ALMS 2012 Discussion

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Isnt a world championship what we all want ?

The defacto World Championship has been in effect now for some time, and a World Championship in name doesn't change that. The main prize is, and will continue to be Le Mans. Winning Le Mans has much greater Marketing value and cache than winning a World Championship series, an ALMS championship, or any other title in the mix.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by The Badger

For example ..... take WR , a small team , with a small budget and a fighting spirit like a Lion . Do you , after their performance over the last 5 years , think they deserve an entry .

I think their a great little team and love to see them there , if their act is up to it . If your act isnt up to it , dont expect much .

Greaves have earned both their entries , in accordance with rules laid down before last season , I have no issue with that .

The car (WR) hasnt finished a race , so im my opinion it doesnt deserve to get in .

WR finished the race in 2010. Do I think they deserve an entry? I don't know. The Norma has exceeded expectations, hasn't it? Besides, most of the LMP2 teams are running similar equipment. Most aren't running WRs, they are running the same HPDs, Lolas, and Orecas. The ACO is moving towards BoPing those anyway if one shows strength.

The bottom line is that a team like Boutsen, TDS, etc. (I don't know what the situation is with those teams, I'm just throwing them out there as examples) that has performed and has shown a commitment to ACO racing and has shown some signs of professionalism may not have a prayer of getting a Le Mans entry if they aren't in the WEC. If they can't get into Le Mans, why even bother with the ELMS? So you've instantly written off a potentially decent/class winning team. Dumb, dumb dumb.

To be honest , I dont mind the fact that the ELMS may drop a little in quality , if what we are getting at the end of the day is an International Sportscar Championship . Let the ELMS , ALMS and whatever other LMS series pops up be a feeder series for the big game .

In the days of Group C , there was very little interest in a world championship coming outta the States . They stayed at home with their series , and some came out to play for Le Mans , no more .

So whats new ..... American teams still show little interest in a world championship , and are still staying at home bar Le Mans ..... partial interest in last years ILMC . So whats changed in 25 years , nothing ?

Isnt a world championship what we all want ?

You're not thinking long-term. Ok, you're not alone in that. The ACO isn't either. Right now teams have no choice but to enter the WEC if they want a Le Mans invite. That will raise the cost of competing in this type of sports car racing. Maybe an increased media profile will offset that, but there's no evidence that the WEC will get more media attention than a LMS or ALMS race with the diesel giants competing. The ACO is incompetent at promotion. Plus, a lot of outside sponsors don't want to sponsor international series. CART and many other series have run into that problem. Running in places where it isn't popular to run like Bahrain isn't going to help either. A European company or a European division might be fine with supporting an ELMS effort, but why sponsor a WEC effort if they don't even do business in those markets? So on and so forth. Eventually, the teams cannot justify the cost of "buying" a Le Mans entry through the WEC and they just drop out completely because the LMSes don't provide entries and they may not even exist with all the neglect. Either that or teams that want to be professional have no choice but to become rent-a-ride teams in order to raise the cash. That's where the ACO is making a mistake with their WEC over all strategy. On top of that, cheesing off existing fans isn't helping. The WEC is starting off with less of a fan base than the ILMC had even. Don't think that the North American fan base is small. It isn't. It's not just North Americans too. There are others who see the writing on the wall.

At the end of the day, it's not about wanting or not wanting a world championship. It's about how the world championship is run. If run competently, it can enhance the regional series and use the power of the regional series to enhance the international series. That's not what is happening. Not at all. That's a major shame.

As for the North American market, we do need our own rulebook and we do need the freedom to create a useful calendar of races. Of course, it's not up to you, me, or anyone here AFAIK. All we can do is voice our opinion that the status quo isn't satisfactory. Maybe the ALMS did not know about the WEC threat in October or whenever their extension was signed, but they probably know a lot more about it now. We'll see how they react. I'm not going to wait around forever hoping that they will make a move and I don't think they have forever to make a move so they better have something concrete soon.

