|
||||||||||
|
||||||||||
3 Apr 2003, 22:31 (Ref:557778) | #1 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,421
|
Brazilian GP 1994 - Senna Vs Schumacher Round 1
Well, it's now nine years since that race. Senna and Schumacher were on the front row of the grid. Senna gets a good start while Schumacher drops to 3rd behind Alesi. Then Schumacher gets past Alesi on lap 2, by which time Senna leads by 3 seconds. Schumacher closes on Senna, and both head in for their first pit stops on the same lap, lap 21. Schumacher has a faster stop and takes the lead from Senna. Senna was not giving up though, but crashed out of the race trying to catch Schumacher. Race over for Senna, and Schumacher wins.
This was the first round of the Senna Vs Schumacher duel, and Schumacher won. It seemed that it would be an intense rivalry, but the death of Senna at Imola put paid to that The only true battle that Senna and Schumacher ever had where they both got anywhere into the race was Brazil. I recommend downloading the race review off www.formula1onboard.tk Hard to believe that Senna would be dead two races later. Senna RIP. [Just fixing the link, Yoong Montoya.] Last edited by R; 3 Apr 2003 at 23:36. |
|
|
3 Apr 2003, 23:16 (Ref:557812) | #2 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 517
|
Senna didn't crash out as such, his car lost traction and span out. Senna became convinced that Schumacher/Benneton were illegally using traction control...
|
||
|
3 Apr 2003, 23:30 (Ref:557821) | #3 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,177
|
Surely Senna just span out rather than "lost traction". He spun at Júncó and stalled the engine if memory serves...
|
||
|
3 Apr 2003, 23:33 (Ref:557825) | #4 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 4,477
|
And he also admitted to having made a driver error. The sign of a true champion in my book (one sign of many).
Last edited by R; 3 Apr 2003 at 23:34. |
|
__________________
"An ignorant person is one who doesn't know what you've just found out" - Will Rogers |
4 Apr 2003, 04:15 (Ref:557927) | #5 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,370
|
Yes, and another thing that has always intigued me- even though Senna had the best car/team in the field for a lot of his career, when he didn't he still made a difference. Who could do that today? Not even TGF can come back from oure willpower like Senna did.
Another thing, ever notice the lack of criticism of Senna when he won with the best car? Seems we can all recognise a great driver when we want to. |
|
__________________
Holden- How One Legendary Driver Earned Nine Permanent circuits- the life blood of motorsport |
4 Apr 2003, 04:19 (Ref:557929) | #6 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,370
|
The 94 Williams was a "difficult car" (Frank Williams) and Senna had to physically force it to the front in quals and the races. Whether of not Benneton had TC is now irrelevant, because the battle only lasted 2 and a bit races and Senna was out at the beginning at Aida. If he had won the 94 title, it may have been even more impressive that 2nd in 93.
|
|
__________________
Holden- How One Legendary Driver Earned Nine Permanent circuits- the life blood of motorsport |
4 Apr 2003, 09:26 (Ref:558098) | #7 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 13,000
|
That Benetton may have been using traction control certainly does matter in an overall sense. It made Schumacher look better than he was at the time, took the title away from Williams and led to all the ridiculous bans and disqualifications Schumacher got (of which only the Silverstone disqualification was fair, the rest were merely concocted so as to keep the title close).
|
||
|
4 Apr 2003, 14:09 (Ref:558352) | #8 | |
Racer
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 320
|
I think it's been proved MS used illegal TC!
|
|
|
4 Apr 2003, 14:50 (Ref:558399) | #9 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 5,035
|
The fact that Senna suspected it after listening to the Bennetton accelerate at Aida only for the FIA to discover the software a few months later certainly makes it highly suspicious...
|
||
__________________
le bad boy |
4 Apr 2003, 15:37 (Ref:558477) | #10 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 517
|
Quote:
|
|||
|
4 Apr 2003, 15:55 (Ref:558499) | #11 | ||
Racer
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 276
|
Who would have won the 1994 Monaco race had Aryton lived? I`d go for Aryton and he would have been champion that year to,look what Damon did that year he nearly beat MS, I still can`t look at pictures of the 1994 oz race, too painfull
|
||
|
4 Apr 2003, 16:04 (Ref:558509) | #12 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,979
|
I have no doubt in my mind that the Benetton's used TC, just listen closely when Schumacher accelerates out of any medium/slow corner.
