't really known as the racing brand and they've been at it in sportscars for 20 years now

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by broadrun96

Not really sure that would have the impact you think it would nationally. You don't see much Haas gear but rather the usual suspects at any of the races. And Caddy despite their efforts isn't really known as the racing brand and they've been at it in sportscars for 20 years now

Hard to say how it might play out inside the US if Andretti is blocked. I think it depends upon how much the US media latches onto it.

As to Cadillac not being able to elevate their "motorsports" or "performance" direction. I think that is because the vast majority of regular US customers are (sadly) oblivious to sportscar racing in the US.

Richard

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by Richard C

Hard to say how it might play out inside the US if Andretti is blocked. I think it depends upon how much the US media latches onto it.

and unfortunately, how much American celebrities tweet about it.

Haas doesnt seem to be ale to tap that resource and perhaps this is a trick Andretti is missing out on?

there has been a trend for pro clubs over here to bring on celebrity/athletes from other sports as investors/brand ambassadors into teams.

Miami Dolphins (doubt they were the first but its one that sticks out in my memory) from a bit over a decade ago where they sold a 1% stake each to a number of local celebs and athletes who now call Miami home. more recently Pat Mahomes (QB for the Kansas City Chiefs was sold/given a 1% ownership stake in his city's MLB baseball club the Royals). also seems like FOM, at least on the promotion side of things, has embraced the concept in how they promote the Miami and now LV GPs. and of course Alpine sold a big chunk to the Ryan Reynolds led group that had previously bought into a Premier League team and made a show about it.

perhaps the Andretti group is doing something similar but to my knowledge, if they are they dont seem to be placing those celebs front and center?

for better or worse, tapping into that celeb/social media culture is very much where it is at these days and for someone looking at securing a new sporting franchise this is perhaps a necessary ingredient for a successful bid?

[Richard C]

Maybe a PR campaign that acts as if it is a done deal. So that if it doesn't work out, there is a way to manufacture "outrage". This might seem to be underhanded, but frankly no less dirty than what is going on under the covers by other teams looking to find ways to exclude them.

While there are rumors that Andretti will get the positive nod from FIA (if not already) and then it goes to FOM. The question is.. if it is not an affirmative answer from FOM, when do you release that information? My guess is that you want to avoid timing that with the two races in US. So COTA is Oct 22nd and Las Vegas Nov 18th. Do you do it right after COTA to give it some time to cool before Las Vegas, right after Las Vegas or after end of season?

Richard

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by Richard C

Maybe a PR campaign that acts as if it is a done deal. So that if it doesn't work out, there is a way to manufacture "outrage". This might seem to be underhanded, but frankly no less dirty than what is going on under the covers by other teams looking to find ways to exclude them.

Richard

Problem there is Andretti did that at the beginning, and that put a lot of backs up which is why Andretti has been saying very little or maybe nothing since then.

[Tourer]

David Dicker from Rodin with his thoughts (& disappointment) at them missing out.

Maybe the FIA felt that F1 had seen enough maverick team owners for now?

[FIRE]

BERLIN, Oct 26 (Reuters) - Audi is reviewing its plans to enter Formula One in 2026, German news outlet Spiegel reported on Thursday.

Citing sources at parent company Volkswagen (VOWG_p.DE), Spiegel said the plans were being "analysed in detail" in the wake of a management change and cost-cutting measures.

...

The driving force behind the deal was then-Audi boss Markus Duesmann. At the beginning of September, Duesmann was replaced by Gernot Doellner.

...

Source: https://www.reuters.com/sports/motor...el-2023-10-26/

New boss, new ideas.

[Richard C]

Imagine the irony of Andretti buying the team from Audi. Especially given Sauber would gladly sell the team to Andretti previously, but was wanting to maintain control of the team.

Richard

[steve_r]

VAG have never previously been truly keen on F1 despite years and years of rumours and false starts. In many other forms of motorsport they have come in, done well and then swiftly left again (often when they were at the top or doing well). I'm thinking of their history in Sportscar racing, BTCC, WRC, DTM and Formula E.

I thought that they had finally made their decision with F1, but there is always an element of doubt.

All seems vague rumour at this stage....