Team Pakistan

[Stephen Green]

Hi Lufty and a huge welcome to ten-tenths

[Mr Jinxx]

Age is less important than time in the seat. Adam has made a remarkable jump up to A1GP. He definitely surprised me, and I'm sure he's surprised Alan Docking too. Give him time. Time in the seat, that is. He's talented.

[Go-Pakistan]

Originally Posted by mbathshah

Also remember Nelson Piquet is only 20 and so is Nico Rosberg.

Yes, it is true !!!

Adam Khan is Not the son of a formula 1 world champion !!

So with the obvious opportunities and training this brings, it comes as no great surprise that piquet jr. and rosberg jr. are where they are. Yes, piquet won the F3 championship and he is of course a supremely talented driver, i'm not denying that, but he also had the 3/4 million pounds required to take to the best team in order to win the series.

Once again, credit where credit is due, for Khan to do f.ford and have 3 part seasons in F3 and then in A1 be 7th in his first race and upto 4th in his second and missing a podium because of a pit problem is surely a great achievement.

As Lutfy has rightly said, anyone who thinks motor racing is easy should try it themselves and see how hard it really is.

[mbathshah]

What about Lewis Hamilton? he is not the son of an ex F1 Driver. Also Nico Rosberg has clearly won his drive through talent and not just because he is the son of Keke. Won GP2 in it's first year which is surely a great achievment and the reason why he is likely to be a Williams Driver. It's not just about money in racing it's about the talent. You need both to get to the top in motorsport. Somehow I don't think Lauda's son nor Prost's son are ever likely to make it F1 - they clearly have no talent to back up their famous names whereas Nico and to a lesser extent Nelson Piquet do.

[Go-Pakistan]

Originally Posted by mbathshah

What about Lewis Hamilton? he is not the son of an ex F1 Driver.

I never said rosberg Jr and piquet Jr are where they are just because they are the son of a f1 champ. I said it brings opportunites and training…(that joe bloggs in the street wouldn’t dream of getting). They have made use of what is available to them and put in the hard work to turn this into results. Just like the best Doctors / Surgeons / teachers / engineers / lawyers / plumbers / carpenters or any other profession are the ones with the best training & education and prepared to put in the hard work and make the most efficient use of their knowledge to put it into practice.

People who win races and championships are those who maximize their potential to put into practice what they have learned, that’s the difference between a driver who can post his fastest qualifying lap time in lap 2 or 3 of a session whilst a driver who is not as efficient may need many more laps to post his fastest lap (assuming a track is new to both drivers in this example).

Lewis Hamilton is not the son of a formula 1 driver, but he had been karting for 6 seasons from the age of 10. ..(The late and great A.Senna started karting at the age of 4 or 5)…..
Karting is not free, 6 seasons in professional categories cost hundreds of thousands of pounds.

He won the British formula Renault championship in 2003. A drive with an entry level team costs £85k, with a front running team costs £150k. Hamilton's budget was reportedly £400k. He is backed by McLaren. Let me just say I am NOT taking anything away from him in terms of his talent and hope he can get to F1 soon as I’d love to see him there.

So…no, it is not all about money, but it certainly helps. Motor racing is not like football, for example where you can buy a ball for coins or find one and play and practice all day long wherever you want. No body is going to close a track just for Mr. Joe Public to have free go in his racing car or kart!

There is no such thing as a naturally quick driver ! no-one is born with the ability to be a fast racing driver.

It’s about experience, track time, training, fitness, stamina, concentration, drive, motivation, patience, focus….and to progress to higher formulas, only the very lucky and very few can climb the motorsport ladder on talent alone….the majority need funds.

Test drivers Zonta and Wurz regularly outpace the race seat holders in their teams, so why are they not racing? Lack of financial backing perhaps?

Michael Schumacher, undoubtedly the best driver of the modern era is also the hardest working driver (even after winning 7 world championships) and makes the most efficient use of what he has learnt over the years. You wouldn’t think he needs a driver coach, but he has one. Ferrari’s US$400m annual budget also helps……

Sorry Mr. or Ms. Moderator for the essay…..

[Stephen Green]

The essay is fine and you make many very valid points and in general I agree with your post. Lets all remember that A1GP is about driving for your country and not necessarily about driving to further your career.

[mbathshah]

First of all the reason why Wurz and Zonta outpace their team mates is most likely because of the fact that their engines are not rev limited as are Montoya's and Raikkonen's because of the two race rule for engines.

Secondly I agree that you need to do all of the things that you mention to become a top class driver. However let's take an example of Pizzonia - Very Very wealthy Brazilian Family - started karting at 9 or 10 went through all the usual formulas became F1 Driver for Jaguar and test driver with Williams. However, he has been hopeless when it comes to racing. The other side of the coin is Kimi - family no money - relied on backers who put their money where their mouth is to take him through the junior formulas - and he is now acknowledged as one of the best F1 drivers. I am sorry but cannot agree with you on this one - just like any sport the great drivers like Schumacher Senna etc have an"x" factor which sets them apart from their peers.

