Classic rallycross / revival?

leonidas · 6 Nov 2006, 17:17 (Ref:1759212)

Anyone know if the BRDA are planning to introduce a classics category like the MDA's revivals class?

I thought this class was a real success story at the superprix and it would be good to see more of these cars. In some ways this might end up as a better 'starter category' than stock hatch - there's a greater variety of cars qualified to run, you can have a go in any old rallycar (so no need to build new) and there's unlikely to be the 'cheating' allegations that seem to bedevil stock hatch. And there's a more varied grid for the spectator...

RXfan · 6 Nov 2006, 17:30 (Ref:1759227)

Yeah totally agree wouldnt it be great to see more tail sliding mk2 escorts etc. If it really takes off it may even have to be split into 2 classes.The only problem i see is what is there to stop someone with a big budget coming into the class and blowing everyone away with a competitve group B 4wd car or similar?

**silver bullet** · 6 Nov 2006, 20:03 (Ref:1759342)

Sorry, but I strongly disagree. The revivals/classic class should not become part of mainstream rallycross, that would be a backward step.
I don't even think 6R4's and RS 200's should be allowed in the British Championship. We should be looking forward not backwards.
There may be a place for these cars but IMHO it should only be in a historic class, not with current machinary.

leonidas · 6 Nov 2006, 20:30 (Ref:1759364)

I'm not suggested they necessarily be given an MSA championship slot but they could be made part of the clubman's BTRDA championship. Perhaps this could be a way of reviving the BTRDA modified championship by turning it into a 'historic' class?

**silver bullet** · 6 Nov 2006, 20:39 (Ref:1759374)

Yes that might not be a bad idea, especially if the BRDA want to split off the BTRDA championship for a few rounds like they did in 2004. It could help boost the entry for the clubman rounds.

bigted · 6 Nov 2006, 20:42 (Ref:1759378)

Mr Harolds 4 x 4 Beetle looks a bit good now, that would be fun to see out again

http://members.lycos.co.uk/ppjracing/

chunder · 7 Nov 2006, 09:54 (Ref:1759751)

Hasnt this all been tried beforein the past,didnt Charlie Golding or someone like that win a load o races by laps and the grid only got a few cars.

I am not sure its a good idea to try and put weight behind new classes when the existing ones need work, yes there might be five guys out there who will commit to a season in revival cars,but we do need to be more forward thinking.

M.Lowe · 8 Nov 2006, 10:24 (Ref:1760727)

That beetle was awesome to watch and I think there should be a class for the Group B cars xtracs etc if they are still about

DCS · 14 Nov 2006, 22:30 (Ref:1766269)

Quote:

Originally Posted by silver bullet

I don't even think 6R4's and RS 200's should be allowed in the British Championship.

Says the man with old school Escort WRC on his avatar...

Anyway let the new style Rallycross cars prove that they are actually quicker! And yes with same (displacement related) weight and restrictors for everyone!

I am sure newer machinery can beat Group B's...

What would you rather see? 10 new cars or 10 new cars + 5 old cars = 15 cars? Waste to put old cars away...

zac510 · 14 Nov 2006, 23:16 (Ref:1766308)

Would the classic/revivals still turn up if there was no cash prize, ie just a run around category to have fun, winner gets bragging rights and that's it?
Perhaps a crowd/popular choice prize for the revivals category!

HrRACING · 14 Nov 2006, 23:52 (Ref:1766324)

Quote:

Originally Posted by zac510

Would the classic/revivals still turn up if there was no cash prize, ie just a run around category to have fun, winner gets bragging rights and that's it?
Perhaps a crowd/popular choice prize for the revivals category!

Hang on, what other classes are getting cash prizes?

zac510 · 15 Nov 2006, 10:33 (Ref:1766609)

I don't know, I'm not a competitor?
Maybe you have to win

leonidas · 15 Nov 2006, 12:36 (Ref:1766735)

Its worth remembering that next year sees the 40th anniversary of rallycross - a great excuse to get some old skool cars out. How about an annual 'historics' trophy at the Superprix or at the anniversary meeting at Lydden?

Fast man · 15 Nov 2006, 13:50 (Ref:1766808)

"anniversary meeting at Lydden" ?

Tell us more please!

**BertMk2** · 15 Nov 2006, 14:07 (Ref:1766823)

As I understand it there are 3 BRDA rounds planned for Lydden next year - the usual Easter and August bank holidays and one of the May bank holidays, this extra Lydden meeting is the "anniversary" meeting. I'm not entirely sure how different (if at all) it will be from a normal BRDA meeting. Different or not - it's more rallycross at Lydden and that can only be good news

leonidas · 15 Nov 2006, 16:30 (Ref:1766973)

Yes, I don't think any details have been announced yet about the Lydden anniversary meeting. There are also supposed to be special events at the first round of the new 'British Open' championship season at Croft in February.

Perhaps by the 50th anniversary of rallycross Lydden will have got its ERC round back!

