[LM24] Nissan return to Le Mans (G56)

[deggis]

The earlier pic in huge resolution:

http://i.imgur.com/q26ypzy.jpg



From: http://www.newsroom.nissan-europe.co...mediaid=119572

[Bandicoot17]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/114186

Plans to run the ZEOD at Brazil and Fuji depending on how LM goes.

we haven't gone any freight booked, but we are a full-season entry in the WEC and we have paid for it"

One of two ZEODs now in existence

Anyone who thinks this isn't a serious project is kidding themselves. An excellent way to prepare for next season with pit stops and race practice.

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by Bandicoot17

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/114186

Plans to run the ZEOD at Brazil and Fuji depending on how LM goes.

Anyone who thinks this isn't a serious project is kidding themselves. An excellent way to prepare for next season with pit stops and race practice.

Are we under the illusion that full blown factory team would need two extra races for... pit stop and race practice preparation... in an experimental, slower, non classified car that is (or should be) entirely different from the new P1 and thus offer no real opportunity for meaningful data gathering.

Kudos for them for possibly wanting to bring it elsewhere too - it also makes sense to race an expensive car just more than one single time before it's retired - but this is just a marketing ploy.

I wonder why they have (had to?) paid for full season, participants are allowed to take part in one off races without paying the full price.

[Bandicoot17]

Originally Posted by Chiana

Are we under the illusion that full blown factory team would need two extra races for... pit stop and race practice preparation... in an experimental car that is (or should be) entirely different from the new P1 and thus offer no real opportunity for data gathering.

.

err no that's wasn't what I was getting at. They won't totally need it and it's not the main reason for racing the Zeod at these races, but the experience will be helpful.

Nothing beats real world experience. By racing the Zeod they will gain that experience and not be completely on the back foot when coming into P1 in terms of racing pitstops in comparison to the three teams who will all have had at leat year of practice (obvs many more for Audi and 3 for Toyota).

[Deleted]

Sure it's better than nothing at all, but at the same time pitstops, race stints and such can be done via private testing anywhere, anytime, and under controlled circumstances. And as I said I don't think ZEOD practices are gonna bear resemblance to the P1 process anyway

What you don't get in testing is fiddling in traffic with other classes racing at the same, however with ZEOD presumably being somewhere in the DW territory ie LMP2 speed, it's not really going to help for LMP1. And 24 hour race should do the trick already, if they can last it

Anyway there's no drawback in possibly doing those two races so they might just as well. Good for them.

[nobster]

If Ben Bowlby will be the designer again, what chance do we have at another deltawing like car?

[miatanut]

Originally Posted by Chiana

however with ZEOD presumably being somewhere in the DW territory ie LMP2 speed, it's not really going to help for LMP1.

The Deltawing was 300 HP. The ZEOD engine is 400 HP. The ZEOD may have more drag, but 33% more? And if it does have that much more, it would be because it has a lot more downforce, which would help with lap times. With all the batteries, it's heavier, which would impact lap time a little, but not to offset all that extra power. Either way, it should be capable of going a good deal faster than the DW, and it will be more a matter of choice about fuel consumption that will determine what speed it actually runs at. Or maybe racing politics.

[deggis]

Originally Posted by nobster

If Ben Bowlby will be the designer again, what chance do we have at another deltawing like car?

You for the P1 program or that he will be doing something else instead? Close to zero in P1, considering the chassis regulations. Luckily, I might add. Besides, neither the mockup car under the sheet or the 2D illustration in the press material hints at DW shape at all.

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by miatanut

The Deltawing was 300 HP. The ZEOD engine is 400 HP. The ZEOD may have more drag, but 33% more? And if it does have that much more, it would be because it has a lot more downforce, which would help with lap times. With all the batteries, it's heavier, which would impact lap time a little, but not to offset all that extra power. Either way, it should be capable of going a good deal faster than the DW, and it will be more a matter of choice about fuel consumption that will determine what speed it actually runs at. Or maybe racing politics.

If it was too fast ACO would indeed performance balance it down, as they don't want unclassified car interfering with others.

But I'm sure it'll jusy be up to P2 pace. DW was at the lower end of LMP2 order when it debuted so maybe ZEOD is middlefield...

DSC says:

On pace, if all goes well it should be capable of running with the leading LMP2s on petrol power and, we believe, the single electrically powered lap per stint should see it running faster than the leading GTEs.