[Fogelhund]

Originally Posted by AGD

EDIT: I'm not sure how much of an impact this will have on the ALMS. I suspect CORE will be back in LMPC regardless. With two cars? I don't know. As for Genoa, I guess it depends on what Eric Lux wants to do if he is bringing money. I'm sure there are other pay drivers who may want in ALMS LMPC.

Still, 25/8. The issue remains the same. Perhaps the Greaves trio would have been an ALMS trio if they thought they could get a Le Mans entry through ALMS participation.

The press release specifically mentions wanting to do Le Mans, and this is the way to do it. At the end of the day, funding for two cars has gone away for the ALMS. If there was further demand to run cars, it probably would have meant additional cars on the grid, instead of Genoa and CORE trying to find replacements. My opinion is simply that these organizations shouldn't be competitors, and we shouldn't be losing entries to the WEC, due to it being the only real way for competitors to ensure themselves of a spot at LM.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

The press release specifically mentions wanting to do Le Mans, and this is the way to do it. At the end of the day, funding for two cars has gone away for the ALMS. If there was further demand to run cars, it probably would have meant additional cars on the grid, instead of Genoa and CORE trying to find replacements. My opinion is simply that these organizations shouldn't be competitors, and we shouldn't be losing entries to the WEC, due to it being the only real way for competitors to ensure themselves of a spot at LM.

Right, well, it's hard to say what the impact is on the ALMS. It seems that Ricardo and Christian were leaving anyway to go to P2 so their LMPC efforts would have been abandoned anyway, but they may have been abandoned in favor of an ALMS P2 car if they could get an entry that way. Or something like that. Regardless, it's an announcement that is mild buzzkill for both ALMS and WEC fans. I'm sure WEC fans expected or hoped the Greaves car to be a more professional effort. That's just the way things are going to go though. Teams that normally would be professional are going to have to accept rent-a-riders just to get that coveted LM entry through the lower-value WEC. It's essentially what I said in the post I made just before yours.

[Fogelhund]

Suggested new ALMS slogan.

Global Leader, Feeder to the Green Racing Series.

[Jonerz]

All-in-all I'm not sure how "strengthened" sports car racing is world wide, certainly at its top level, which has shifted from Le Mans and the ALMS to Le Mans and the WEC it looks like the grids will be bigger than ever and with more factory cars at the front than ever (in a couple years anyways) which is nice for me as a Le Mans fan. But as a sports car racing fan I am concerned none of that strength will benefit the ALMS.

We're left hoping and praying. We may see LMP2 grow stronger (nice for anoraks, and more overwhelming to the senses of the casual fan, but no big draw for them) and maybe, maybe, MAYBE getting someone like Porsche to run their car in North America. I read an article this morning (linky below) where the Bentley CEO mentions that Bentley, Audi and Porsche could run in different regions and come together "five or six times a year" in the WEC and at Le Mans. Not sure how realistic his views are, but that means the brass would consider an ALMS program. However we saw last year the Audi AG were pushing for an ALMS program and North America decided ads on golf games and SPEED's broadcast of the 24 Hours of Le Mans were sufficient.

http://www.autoblog.com/2011/09/30/b...lmp1-race-car/

Chris

edit:

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

Suggested new ALMS slogan.

Global Leader, Feeder to the Green Racing Series.

How about "Global Leader, Corporate Events at a Decreasing Number of Attractive American Racing Circuits Where The CEO You Are Meeting Shows Off His Neat Little Racing Toy To Inspire Awe and Confidence In Him Amongst Potential Clients Such As Yourself" It's a bit wordier than they have now, but there might be more room on the fire suit patch if Patron don't re-sign.

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

Would you not agree that the WEC is a direct competitor to ELMS and ALMS? You think that is fine, I think it is stupid.

Yes , I agree .

Im all for a world championship ..... and quite happy to see ALMS/ELMS/AsLMS being a quality national feeder series for the world championship .

Much like Brit GT ..... and any other national GT series . In not particularly interested in those series , but happy cuz a lot of talant comes out of those .