Barrie · 15 Nov 2006, 18:15 (Ref:1767055)

Wouldn't it be great to get some of the legendary drivers envolved in the cellebrations, John Welch, Keith Ripp, Trevor Reeves, Barry Lee, for example, and how about the Europeans, De Rooys, Franz Wurz, Olle Arnesson, and of course Martin Schanche. Even better if they were on the track.

chunder · 16 Nov 2006, 12:15 (Ref:1767663)

As I have said before about this idea, I think there are more pressing problems to be encountered in the UK rallycross scene than some ideological crusade to bring back all the great drivers!
I thnk we need to get a bit more inline with some of the European formulas and get some of our guys able to race in the ERC before we look at that kjibd of thing

I agree about the sentiment, but right now we have small grids in some classes and surely efforts need to be made to eitehr find out why or change things to get more new drivers into the sport.

Maybe an old car class is the right way to go but its hardly gonna be cheap!

leonidas · 20 Nov 2006, 15:36 (Ref:1770704)

Quote:

Originally Posted by chunder

I agree about the sentiment, but right now we have small grids in some classes and surely efforts need to be made to eitehr find out why or change things to get more new drivers into the sport.

I guess its a matter of taste. I suppose I'm speaking as someone who is now more attracted to 'classics' - and I reckon an increasing number of people are too judging by the reaction to that Mk2 escort at the Superprix. I think the motivation for classic classes is less about winning and more about just driving a 'different' machine in competition. People were driving modified minis long after they ceased to be competitive just because it was a laugh.

I'm a big supporter of ERC rules and formulae but I don't think the ERC have played it all that sensibily. Div 2 is effectively dead so no-one wants to build new cars and no-one knows if the rwd Cup class will become a full ERC formula. Everyone is waiting to see what happens. Meanwhile the BRDA are reluctant (understandably) to follow the ERC lead for fear of losing drivers...

Personally I'd like to see the ERC introduce a limited-spec Group N 4wd formula - cars that could be easily and cheaply prepared from road cars but could still be seriously quick. They'd be attractive to watch (how many rallyfans out there drive Scoobies and Evos! ;-) ) They'd also give drivers experience of 4wd before stepping up to Div 1.

PhergAthor · 20 Nov 2006, 16:43 (Ref:1770752)

Quote:

Originally Posted by leonidas

Personally I'd like to see the ERC introduce a limited-spec Group N 4wd formula - cars that could be easily and cheaply prepared from road cars but could still be seriously quick. They'd be attractive to watch (how many rallyfans out there drive Scoobies and Evos! ;-) ) They'd also give drivers experience of 4wd before stepping up to Div 1.

Been there, done that. Rx had a Evo-class and it was one of the most boring ones ever. And do not make the mistake that those cars are cheap. Group N is simply not that suitable for RX.
RWD is also good to get used to RX, in fact, it is more difficult to drive a RWD than a 4x4. OK Div2 is dying, but the new cup wil step in and make for a big class.

And for those revival-fans, we in Belgium have the option to run these cars. Ludo Helven drives a MKII within the Div3-rules (kind of supermodified class).

leonidas · 20 Nov 2006, 17:20 (Ref:1770769)

Will the cup class take off? I hope so but I'm not so sure. I haven't heard of anyone in GB or Ireland who is building one. Many modern cars will be difficult and expensive to convert - its not something you can do without a fair degree of technical competence. And if you're going to go to that trouble you may as well build a supernational as you've freer rules and more readily available parts and know-how (and you can race it in more places).

Or you could just buy a Mk2 escort!

Roundy Mooney · 20 Nov 2006, 17:27 (Ref:1770771)

Would have to agree there is nothing cheap about group N 4WD. A good EVO 9 could set you back 80 euro no problem and are very expensive to run. Plus the fact that they are boring to watch and in some cases boring to drive because they are so good at what they do !!

RXfan · 20 Nov 2006, 20:39 (Ref:1770903)

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhergAthor

Been there, done that. Rx had a Evo-class and it was one of the most boring ones ever. And do not make the mistake that those cars are cheap. Group N is simply not that suitable for RX.

Does the new rallycross open series not have a new class for group N Evo's next year? I cant wait now!!!

HrRACING · 21 Nov 2006, 03:43 (Ref:1771124)

Yeah, built by Paul Waldron.

chunder · 21 Nov 2006, 11:34 (Ref:1771350)

I agree about Group N it basically became a class for haves and have nots, but you had to admire the quality of the grid, there were some seriously good drivers in the class and some very big budget entries like Opland, Sallstrom, Bohlin?Svan etc.

I really am not sure about the future classes in ERC. You have to have something good to watch that is spectacular and fun to drive really, like the Sierra days.

Then again the top guys in that class like Kenny and Bjorn were spending not a lot less than the top guys in Div 1 I imagine, coz the pace of development was so quick.

I really think Supernational is the way forward. There has to be a way to adopt that class in southern Europe, but also including a fwd class into the mix to reflect Europes lack of rwd cars on sale. The cars have to be strong and cheap to fix aswell. Even now you could get the Supernationals over and ahve a thirty car field!

Maybe use a different type of engine, praps a low boost turbo motor or something, everyone uses the same. To get the same sort of power as the Evo Volvo engines.

I think Super 1600 is a crazy class, far too dear and not enough cars when youa re always gonna get a few guys using ex works rally cars that cost 50 grand.

The 2wd GpN class is OK, and is good for the lesser nations to get into the sport, so keep that, but this should be the lowest class, with a Supernational replica class next up then the big boys.

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