Using your analogy of football. If it is so easy to kick a ball around all day then why has there only been 1 Pele or 1 Maradonna? Surely a team like Brazil for example would have 11 players with equal ability (11 Pele's) if they were available. Again my friend it is the x faxtor which separates a Pele from the others. Same in Motorsport.

I guess we can just agree to disagree on this one

[Go-Pakistan]

I agree with you mbathsah about people with "x-factor", some people have it some people don't. But I also think that some of it is natural and some of it is acquired. A lot of "x-factor" can be gained with sheer determenitaion and putting in the hard work.

On your Pizzonia / Raikonnen example, once again I agree with you. Yes, money plays a part, but still the driver needs to maximise his performance.

A brief example, David Beckham, despite all the media hype, his lifestyle, his wife, and whatever peolpe say about his recent form. The free kicks that he takes, where he can kick a ball from 40 or 50 yards and make it dip at the last second to tuck into the top corner of the net are truly outstanding.

Where did he get this skill? Genes from his parents for his physical form, but also lots and lots of hard work....and while every one may have access to a football, whereas he might have been out in the park on a cold saturday morning practicing free kicks again and again until he got them right......his peers may have been tucked up in bed...that's the difference.

Maradonna at his peak was truly the worlds best, but i believe i read somewhere that at the age of 3 or 4 he used to kick screwed up bits of paper around as a football...this shows supreme spirit and absolute sheer determination to suceed.

Anyway, been good talking to you and i hope other members have enjoyed this discussion, I hope it's a great A1GP in Portugal for everyone, participants and spectators alike.

I have just read on another post that Armaan Ebrahim is driving for India as Karun Chandhok i think is unavailable. This guy is only 15 !! He has had success in F.BMW Asia and i wish him to do well this weekend, and all the other drivers, here's looking forward to good race weekend.

note. I don't have Sky but hopefully the link i've found in the A1GP Germany post will work and I can watch it on broadband....otherwise i might have to go down to F!tness F!rst and watch it on their TV..lol.

[Fiorentina 1]

I think it's great to have a team like Pakistan in A1GP. This is what this series is all about. If a Chinese guy can win a medal for Switzerland in the Olympics, then a Brit with a Pakistani parent can race for Pakistan. I have no problem with that what so ever. It's great when small countries compete in the Olympics and the World Cup. And, now racing has a world cup as well. We should be happy that they are involved and wish them luck.
And besides, I rather they do better then poorly anyways. So, if Adam never stepped foot in that country before the start of the year, who cares. His parents or parent is Pakistani and by international law, that makes him Pakistani as well! It's good moral for this little country that has gone through so much lately. I would rather they win a race then Scott Speed for that matter. Adam did a great job and hopefully something will come of this in the future. I for one am cheering them on for this weekend!

[Lutfy]

I am liking this forum already. You all sure walk the talk Looking forward to making new friends.

I just got done reading Carroll Smith's Drive to Win. Changed the way (slightly) I think about racing.

There is a saying in the racing world. In order to make a small fortune in racing, you need to start with a big one. That said, money is very important.

There are plenty of gentlemen racers out there who have all the money but they lack the "HARDCORE" competitive spirit. I have also met many folks who have the spirit but they lack the funds. As Smith said in his book (and so did Ross Bentley) you need to be prepared to let go of your family, lose your wife, get into debt, work two jobs or whatever it takes to make it up to the top. Mika Hakkinen was not born with a silver spoon in his mouth. He used to hangout during the races making network with the teams. His determination and passion was realized by Mercedes when they picked him up and the rest his history (he sure was lucky).

Supernova can back Pakistan. Its VERY important to have a solid team who can do what the driver thinks. But lets not forget to give the driver the credit here too (someone on this forum mentioned Team Pakistan won because of Supernova). You can have the best team in the world but if the driver cannot provide input as to what the car is doing, no team in the world can make it through the race. A driver is like a 'tire'; this is where the rubber meets the road. Have the best car in the world, without a proper set of tires, you aint going no where. In the end, its a team effort.

Re: Nur. I first met him Karachi this past summer when his car was at Pearl Continental. Quite a humble fellow. I wish him best and hope he finds a ride.

Any other Pakistani road racers out there?

Lutfy
98 M3 GTS2 NASA PRORACING/BMWCCA I STOCK

[mbathshah]

[QUOTE=Lutfy](someone on this forum mentioned Team Pakistan won because of Supernova).

Couldn't have been on this forum - we are all very sharp and Team Pakistan have definately not won a race in A1GP!

[Lutfy]

[QUOTE=mbathshah]

Originally Posted by Lutfy

(someone on this forum mentioned Team Pakistan won because of Supernova).

Couldn't have been on this forum - we are all very sharp and Team Pakistan have definately not won a race in A1GP!

I meant to say TeamPak finshed in top 10 because.....

