7.5 Ton Race Transporter Questions.

[RetroWheelsRacing]

Hello all,

I've just bought a 7.5 ton race truck.
It's taxed as Private Heavy Goods, has a Tachograph fitted (which works, but does'nt need to be used -so im told).
I have a C1 driving licence (passed my test in the 1980's).
The truck will only be used to transport my race car or track day car to uk circuits.

Questions..
1) Do i need an operarotors licence ?
2) Do i need to have "Not for Hire or Reward" on the vehicle ?

Can any 7.5 ton race truck owners out there give some advice ?

I've tried the search facility,an looked at a couple of old threads but still unsure of the answer.

[Scooby 96]

We run a 814 Merc Racetruck and have been 'advised' the following.
Operators licence not required.
Tacho has to be fitted (and calibrated every 2 years for test) but not needed to be used for 'private' use.
We have 'not for hire or reward' on passengers door but dont now if this is required by law.
Hope this helps on a very grey area!
Nigel.

Mod note: Please use the relevant affiliated sites to advertise, not here. Thanks.

[Chris Y]

I was reading this thinking you were racing the truck...

Better to call it a "race transporter"

[Tim Falce]

I thought that as well so I've changed it.

[Bob Pearson]

Originally Posted by Scooby 96

We run a 814 Merc Racetruck and have been 'advised' the following.
Operators licence not required.
Tacho has to be fitted (and calibrated every 2 years for test) but not needed to be used for 'private' use.
We have 'not for hire or reward' on passengers door but dont now if this is required by law.
Hope this helps on a very grey area!
Nigel.

Mod note: Please use the relevant affiliated sites to advertise, not here. Thanks.

We use a 7.5 ton MAN to carry two Fr2000's, and my grasp of the laws agrees exactly with Scooby.

[Al Weyman]

Originally Posted by Chris Y

I was reading this thinking you were racing the truck...

Better to call it a "race transporter"

Me too but worse still I got the end of the piece and thought he was using a Race truck as his road transport, duh!

[Greystone]

Originally Posted by Scooby 96

Tacho has to be fitted (and calibrated every 2 years for test) but not needed to be used for 'private' use.

Don't have a race transporter but have a 7.5 tonne Leyland DAF horse box so much of the same applies. My understanding is that if it is a private HGV and a tachograph is your only speed indication device then it must have a calibration seal on it but it does not need to be recalibrated every two years. I have owned the DAF since 2003 and it has been tested every year with the same calibration seal on the Tacho with no problems. When you get it tested you need to complete and present a tachograph exemption certificate.

Re the "Not for hire or reward" I have searched everywhere that I could think of online and never found anything that states that that this is a legal requirement. It is not on my box, or on most of the boxes that you see at horse shows.

A tip. The last time that I took it to be tested I had a copy of Motorsport in the cab to read whilst I was waiting and the tester was more interested in reading that than testing and finding fault with the truck.

Andrew

[RetroWheelsRacing]

Thanks for the replies.

[Colin McKay]

Be very careful if there is any commercial aspect to your operation - you will need an Operator's Licence (a Restricted one at the very least) and to use the tacho. As an example, a VOSA guy recently told me of a local rallycrosser who worked as a mechanic. His employer lent him a tow van at the weekends and had his company name on the car. He was prosecuted for no tacho & 'O' licence. A real concern nowadays is that a vehicle is often forfeit if there is no 'O' licence in place. For genuinely private use there should be no problem, but VOSA are currently doing more enforcement out of normal hours so better to be safe.

If you go to http://www.transportoffice.gov.uk/cr...nlocations.htm

you can find your nearest HGV test station - the managers are normally very helpful & can give you chapter & verse on this topic.

[Robert Morris]

Well i have been thinking about getting a lorry but you guys are making me rethink.

[MGDavid]

A motorcamper / ex-motocross van plus trailer might make more sense

[Bob Pearson]

A lorry is Ok, but don't put stickers with your team name on it, if you do you attract attention by looking like a commercially operated team.
If I remember rightly, there is some stipulation that what you carry in it must belong to you to avoid the need for an operators licence. That is a bit misty in the back of my mind, so it may not be gospel.

[Colin McKay]

Originally Posted by MGDavid

A motorcamper / ex-motocross van plus trailer might make more sense

You won't necessarily get away with that either! If the total weight exceeds 3.5 tonnes (and most Transit/car/trailer combos will) you still need an 'O' Licence & tacho.

Another consideration is the London LEZ - if you can get by without ever venturing within the M25 then fine, but any diesel older than euro-3 will be a problem. Paradoxically, my gas-guzzling 7.5 litre Chevy-engined motorhome is allowed in because it's petrol!

