Oversized on board cameras!?

[nickyf1]

i noticed on my autosport front cover 2 weeks ago that there was a williams with a REALY big onboard camera, after getting my AS today i seen another williams with the same BIG camera!

[Marbot]

Could be the cameras they use for promotional stuff.

[JeremySmith]

It could be to do with a program which is shown by the "Speed Channel" before each Grand Prix. Inside Grand Prix I think is the name!

[Knowlesy]

Yes, we're unfortunate to get that on Motors TV.

Although to be honest, there isn't that much on-board stuff anyways....it's all computer generated tosh.

[windsok]

I assume you mean the picture here - http://www.autosport.com/magazine.html

It was taken at the Monza test session in August, after the Turkish Grand Prix.

If you recall, Williams had some major problems with tyre failures at the Turkish Grand Prix, and they were unsure exactly what caused them.

Speculation about the big camera was that it was a ultra high speed camera filiming the interaction of the tyres, to see if they could figure out what caused the failures, as the suspision was that they were rubbing against bodywork.

If you are an autosport subscriber you can see a 1200x800 version here - http://gallery.autosport.com/picture...TN37L044G9Z5-4

Webber was also on track on that day, and he had a normal sized camera, or fake camera as they probobly use in testing.

[ss_collins]

Speculation about the big camera was that it was a ultra high speed camera filiming the interaction of the tyres, to see if they could figure out what caused the failures, as the suspision was that they were rubbing against bodywork.


Tripe! its a funny kind of camera that has no lens! thats a solid bit of Carbon. Racecar Engineering suggests that it is the high accuracy QinetiQ GPS system, developed for fighter aircraft and missiles.

[Adam43]

I must admit if I was going to film the tyres I wouldn't put the camera there (although it depends whatexactly you are looking for and there it is an easy place to put it). I haven't seen a picture of the 'back' of it so couldn't tell if there was a lense or not.

The GPS idea is intriguing. What would it before? Is their data is significantly improved by this? Or is it a test for a technical partner (and why doesn't QinetiQ put it on a Zytek )

[windsok]

The camera thing was just guesses, so the gps thing is probobly more likely to be true.

The "camera" seemed to come to a point at the back, you can kinda see it here - http://xpb.cc/f1/viewpicture.asp?id=82878

and http://www.f1racing.net/en/photolarg...498&catID=1658

[ss_collins]

yes a typical aerodynamic shape.

(and why doesn't QinetiQ put it on a Zytek)
Actually I've seen a QinetiQ presentation that suggests it has, but because there is more space to put stuff inside a prototype its not visible

[Adam43]

After I posted that I was thinking about it and the space thing crossed my mind!

I would interested to know what the gain from it. Clearly the improvement in accuracy, but does that accuracy aid the analysis. Or do you just need more memory to store the data

[dazbaz_99]

I think i recall seeing that on the Williams at the September F1 test at Silverstone.

[jb59892]

May be it's used to collect more acurate data on body roll, yaw, pitch etc along with more accurate G force data; it seems a bit big to be simply a camera or GPS unit. May be it does all sorts of things?

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by dazbaz_99

I think i recall seeing that on the Williams at the September F1 test at Silverstone.

I think it only appeared at the Monza test in August. The only pictures I've seen are Rosberg using it on the second day. On the same day Webber didn't use it.

Here is a good side-on pic for Autosport subscribers: http://gallery.autosport.com/picture...e/l_F0AA3542-4

[j_hampton2000]

>I think it only appeared at the Monza test in August.

We also saw it used at Silverstone in Sept:
http://www.f1racing.net/en/photolarg...662&catID=1671

We were listening into the radio communications of several teams that week, and I distinctly remember one of the engineers describing it as an "accelerometer". What I can't remember is which team the engineer was from who was calling it this. It might have been Renault or Toyota.

Jim.

[Silk Cut Jaguar]

If it is a GPS device I suppose it's easier (and cheaper) to bolt it to an F1 or sportscar for testing under extreme stress than it is to put a plane up in the air for the afternoon as it is easier to swap things about every lap than it is to land every 20 minutes for tweaking.

[SpawnyWhippet]

It looks way too big to be a GPS or accelerometer, both of these things can be made to fit easily in a cigarette packet, including batteries. My mobile phone has GPS built in, and Nokia is also building anti-theft accelerometers into prototype phones to perform gait analysis to automatically password your phone if it doesn't recognise the persons walking style. I have no ideas what that huge radar dome thing is if its not a high speed camera.

[ss_collins]

Nah the really high accuracy stuff is sometimes a lot bigger than the low end stuff in a mobile phone (which is accurate to the street you are on but not to the tens of MM or better. However its is a guess.

[Ingsy]

Originally Posted by Andydickens

Nokia is also building anti-theft accelerometers into prototype phones to perform gait analysis to automatically password your phone if it doesn't recognise the persons walking style.

A link to any info on this?

It just seems a bit silly to me. What happens if you start to run for a bus? Will your phone think it is being stolen?

[ASCII Man]

Originally Posted by ss_collins

Nah the really high accuracy stuff is sometimes a lot bigger than the low end stuff in a mobile phone (which is accurate to the street you are on but not to the tens of MM or better. However its is a guess.

It is about the right size for a high range gps system IMO.

But they weigh about 5 Kg's so I don't see any use of using such a heavy device so high on the car for testing purposes, what with the huge difference in testing data that you would get when using it as opposed to without it....

I'd rather think it's a high definition camera for PR purposes.

[ss_collins]

ASCII its not a camera IT HAS NO LENS! just to clear that one up. I have images that have not been published of it (but can't post due to copyright), It is solid carbon, no cut outs or anything - so please lets not call it a camera anymore - unless its a special one that can see through carbon fibre!

Why high range GPS? perhaps to assess various drivers in minute detail.

why mount it so high on the car - if it is that size where else can you put it.

5kg up high - tough one that but if you are assesing a driver and not the car it does not matter.

[ASCII Man]

Originally Posted by ss_collins

ASCII its not a camera IT HAS NO LENS!

Sorry, didn't read your previous posts.
But why using an advanced GPS system to evaluate drivers, which solely transmits the cars exact position on the track, maybe other than tracking the racing lines that the driver took?

[SpawnyWhippet]

Originally Posted by Ingsy

A link to any info on this?

It just seems a bit silly to me. What happens if you start to run for a bus? Will your phone think it is being stolen?

No, its a well established biometric. There are alogorithms built in to recognise obvious aberrant behaviour such as running for the bus. Besides, all it will do then is prompt for the password before the phone can be used. There is not much info in the public domain just yet, but check these links for some general blurb.

http://phone.ioerror.us/2005/10/futu...s-for-security
http://addict3d.org/index.php?page=v...=news&ID=11443

[ss_collins]

agreed ascii hard to understand why - however I have heard of a GPS system that can give exact lines - accel and decel of a car on a track once its calibrated. This system can 'spy' on rival cars and give you at least some idea of their performance (partial telemetry for any car on the track at any time)

but this is all guesswork - really GPS is a guess