[Nismo]

motorsports in britain is very much still regarded as a white mans sport, if your not white its a bit awkward... but thing are changing with the shaiks new series and that asians/ arabs can race and do well... still not as bad as football..

Im of asian/arabic origin myself, back in 98 I undertook a weeks training at the jim russle racing school. I was not helped by parents or anyone, I just worked and saved the cash..back then it would be very rare to see a non white person involved in the racing scene in the uk...(apart from japanses)

I feel I did reasonably well, got a very good assesment on the one to one tests etc, and got my national licence. during the many training sessions in the formula vauxhalls I lapped the donington track with in 1~1.5 seconds off the quickest guys all of who had karting background..

But after when it came to looking for sponsors, it was very hard work, I would put my heart and soul into making presentations to companies etc.. I didnt get no where! I did a few races and after that it ended ..no money!

A big shame, I put everything interms of my personal energy/money into trying to get sponsorship.. it wasnt meant to be

If i had some one bankrolling x amount of £££££££££'s im sure i would have been some where in motorsport today...

These kids like hamiltons, piquets, what do they have to worry about? they dont have the stress of finding sponsors, wondering if they will have money for the next race...

They can concentrate on their fitness, prepare them selves in the gym and generally be in a good fram of mind knowing everything is done for them...

Like the guy above has said, they are no big deal or special..from the next guy, but they have been given a good environment in which to better themselves.

[Fiorentina 1]

Nismo: Even white guys have the problem you had. Remember Richard Tarling? Formula Palmer Audi Champ one year, FFord or Vauxhall JR champ before? No money, no racing. At least when you are ethnic, you play that card. Go to ethnic groups and see if you can get some marketing manager of some company, with ethnic pride, try and generate some money for you. I once got a sponsor, a small one, because a guy had a Swiss flag in a store window. I went in there told him I was orginally from Switzerland and racing in the States.....bla, bla, bla he gave $1,500 for a small race.

[Go-Pakistan]

Well done Nismo for giving it a go!

At least you can say you tried it.

Lewis Hamilton who I believe is of mixed race i'm sure will be in a McLaren within 2-3 years, once he's there, there should be a lot of media interest in this and this should help people of different ethnic backgrounds to enter the sport.

Narain in F1; India, Pakistan, Lebanon in A1, talk of Dubai team joining up aswell.........Although the Arabs are not short of cash!

Still the money aspect will be a hurdle though!

[maximus]

IMO your ethnic origin doesn't really matter in this sport if you're good enough and have the clout behind you.

[nkfan]

Agree with Maximus....Ethinicity is not the main problem. Money is the problem. Its all up to how big of a market does motorsport have in your country.

When narain was asking around teams for a race seat in europe, he was told to go and play cricket. ...Its not because of his ethinicity but it is because of the awareness of motosport in india at that time. Big corporates in india werent ready to sponsor him as motorsports was not significant enough. But TATA realised the growing enthusiasm in india and have started sponsering Narain.

So if motor sports is even half as popular as cricket in pakistan, then i am sure we will see a pakistani driver in top racing.

[farooqaziz]

I Am From Pakistan. I Think Pak Team Has Done Well. Last Race Wasnt Very Good Due To Bad Pit Timming.

As Far As Cricket Is Concernse We R Better Than Ind, Gbr, ..etc In Icc Odi Rankings


Good Work Pakis, We R Continue To Promote Our Country

[farooqaziz]

Do U People Hav Some Fanticy Team , If So Plz Help Me, I Will Be Much Thank Ful

[Asp]

farooqaziz - Welcome to ten-tenths!
If by fantasy team you mean some form of competition, we have a prediction competition where you say who you think will win each race - see the thread at the top of the forum. A1GP isn't a competition where we can run a full fantasy team competition, as it will defeat the object of a Nationalist Series!!

[farooqaziz]

thank u asp, i will be looking for it


and abt pakistan i think they will do well.u people must visit the new topic the indo_pak..........

give your views

[farooqaziz]

adam has done agr8 job. forget abt the controvercy as long as he is doing well,

I want to ask where the hell is NUR ALI?

[Go-Pakistan]

Originally Posted by farooqaziz

adam has done agr8 job

Well said yaar!

He is always attacknig for position which is good, it is a race after all, not a formation.

Nur ali no longer in team i think.

[Stephen Green]

Originally Posted by farooqaziz

adam has done agr8 job. forget abt the controvercy as long as he is doing well,

I want to ask where the hell is NUR ALI?

Just a little point here. We at ten-tenths don't encourage 'text speak' so can I ask that in future you write in full?

Many thanks in advance,

Stephen.

[mbathshah]

[QUOTE=farooqaziz]adam has done agr8 job. /QUOTE]

Looking at the last couple of races it seems that the usual order is now asserting itself. I think Supernova were quick out of the box at Brands Hatch and some teams who should have been much further up the grid were struggling. It seems that the qualifying at Estoril has restored the usual order and teams like India and Pakistan qualified about where I expected them to.