Sportscar/GT (and Le Mans) Rumours and Repetition

[templer]

Originally Posted by carbon_titanium

If memory helps me the arx04 lmp1 plot was this: HPD was going to build an lmp1 coupè with Wirth using a modified version of the V6 2.2 turbo of indycars for the 2014 season. Problem is that before the start of work, HPD was looking for customers, but none was going to buy one. Because of this, the car was delayed for 2015. At the end HPD gave up and decided to convert the project in an lmp2 car.

Well if i remember right the main problem was that HPD wanted their customers to pay the whole development costs. I remember that Strakka have looked onto the HPD car but the price was ridiculous even for them. I think the high price even for the engine was a reason for Onroak to stop their LMP1 project.
But this all have nothing to do with Honda. If they have changed their minds in terms of a true works effort why did they switch from Wirth Research which have a fully developed car, to McLaren. That is the question for me.

[Breitling24]

Originally Posted by DistortedSmile

He's Spanish.

Oops, meant to type that as "Spanish driver in Italian F1..." my bad. Should have had my glasses on my face.

[deggis]

https://twitter.com/specutainment/st...93500785655809

Midweek Motorsport
‏@specutainment
lmp1 for ford according to @RacecarEd

@RacecarEd = Andrew Cotton

[deggis]

Retrospective reading (March): http://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/f...rn-to-le-mans/

“Clearly there is a strong heritage between Ford Racing and Le Mans… What the future brings, it could be a function of circumstances.

Maybe circumstances suddenly became right?

[Acid09]

Originally Posted by deggis

https://twitter.com/specutainment/st...93500785655809

@RacecarEd = Andrew Cotton

That would we a good example of a programme coming together silently and with a bang.

Everybody was kind of expecting Honda or even Ferrari to do something but Ford hardly was a realistic prospect.

I'd be amazed if that actually happens. Audi vs Toyota vs Nissan vs Porsche vs Ford.. jesus. Is Bernie E on suicide watch yet?

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by Lagunaseca_4life

Hmm I'm nont sure if a simple tweet has been taken wayyyy out of context or if there really is somthing behind this car/entry wise......



If it's ford I swear I'll quit my job and stop fixing their piece of crap cars!

You could have quit a few days ago then.

Maybe I'm not as wrong as you so wisely assume?

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by Acid09

I'd be amazed if that actually happens. Audi vs Toyota vs Nissan vs Porsche vs Ford.. jesus. Is Bernie E on suicide watch yet?

I don't think Uncle Bernard has been aware of sportscar racing's existence since the fall of the World Sportscar Championship...

Anyway Ford in would be, needless to say, MASSIVE.

[Thaw Daggerslash]

Audi, Toyota, Porsche, Nissan, potentially Ford, as well as rumours of interest from BMW and a well developed McLaren/Honda. Oh my word.

Safe to say sportscar racing looks to be entering a new golden era. Racing fans often have a tradition of looking back on the past and reminiscing about how good things used to be...so I'll say this. Enjoy this new era while it lasts.

[Deleted]

I say this - we are indeed seem to be looking into golden era in factory LMP1, even if it stays at 'just' four for next year and the others don't materialize (which tbh is starting to look somewhat unlikely now). But other categories, not so much... P1 privateer is on life support, LMP2 is healthy in numbers but as a whole rather uninspiring in it's current form, and GTE aka GT3 with less models is sportscar racing's equivalent to WWE show 'entertainment'

[Pontlieue]

Originally Posted by Chiana

I say this - we are indeed seem to be looking into golden era in factory LMP1, even if it stays at 'just' four for next year and the others don't materialize (which tbh is starting to look somewhat unlikely now). But other categories, not so much... P1 privateer is on life support, LMP2 is healthy in numbers but as a whole rather uninspiring in it's current form, and GTE aka GT3 with less cars is sportscar racing's equivalent to WWE show 'entertainment'

Factory LMP1 is great at the moment. As for privateer LMP1, as much as I like to see privateer LMP1s, there's hardly any room for it with at least four, maybe up to six factory teams next year. LMP2 is healthy, as you said, and it's really interesting to watch in ELMS. WEC LMP2 has its problems, though. I agree that GTE is the main problem. It has become similar to GT3, just with a complete lack of variety, as it is only Ferrari vs. Porsche, with a few Astons outside America.

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by Pontlieue

Factory LMP1 is great at the moment. As for privateer LMP1, as much as I like to see privateer LMP1s, there's hardly any room for it with at least four, maybe up to six factory teams next year. LMP2 is healthy, as you said, and it's really interesting to watch in ELMS. WEC LMP2 has its problems, though. I agree that GTE is the main problem. It has become similar to GT3, just with a complete lack of variety, as it is only Ferrari vs. Porsche, with a few Astons outside America.

