2014 SCCA World Challenge

[MitchZ06]

They likely did, after the medical staff ensured they were in no way severely injured. Caution periods can take as long as they need to imo, but in a time limited race there should be a clause to add time to the race in the event of a long caution period.

[DeezPutz]

Originally Posted by Hendrix

According to the commentators both walked away under their own power so I can't imagine it took that long. I'm also fine with taking time if needed, but I would like to see caution periods shortened as much as possible.

It did take that long. So you don't need to imagine anything.

[Coach Ep]

Originally Posted by MitchZ06

Caution periods can take as long as they need to imo, but in a time limited race there should be a clause to add time to the race in the event of a long caution period.

As done in WTCC. I like the idea and PWC doesn't have live tv coverage to work with that has to keep everything within a minute-to-minute detailed timeframe. Could a minimum green time running be the starting point of determining the standard duration of a race?

[joeb]

Originally Posted by Coach Ep

As done in WTCC. I like the idea and PWC doesn't have live tv coverage to work with that has to keep everything within a minute-to-minute detailed timeframe. Could a minimum green time running be the starting point of determining the standard duration of a race?

Perhaps if they were the headliner on a weekend, but they are currently on the support bill for other series. So there isn't too much room to adjust the weekend schedule just to let PWC run a few more minutes.

[BullMan]

Originally Posted by MitchZ06

They likely did, after the medical staff ensured they were in no way severely injured. Caution periods can take as long as they need to imo, but in a time limited race there should be a clause to add time to the race in the event of a long caution period.

Time can't be added. They're a support race and the timetable has to be adhered to. If they add 10 minutes, that means everything else gets shifted 10 minutes and problems arise.

[Coach Ep]

Of course it can be done, see (again) the WTCC example - irrelevant if it's time or laps added.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Coach Ep

Of course it can be done, see (again) the WTCC example - irrelevant if it's time or laps added.

WTCC is the headlining, main series. They can do that.

Not a third tier support series.

[Coach Ep]

All that will be needed is 10 minutes extra scheduled time - not necessarily extra running time.

No big deal. And actually easier to realize with a support series as there's no live tv coverage - which is a huge advantage as the risk of missing the finish live on tellie is zero. In other words: there's no impact on the broadcast schedule. And as we all know: that's the defining factor nowadays.

[Speed-King]

Well, their last two races are stand-alones at Miller and Brainerd (talk about anticlimax...), so they could surely test those changes there.

[Maelochs]

Bit if PWC takes an extra ten minutes, the whole rest of the day's schedule is off. Somewhere that ten minutes has to come back out of the schedule.

Also, while drivers and teams are not on track, they are doing repairs, cleaning, fine-tuning, autograph sessions, driver meetings, sponsor meet-and-greets .... it's not like the on-track action of one series is all that would be disrupted. Every driver and team from every series scheduled to do anything on track after that delay would have to reschedule everything.

Even the PWC drivers have places to be after the race, schedules to follow ...

Further, it might be ten minutes or it might be more---no way to know. The track and event staff would have to decide to run over not knowing if it might be a minute or half an hour, or longer. Much safer simply niot to run over at all.

[TRspitfirefan]

Originally Posted by Maelochs

Bit if PWC takes an extra ten minutes, the whole rest of the day's schedule is off. Somewhere that ten minutes has to come back out of the schedule.

At Road America last weekend the Nascar boys changed their schedule to try and avoid practicing in the rain.
The PWC race start times were delayed due this.
If planned schedules can be changed for Nationwide, why not for PWC?

[TRspitfirefan]

Originally Posted by Matt

WTCC is the headlining, main series. They can do that.

Not a third tier support series.

Third tier?
PWC is in the process of some incredibly rapid growth right now.
If the series continues to follow their formula of awesome cars+fun racing, I don't see why they couldn't be a headliner series in the near future.

I drove eight hours to attend the Road America races last weekend.
I didn't go for the Nascar race, nor for Trans Am. I went to see the World Challenge cars and they were Dynamite!

[PointDSM]

Again, because Nationwide was the headline series running. They have leverage over ESPN and the other series to do whatever they want (as long as there weren't events after Nationwide that were severely effected).

Just because your boss has a company car, doesn't mean you have a right to one as well (even though you work for the same company in the same building doing close to similar jobs).

Not really all that complex.

[DeezPutz]

Originally Posted by TRspitfirefan

Third tier?

Yes.

Originally Posted by TRspitfirefan

PWC is in the process of some incredibly rapid growth right now.
If the series continues to follow their formula of awesome cars+fun racing, I don't see why they couldn't be a headliner series in the near future.

Let's say PWC is the headliner. What other series let's them be the big show? Maybe adding PWC to some SCCA Majors weekends might work.

Originally Posted by TRspitfirefan

I drove eight hours to attend the Road America races last weekend.
I didn't go for the Nascar race, nor for Trans Am. I went to see the World Challenge cars and they were Dynamite!

Has to be trolling.

[Maelochs]

To amplify: "Third tier? PWC is in the process of some incredibly rapid growth right now. If the series continues to follow their formula of awesome cars+fun racing, I don't see why they couldn't be a headliner series in the near future." (Emphasis added.)

Right now PWC is a third-tier series. Yes, it seems to be doing really well this season (after the competing road-race series started the year with two major embarrassments at two iconic races.) Whether it will continue to grow (I did read they are considering an enduro or two) and eventually become the American Blancpain, who knows?

Maybe next season N-Wide will run support for PWC. (I think most of us here would prefer that.) This year, however ....

