Acura/HPD's future plans

[Deleted]

Originally Posted by Matt

It's not an LMP2 car though. It's a DPi.

And then when it gets it's fake body ripped off and is shipped to Le Mans, even with the non-spec engine, it magically transforms into LMP2, right...

It's no different to GT3 being called GTD or whatever.

Anyway, HPD (or "Acura" if the branding indeed changes again) might still get their will through and have cars only running the engines under the ACO spec chassis, without the body. 04 is obviously dead meat but it could still happen with the new spec cars, if they can lobby it right. And especially if others agree and no-one except GM ultimately buys into the bodywork business, just like now in DP.

[Rodger Davies]

Replace Ligier badge with Acura one. Rehomologate. Worked for Alpine.

[Deleted]

Alpine might have French Waiver

Though I must say (even though as principal I despise rebadging), Acura could actually have chances of succeeding in the name change, unlike with Honda which is definite no no because of the major manufacturer title linkup.

Anyway the MSR "Ligier" (=Onroak) is already referred to as "Honda Prototype" in the States, it would only need ("need") rebading for LM

[BrentJackson]

Originally Posted by FormulaFox

Actually, it's not. We KNOW 6 manufacturers are interested because they've stated such publicly: HPD, Chevy, Bentley, Alfa Romeo, Mazda, and Nissan. (I could swear there's more than that, but I cannot recall them at this time)

HOWEVER.... Interest does not mean a program will occur, and don't expect to see any other than Chevy in 2017. The rules package is not yet finalized, and any interested manufacturer will have to do an engine AND bodywork. This has proven extremely frustrating to the manufacturers(HPD particularly), and it is unlikely they will be able to have cars ready for 2017 - Chevy's the only one I would expect to be able to make it, and even that will be in doubt if the rules aren't finalized VERY soon. It's a very real possibility that we'll see a few grandfathered DPs and P2s and a handful of Gibson-powered new!P2s representing DPi in 2017.

2018 is when most interested manufacturers are likely to debut IF it goes beyond mere interest.

I can agree with a lot of this, but my read is that 2017 will probably be a year where the bodywork requirement is held off on, for the reasons you describe - the rules not being set in stone with the first race for these cars being eleven months away is getting rather tight for aero development. IMSA may go the route of allowing the engines in 2017 for those who are committed to 2018 bodywork developments, thus effectively forcing those who are actually serious (GM, Mazda and Honda for sure, Bentley very possible, Nissan maybe, Alfa Romeo a long shot) to commit to going for it while giving them more time to get it right. This would allow GM to bring out the turbo V6, Nissan the unit from the LMP1 car, Mazda the MZR-R and Bentley the big turbo V8 and get a year of racing it before the bodywork comes out. This also has the advantage of sorting things out one at a time, so if there is any issue with the engines they can deal with that before the bodywork.

[FormulaFox]

Originally Posted by hondafan37

BMW could be in DPI in 2018 or later. Jens Marquardt said that to dailysportcar in october 2015.

THAT'S the one I was trying to remember. Thanks. How in the bleepity bleep did I forget freaking BMW?!

[carbon_titanium]

Originally Posted by Rodger Davies

Replace Ligier badge with Acura one. Rehomologate. Worked for Alpine.

basically is what I meant for "HPD DPi"
just bring the ESM and MSR HPD ligier, change front lights, put honda badge on nose and you get the HPD DPi. Very likely this is what is going to happen.

Anyway I don't know how much the cosworth/nissan V6 can be fitted in the rear of a car.

[Rodger Davies]

Originally Posted by carbon_titanium

Anyway I don't know how much the cosworth/nissan V6 can be fitted in the rear of a car.

Well it can't be much worse than when it's in the front of one.....

[carbon_titanium]

Originally Posted by Rodger Davies

Well it can't be much worse than when it's in the front of one.....

indeed

anyway, if nissan will field a DPi, surely will be picked the updated gt-r v6 3.8 TT that powers the renault rs01. Destroked to 3.5 maybe, if the max displacement will remain the actual one.

[Deleted]

As with HPD, I bet "Mazda" too would love to just run the generic spec chassis with their own engine if were they allowed to, and not to bother with the rule built for GM.

[TF110]

I think if there was an actual gain (allowed) in the brand bodywork, these guys would be all over it for next year. But alas, "DPi" continues the trend of dumified, near spec, everyone has to be equal rules. I think hpd should look to customers in privateer lmp1. I'd like to see the 04 try their hand with an upgraded 3.5L hpd made for the wec/LM.

[BrentJackson]

Originally Posted by TF110

I think if there was an actual gain (allowed) in the brand bodywork, these guys would be all over it for next year. But alas, "DPi" continues the trend of dumified, near spec, everyone has to be equal rules. I think hpd should look to customers in privateer lmp1. I'd like to see the 04 try their hand with an upgraded 3.5L hpd made for the wec/LM.