[MGDavid]

Originally Posted by Colin McKay

You won't necessarily get away with that either! If the total weight exceeds 3.5 tonnes (and most Transit/car/trailer combos will) you still need an 'O' Licence & tacho.
......

reference source please !
as that is not my understanding but I'm open to correction...

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by Colin McKay

You won't necessarily get away with that either! If the total weight exceeds 3.5 tonnes (and most Transit/car/trailer combos will) you still need an 'O' Licence & tacho.

Not always, if you are carrying your own goods and it's not for hire or reward you are exempt.
Or maybe not, after looking at the VOSA website, which is as clear as the mudiest mud bath in all Mudsville, it says if in doubt phone your local traffic office and ask.
As the fines for non compliance are higher than if you commit a robbery or fraud, I would spend 10p on a phone call.

[JohnD]

See: http://www.roadtransport.com/RoadLeg...o-licence.html

Second para: "Privately-run goods vehicles, such as those kept and run by vintage vehicle enthusiasts, do not require an O-licence."

John

[Colin McKay]

Originally Posted by falcemob

Not always, if you are carrying your own goods and it's not for hire or reward you are exempt.

That much is true, but it can be a very grey area with motorsport - does that sponsor's sticker equate to a commercial involvement? Or perhaps you put some of the costs through your business? Who is the tow vehicle and/or race car registered to? Definitely worth making that phone call.

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by JohnD

See: http://www.roadtransport.com/RoadLeg...o-licence.html

Second para: "Privately-run goods vehicles, such as those kept and run by vintage vehicle enthusiasts, do not require an O-licence."

John

I think you'll find the "Vintage vehicle enthusiasts" part means trucks over 25 years old not people who use trucks to transport vintage vehicles.

[MGDavid]

Originally Posted by Colin McKay

That much is true, but it can be a very grey area with motorsport - does that sponsor's sticker equate to a commercial involvement? Or perhaps you put some of the costs through your business? Who is the tow vehicle and/or race car registered to? Definitely worth making that phone call.

Thanks for clarification, no phone call needed; I don't have sponsorship (how many clubbies do?) or stickers and I don't have a business. My tow vehicle is a motorcaravan registered to me. My racecar is not roadworthy and not registered. And I'm old enough to have the right classes on my licence, is it C1+E from memory?

[RetroWheelsRacing]

On reflection, i dont think i'll be stickering the truck up with our race team name - as they seem to imply "reward".
Although , my racing only seems to Cost , and financial reward never comes into it

Turning the question around.... What are the implications of not having a Restricted O licence , when it is deemed-by VOSA or whoever - that you should have ?

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by whitechimp500

Turning the question around.... What are the implications of not having a Restricted O licence , when it is deemed-by VOSA or whoever - that you should have ?

Stupid fines or imprisonment, for some reason O licence and tachograph offences seem to be up there with murder in the judiciary scheme of things. Tacho offences can carry a maximum of £6K per offence and judges seem to fine at the higher end of the scale.

[The Shrew]

In theroy you should be fine with driving a 7.5t without a O licence just to transport your vehicle to and from circuits.

BUT

As someone said VOSA are clamping down big time at the moment on this kind of thing. Things like stickers on the car or truck could change the way people see things. That would only be jobs worth types if you no what i mean.

I would send a letter / email off to your local traffic office explaining what you want to do with the vehicle etc. Hopefully they will reply back to you at least then you have it in black and white if you do get pulled.

[Cynic]

I know there's been a lot of discussion about this amongst the drivers in the series I work with, and the ovverriding view appears to be that you do need to have the tacho fitted and working, but you don't have to use it. The O-license is a new one though - I don't think anyone has one that I know of.

[fasted]

Put a caravan on the back and the authorities will avoid you like the plague!

[The Shrew]

Originally Posted by Cynic

I know there's been a lot of discussion about this amongst the drivers in the series I work with, and the ovverriding view appears to be that you do need to have the tacho fitted and working, but you don't have to use it. The O-license is a new one though - I don't think anyone has one that I know of.

You shouldnt need a O licence.

You only need one of these if the vehicle is used for a commercial purpose. So if your are taking a vehicle to a track that should be fine. The laws about this kind of thing are a bit complicated to be honest. Like someone said before even a car on a trailer could require a O licence. People have been done for it in the past.

Its all how the idividual interpretats the law. My advice would be to check up if your not certain better to be safe than get a big fine.

As for the Tacho's all vehicles over 3.5T and a certain age will have them fitted. I dont think you have to use them but again you should check on this. If you do have to use them they have to be checked every 2 years and a bigger check is taken place every 6. If you want to no when yours was last calibrated open the tacho head there will be a little sticker inside which will tell you the date's etc.