Here's a hint about establishing ratings: If a series gets live air time on a major channel for each of its practice sessions, it is pretty major. if a series gets zero live broadcast anywhere and in fact gets two two-hour races squeezed into a 90-minute taped show aired three weeks later ....

[Ginaro Zukovsky]

Originally Posted by Speed-King

Well, their last two races are stand-alones at Miller and Brainerd (talk about anticlimax...), so they could surely test those changes there.

The top class GT cars are not going to Brainerd...

[TRspitfirefan]

Originally Posted by PointDSM

Again, because Nationwide was the headline series running. They have leverage over ESPN and the other series to do whatever they want (as long as there weren't events after Nationwide that were severely effected).

Just because your boss has a company car, doesn't mean you have a right to one as well (even though you work for the same company in the same building doing close to similar jobs).

Not really all that complex.

It would not really be that hard to leave a little wiggle room in the schedule following the PWC GT/GTS races. This would give the series the option to red flag the race and stop the clock in the event of a major accident.
As little as twenty to thirty extra minutes would suffice.

[Maelochs]

Actually, it might be ... if they are going to allow an extra however many minutes for PWC, what about for other series? I am sure other series will want the same freedom, which makes negotiations a lot more tricky.

Also, as I mentioned, no one know how long a red or yellow flag might last. What looks like a simple issue might take a lot longer to fix (Oops, we didn't see the broken barrier ... ) Which means everyone sits around waiting, then waiting more, then nothing. The schedule was screwed, the 12 noon autograph session was cancelled because it would have interfered with other on-track action, fans are angry, merch sales are down ... could have stopped the race on schedule, stayed on schedule, and if there was a long break for repairs, fans and drivers wouldn't have spent it waiting for a restart, only to finally be told "Sorry."

The biggest issue is dead air. Tracks could leave huge gaps in their schedules to allow for long cautions ... but they don't want to. Tracks want fans trapped at the facility, with just enough time to buy vendor food and merchandise and get their hero cards signed before the next event starts. Tracks do not want people thinking "Hmm ... I can make it to Arby's and get back before the next race."

Sure, the schedule could contain some wiggle room ... but some dollars could wiggle free, and tracks (and vendors) need every dollar.

[TRspitfirefan]

Originally Posted by Maelochs

Actually, it might be ... if they are going to allow an extra however many minutes for PWC, what about for other series? I am sure other series will want the same freedom, which makes negotiations a lot more tricky.

Also, as I mentioned, no one know how long a red or yellow flag might last. What looks like a simple issue might take a lot longer to fix (Oops, we didn't see the broken barrier ... ) Which means everyone sits around waiting, then waiting more, then nothing. The schedule was screwed, the 12 noon autograph session was cancelled because it would have interfered with other on-track action, fans are angry, merch sales are down ... could have stopped the race on schedule, stayed on schedule, and if there was a long break for repairs, fans and drivers wouldn't have spent it waiting for a restart, only to finally be told "Sorry."

The biggest issue is dead air. Tracks could leave huge gaps in their schedules to allow for long cautions ... but they don't want to. Tracks want fans trapped at the facility, with just enough time to buy vendor food and merchandise and get their hero cards signed before the next event starts. Tracks do not want people thinking "Hmm ... I can make it to Arby's and get back before the next race."

Sure, the schedule could contain some wiggle room ... but some dollars could wiggle free, and tracks (and vendors) need every dollar.

The thing is, that it is not a question of whether race weekend schedules should have some leeway built into them, because they already do.
Schedules have to be somewhat loose because motor racing is inherently unpredictable. In my experience, it is not at all uncommon for practice session and support series start times to be delayed.

As far as all the other support series wanting the same time allowance, if any other series can produce a grid that contains Mclarens, Ferraris, Bentley, Audi R8 LMS, Lamborghinis, Mercedes Gullwing, Dodge Viper, Cadillac CTS plus some really cool GTS cars such as Aston Vantage, Ford Mustang, Nissan 370Z, ZL1 Camaros, Porsche Cayman, etc.
If any other support series can boast such a great field, then they should be allowed a few extra minutes of race time also if needed.

[Maelochs]

Hopefully PWC draws enough this year that the next time its officials sit down with track owners, they can work out issues like this---in PWC's favor.

[TRspitfirefan]

Originally Posted by Maelochs

Hopefully PWC draws enough this year that the next time its officials sit down with track owners, they can work out issues like this---in PWC's favor.

It is great how much optimism is surrounding the World challenge series right now. I think that there is a lot of potential for the series right now.

[WolfsburgRS]

Yeah, and I think that they seem to be really, really paying attention to all the gripes with TUSC, yellow flag procedures in particular. I wouldn't be surprised at all if 'they' or at least someone at PWC/SCCA is reading this thread...

In World Challenge they've never been ones to throw extraneous yellows but this year it seems they have been absolutely committed to throwing them at the last minute and then only if necessary.

It's not uncommon for a stranded car to be allowed several laps to try and make it back to the pits, rather than "oh jeez a car is in the gravel trap, lets run a FCY". Heck all the accidents at the start of round 7 and a jumped strat by O'Connell didn't even get a yellow.

I applaud that.

[Rodger Davies]

In TUSC's defence (not cool, I know), they've done equally as good a job at that since Sebring.

[Hendrix]

Not sure if it's been posted, but here is the Toronto Entry List. Glad to see another SRT Viper on the grid even though it's another GT-A car.

Also, at this pace I think they may have to have GT cars in their own races next year as there are 24(along with 20 GTS cars) entered for Toronto and the number may grow as Dyson has another Bentley coming and the Acura's may show up some day.

[TF110]

Are those gt3 vipers or what? Only Knox's car says Viper GT3R.