It's pretty obvious. Last edited by ASCII Man; 4 Apr 2003 at 16:07. |
|
|
4 Apr 2003, 21:29 (Ref:558793) | #13 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,421
|
Quote:
If they were cheating, then why didn't the FIA ban them? Is it because the Ferrari and McLaren cars were deemed illegal earlier, but the FIA didn't ban them either? |
||
|
4 Apr 2003, 21:33 (Ref:558795) | #14 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,370
|
I'm more concerned with the fact that if Benneton had TC it doesn't matter now because Senna was killed and so was the Championship fight. Sure, Hill got very close towards the end but really only because of disqualifications which closed it up. Adelaide was the last straw that year- not a good season in any way.
|
|
__________________
Holden- How One Legendary Driver Earned Nine Permanent circuits- the life blood of motorsport |
4 Apr 2003, 21:36 (Ref:558797) | #15 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,979
|
Maybe because the FIA believed Benetton's lame excuse that the TC software was a leftover of the previous season?
Wouldn't surprise me one bit. |
|
|
4 Apr 2003, 23:00 (Ref:558863) | #16 | ||
Racer
Join Date: Jun 1999
Posts: 324
|
The FIA did confirm that they where using TC...and Benetton was fined...
This was done after the season was over and very low key... What a joke that was.... Last edited by mariov; 4 Apr 2003 at 23:01. |
||
__________________
The problem with the gene pool is that there is no life guard present |
4 Apr 2003, 23:08 (Ref:558869) | #17 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 569
|
Quote:
Whoops, did I say that out loud? |
|||
__________________
It were proper bo, I tell thee. |
5 Apr 2003, 03:50 (Ref:559013) | #18 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 2,083
|
It could have been that mikey WAS using his TC,or the cheap,difficult williams was holding senna up ---but very likely is was both factors
As for the fia not doing anything about benetton's TC-the word 'impotent' comes to mind,LOL Imagine being a lawyer AND the other.....No wonder max does some bizare stuff!! |
||
|
5 Apr 2003, 12:35 (Ref:559231) | #19 | ||
Racer
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 413
|
Here's on excerpt from an interview that Montoya did with Gerhard Berger which gives some insight into this topic:
JPM: What do you think of Michael Schumacher? GB: He was a pain in the arse when he arrived in F1! Ayrton and I decided that we didn't like him - maybe it was because he didn't show any respect, a bit like you nowadays. At the time, I didn't realise the potential that he had. I saw him as a good racing driver, but I didn't see him as outstanding. However, I think Ayrton did - he realised immediately that the guy was special, that he would be a threat. |
||
__________________
Let no way be the way - let no limitation be the limitation! The late great Bruce Lee |
5 Apr 2003, 13:47 (Ref:559268) | #20 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 663
|
Quote:
The only fact that has ever been proven is that TC was in the software, and that Benny left the TC in the software due to the FIA banning TC in 1993, on that fact alone if the reintroduction on TC & LC was reintroduced at the UK then all of the cars in F1 would be illegal and all of the driver cheats, even that JPM fellow. |
|||
__________________
It is not enough to succeed. Others must fail - Gore Vidal |
5 Apr 2003, 13:50 (Ref:559269) | #21 | |||
Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 663
|
Quote:
|
|||
__________________
It is not enough to succeed. Others must fail - Gore Vidal |
5 Apr 2003, 14:00 (Ref:559277) | #22 | ||
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 4,936
|
Don't forget Benneton's illegal refueling rig as well! That one most certainly _has_ been proven!
It's rather arbitrary to start the rivalry in '94... Senna and Schumacher clashed _many_ times in the previous 2 seasons in more or less equal equipment... It just happens their battles were usually for second or third, with the Williams cars streaking away into the distance. |
||
__________________
"Put a ****ing wheel on there! Let me go out again!" -Gilles Villeneuve, Zandvoort, 1979 |
5 Apr 2003, 14:03 (Ref:559280) | #23 | |
Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 7,979
|
Silverstone '93 is a good example of a fight between Senna, Schumacher and Prost while Hill disappeared in the distance. And it showed that the Ford engines that McLaren got still were inferior to the Benetton's.
Last edited by ASCII Man; 5 Apr 2003 at 14:04. |
|
|
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Senna or Schumacher | beau | Formula One | 56 | 25 Aug 2003 12:17 |
Michael Schumacher 1994 | Shoe-maker | Formula One | 37 | 13 Feb 2003 15:37 |
Schumacher Vs Senna 1994 | bastinscully | Formula One | 8 | 25 Jul 2002 16:48 |
Senna vs. Schumacher | Down F0rce | Formula One | 36 | 21 Jul 2002 00:32 |