Customers in LMP1 are non-existent. And I don't mean that metaphorically, I mean they do not exist. And with the ACO mandating spec-engine four-chassis cars in the WEC and ELMS next year, it's full-on manufacturer P1 (FAR too expensive) or IMSA.

[TF110]

I think that's false, at least for the future. AER has both Rebellion and Kolles. Strakka have history in the class (most recent exit) and shown interest in rejoining. Not to mention they ran hpd last time out. Vincent Beaumesnil was pretty confident on the class's increase in this interview. He mentions 3 teams and we know there's interest from Courage (hpd link there also).

[Deleted]

Indeed, the only reason to have bodywork is for "brand recognization" as IMSA will bop everything in wind tunnel. It's just dead matter on top of the real car.

[BrentJackson]

Originally Posted by TF110

I think that's false, at least for the future. AER has both Rebellion and Kolles. Strakka have history in the class (most recent exit) and shown interest in rejoining. Not to mention they ran hpd last time out. Vincent Beaumesnil was pretty confident on the class's increase in this interview. He mentions 3 teams and we know there's interest from Courage (hpd link there also).

I can Rebellion and sorta see Kolles (his history isn't exactly littered with successes), but Strakka got out of P1 because it was too expensive, and it hasn't gotten cheaper. Sure, they and Dome did develop a (now a paperweight) LMP2 car, but I can't see anything on that route.

Beaumesnil can say whatever he likes, and he's obviously gonna talk up the class. But any of us can see the truth - Privateer P1 is a waste of time and money and nobody sane is going to spend the money involved to have Porsche, Audi and Toyota demolish them. Which means unless HPD is gonna poach Rebellion or Kolles, them in P1 is not gonna happen unless they wanna go spend €50 million or more on it, which we know isn't gonna happen. It's dead, and the ACO's truly-idiotic decision to go with psuedo-spec LMP2s means for Honda its DPi, a hybrid GTE car or nothing. Be glad they are trying for a a DPi.

[Deleted]

Your points have already been counter-argumented here
http://tentenths.com/forum/showthread.php?t=146384

[Dyson Mazda]

Originally Posted by Chiana

As with HPD, I bet "Mazda" too would love to just run the generic spec chassis with their own engine if were they allowed to, and not to bother with the rule built for GM.

I think at the end of the day, most manufacturer bodywork will be very basic and not a total aero redesign (looking something like the Alfa rendering that has been floating around).

[IMG][/IMG]

[wdave0]

Given how developed the aero is on these cars it would be really expensive (and silly) to go much beyond headlight treatment and "grill" treatments and then just get BOPed back anyway - if superior to the original, especially since the engine too will get BOPed. As long as IMSA calls it a Cadillac or Nissan or Acura it doesn't much matter (see current DP "vette").

[Deleted]

IF IMSA's requirement is just "as long as it's something I guess", I can see HPD writing a 200 dollar check for aero, like Ford has done with their, uhm, "bodywork" for Riley DP... the bare minimum, for getting to be called "Honda Prototype" or "Acura Prototype" or whatever it is they want that Onroak car to be rebadged as. As said, no reason to waste money for anything else

[BrentJackson]

Originally Posted by Chiana

Your points have already been counter-argumented here
http://tentenths.com/forum/showthread.php?t=146384

Yes, but everybody there conveniently forgot that P1-L costs atleast 3-4x more than P2 does, which is kinda a problem, and right now if you want to actually win anything you have to beat Porsche, Audi and Toyota, which makes it far more expensive still. There isn't a thing in the new rules that reduces that problem.

[FormulaFox]

Originally Posted by BrentJackson

Yes, but everybody there conveniently forgot that P1-L costs atleast 3-4x more than P2 does, which is kinda a problem, and right now if you want to actually win anything you have to beat Porsche, Audi and Toyota, which makes it far more expensive still. There isn't a thing in the new rules that reduces that problem.

Nonetheless, there is at least one other entity not currently on the grid that is working on a P1 car.

[joeb]

Originally Posted by Dyson Mazda

I think at the end of the day, most manufacturer bodywork will be very basic and not a total aero redesign (looking something like the Alfa rendering that has been floating around).

[IMG][/IMG]

MP had an article a while ago detailing what sections of the bodywork can be changed. Of course this was before the regs were finalized, but this seems to align with what we've heard from imsa:

http://www.racer.com/imsa/item/11870...pe-regulations

[Makaze]

Should be Honda/Acura/HPD racing news today at the NYC Auto Show.

2017 DPi?

2017 NSX GT3?

Two Pikes Peak NSX racers.

Pikes Peak EV AWD CR-Z.

[Matt]

Maybe.

Maybe.

Maybe.

Maybe.

[Madkart]

Originally Posted by Makaze

Should be Honda/Acura/HPD racing news today at the NYC Auto Show.

2017 DPi?

2017 NSX GT3?

Two Pikes Peak NSX racers.

Pikes Peak EV AWD CR-Z.

Auto Show starts on the 25th. I think we might have to wait just a few more days.

[Matt]

There should be an announcement later today re: Acura/HPD motorsports.