There would be room for privateer P1s in the ELMS if ACO were to let them... something needs to be done, the current format for them doesn't work.

LMP2's pro-am format mixed with the cost-cap and a sort of underpowered cars doesn't exactly give me huge thrills. Even though I like the racing itself there (and the lack of BoP is a huge bonus, despite what was initially feared couple of years ago)

As for GTE, I can't think a single good thing left in that category. It is garbage. I only follow it now because it fills half of the grid so you sort of have to keep track on things by default, and Corvette is still there, among some others.

But P1 factory is indeed great. Now they only need not to screw up the regs

[Acid09]

I know this is an unpopular opinion but I don't see why we even need LMP1 privateers if we have 4+ manufacturers.

Let the privateers run LMP2 and that's that.

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by Acid09

I know this is an unpopular opinion but I don't see why we even need LMP1 privateers if we have 4+ manufacturers.

Let the privateers run LMP2 and that's that.

The 'official answer' for that is that if (=WHEN) this era eventually ends and most of the works teams back off again leaving just a couple of factory cars on the table (or, as post-Audi-Bentley years, NONE at all) you are going to need some names in your class. Manufacturers come and go, it happens all the time. So having a solid privateer field is rather important.

But my personal answer is that watching P1 privateers is exponentially more exciting than the cost cap low performance P2s. And if someone wants to fight for overall victory (even if it's realistically not going to happen (unless that ELMS window is opened)) well good for them. Just get rid of the LMP1-L sub trophy 'everybody needs to be a winner' crap

[TF110]

Acid, that works until the works teams are gone! Im more wanting to see someone put money behind Rebellion. Maybe they can grow their relationship with Toyota/TMG in the future and at least carry on the powertrain usage. If Toyota leave the wec in the near future, they should try their best to secure usage of their facilities.

[deggis]

Originally Posted by Pontlieue

Factory LMP1 is great at the moment. As for privateer LMP1, as much as I like to see privateer LMP1s, there's hardly any room for it with at least four, maybe up to six factory teams next year.

Really? The two elephants in the room: getting rid off GT-Am and the artificial grid size limits for WEC.

The need for P1 privateers will go away with more manufacturers. Some day some of the manufacturers will leave once they think marketing goals have been completed (or ACO just screws up things) and then there is a sudden need to fill the grid again.

[TF110]

Alonso just tweeted this http://twitter.com/alo_oficial/statu...48561972772864

[deggis]

a) he is trying to set up a cycling team
b) usual F1 stuff in Maranello
.
.
.
z) anything to do with LMPs

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by deggis

a) he is trying to set up a cycling team
b) usual F1 stuff in Maranello
.
.
.
z) anything to do with LMPs

Whhhhaaaat? Are you suggesting this is not official confirmation of plans going ahead for 6 car factory Ferrari LMP1 entry (plus two privateer cars run by Risi Competizione), with Alonso abandoning F1 after this year because he's tired of it?

[TF110]

I like how you read into things

[GT6]

wow is that just a rumour or can we take that as going to happen

[Coach Ep]

Originally Posted by GT6

wow is that just a rumour or can we take that as going to happen

Yes (+ Ford)

[GT6]

So that is 6 ferarri lmp1's and a ford

[Acid09]

I have never been a fan of the "manufacturers leave sooner or later" theory.

If the environment is right, they don't. Look at Audi in sports car racing, Mercedes & Audi in the DTM, Chevrolet in NASCAR etc.

Plus, the WEC is approaching a point where there's a certain fail-safe margin when it comes to manufacturers. If we really get to a point where there's five of them, we could afford one or two of them dropping out and we'd be still not worse off than we are today (which is pretty darn brilliant).

I like the romantic idea of LMP1 privateers challenging the factories but lets not kid ourselves, these days are gone. With so many factories in LMP1, even hoping for a lot of attrition is starting to become unrealistic for privateers.

If 8-10 manufacturer cars are racing, not all of them are going to hit trouble. And they will never keep up on sheer pace, not with this highly-technical rule set that requires so much engineering and preparation.

I like Rebellion, I really do, but looking at it from a non-romantic point of view, it really is an exercise in burning money. They are not going to stand a chance against three factories going head to head..let alone four or five of them.

[TF110]

Manufacturers will be there, but not all of them. Audi ran the past decade at a time where no one but Peugeot bothered to join. Its up to the aco to keep manufacturers interested. Hopefully that remains the case.

[Acid09]

The rules are the key. During the Diesel years it was not very attractive for manufacturers to join, unless you wanted to advertise Diesel technology, which only Audi & Peugeot were interested in.

Still, it got us some great racing and one of the best Le Mans ever