[miatanut]

Originally Posted by Chiana

IBut I'm sure it'll jusy be up to P2 pace. DW was at the lower end of LMP2 order when it debuted so maybe ZEOD is middlefield...

One third more power will just move it from the lower end to mid-field?

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by miatanut

One third more power will just move it from the lower end to mid-field?

It's not as simple as that, they are not the same car.

[miatanut]

Originally Posted by Chiana

It's not as simple as that, they are not the same car.

Agreed.

The DW was created on a relative shoestring budget, then after it was on the road and didn't fall over in the first turn, a major manufacturer paid whatever they paid to put their name on it. The ZEOD has had major manufacturer support behind it from Day One. The DW lap times were tumbling through test day and qualifying until they hit the curb and decided to take it easy after that. There are some of the same people involved, including the main designer, so there is some knowledge transfer, plus advancement from that starting point. The ZEOD has to lug around a bunch of battery weight the DW didn't have to deal with, but all things considered, there is no reason to believe it is not significantly faster. Especially given 33% more horsepower on tap.

But, the whole point of the exercise is going about the same speed as the other cars, using a lot less resources. Last time we heard about tire wear, but not much on fuel consumption. I hope they do a better job of demonstrating that than the DW.

[gustavobamba]

Zeod RC 400 bhp per 700 kg.

DW 300 bhp per 500 kg

Who´s faster??? must wait until Sunday, but the ZEOD have 2 electric motor with 110 Kw (each) = 147 bhp. So the total output of Zeod will be around 695 bhp.

My doubt is will they run the ICE and electric power at the same time?!?!?!?!

If they do it, we will see times faster than LMP2!!!!

I don´t think ACO will let this happen… The DW was restricted to...

[FstrthnU]

The motors on the ZEOD RC are intended for an electric-only lap at the end of each stint, not as a power booster for the ICE.

[gustavobamba]

Originally Posted by FstrthnU

The motors on the ZEOD RC are intended for an electric-only lap at the end of each stint, not as a power booster for the ICE.

Thanks :-)

[miatanut]

Originally Posted by gustavobamba

Zeod RC 400 bhp per 700 kg.

DW 300 bhp per 500 kg

Who´s faster??? ? must wait until Sunday

Sounds like the DW has a small edge in a drag race, but unless the ZEOD has a lot more drag, it should be faster on the straight. If it does have a lot more drag, that would probably come with more downforce so better cornering.

As you say, we get to find out Sunday!

[Dimension]

beating electric powered cars off the line is... hard.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_ukLgsGEzs

I'm no NHRA buff, but that quartermile time seems rather quick.

The huge torque would easily offset the additional weight I'd say.

[optica]

Not really comparable with what the Zeod is trying to achieve but it would be interesting to know how quick the Drayson Lola would manage a lap of Le Mans.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_cRqcbXAs4

Some interesting comments about batteries under development.

[Bandicoot17]

Not sure if new information but...

[Dimension]

Not really.

I kind of forgot about it however, so reading your post I thought "wait, built by Radio Me Lans?"

[aleks_ader]

Originally Posted by Bandicoot17

Not sure if new information but...

Sorry for that, but who is RML?

[Bandicoot17]

Originally Posted by Dimension

Not really.

I kind of forgot about it however, so reading your post I thought "wait, built by Radio Me Lans?"

I'd seen stuff about the car being built by RML tbf, didn't know if it was known the engine was also built by them though.

[KA]

Originally Posted by aleks_ader

Sorry for that, but who is RML?

http://www.rmlmallock.co.uk/rml-group


Not a great surprise to hear RML are involved - they've got history with Nissan going back to the some of Nissan's later Group C campaigns at the beginning of the 90's. (Just noticed the ZEOD-RC appears as one of the background pics that cycle through their homepage)

I wouldn't be that surprised if they're involved in Nissan's 2015 LMP1 project somewhere either...

[CTD]

Originally Posted by KA

http://www.rmlmallock.co.uk/rml-group


Not a great surprise to hear RML are involved - they've got history with Nissan going back to the some of Nissan's later Group C campaigns at the beginning of the 90's. (Just noticed the ZEOD-RC appears as one of the background pics that cycle through their homepage)

I wouldn't be that surprised if they're involved in Nissan's 2015 LMP1 project somewhere either...

I wouldn't either. Especially as the 3 cylinder Zeod engine, could be a half LMP1 engine

[optica]

Looks as though this isn't going to be easy....

http://www.24h-lemans.com/en/news/20...746_15573.html