[The Badger]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

The defacto World Championship has been in effect now for some time, and a World Championship in name doesn't change that. The main prize is, and will continue to be Le Mans. Winning Le Mans has much greater Marketing value and cache than winning a World Championship series, an ALMS championship, or any other title in the mix.

It couldnt be a proper world championship before , because it wasnt sanstioned by the Fia . So , perhaps its a duel issue and not just the fault of the ACO ?

Winning Le Mans is , and always be the big peice of pie , yes .

[AGD]

Originally Posted by Fogelhund

Suggested new ALMS slogan.

Global Leader, Feeder to the Green Racing Series.

American Camel GT Series

It's back. Kind of.

American Le Mans Series

World Underclass

[AndrewF31]

If you've heard Radio LeMans' Sportscar Review, you'll see there's a few 'Europeans' who actually think ACO has stiffed the ALMS (and ELMS).

I, for one, am Canadian but live in Europe so I'm a bit halfway and if ACO was at all interested in keeping their 'support' series alive and kicking, they wouldn't have done what they did to Petit Le Mans. No, it would never be part of WEC, and I think the Americans need to concede to that. To be in the WEC, you'd have to slaughter your consistent foundations in favor of a one shot, per year, overseas travellers. However, ACO could have easily allowed a 2 week gap before and after this race to allow some teams to come to this race, especially the more funded ones, and promote Petit as a race with a prize for Le Mans of the next year.
It's no coincidence the race has been called Petit LeMans for a long time, and ALMS was, for a pretty long time, one of the stallwarts that kept the LM name going, noone can doubt that.
The ALMS fans need to also realize, and most do, that without a WEC, Audi and Peugeot would still only do Sebring and Petit probably. Different times. These companies and factory programmes function based on marketing decisions. They went to America because there was a market to grab. Once that was over, they turned their guns to Asia.
The obsessive thrust for the friggen buck makes things change in the snap of a finger, and it will happen with the WEC eventually, as well.

WEC seemed clearly only interested in P1 programs at one point but they probably realized they would not have a grid so they opened the flood gates and came with the rule of a full season effort guaranteed a LMs entry. And business tells the small teams "if some guys are starting to creep over to WEC to guarantee the big piggy bank event, we need to push our budgets also."

First, PLM being overlapped by WEC was a kick in the ass for ALMS by ACO. Then ACO kicked ELMS in the ass after this championship said "ok, we'll give you P1 and focus on P2" and ACO suddenly said "we need more entries.... come on P2s, we give you LM spot!!!". And shafted ELMS.
Not really helping their feeder series in this economic landscape.
I'm sure we'll have all 3 championships, because some teams will be stretching their budgets. But I fear they are stretching their budgets thinking the payoff will compensate the investment.
And if it doesn't, how many of these privateer teams will survive for 2013?
I mean you guys gotta be wondering, all these smaller teams, how did they suddenly find money with the same sponsors when the economy is as bad as it is? Maybe I'm being pessimistic and there was more money available but before a World Championship, the companies didn't want to invest so much, and now they do. But I don't know....
Don't get me wrong, the WEC is going to be very interesting on the track but I'm a bit spooked at the perspective that we're sacrificing privateers for 10-12 short/mid-term big name factory cars on track. Eerie resemblance to the early 90s.
But, hey! LM and Sportscars survived that whirlpool so they'll survive it again if it happens.

[AGD]

That's a good post, AndrewF31. I can't disagree with anything you said really. As far as sports car racing surviving, sure, it will survive. There are too many rich guys who want to drive something really fast in competition for it not to survive. Ultimately, however, I think there is only so many blows a form of racing can take before it becomes tainted goods. Take Indycar for example. I can't imagine a single scenario where Indycar returns to being a fraction of what it was even during the post-NASCAR ascent period. Natural ups and downs are one thing, but dumb and greedy decision making is a different story. The ACO may have had goodwill all these years because someone else was always the evildoer before, but that could change this time.

One of the very bad signs is that the ACO was willing to grab a bag of money (blood money, IMO) and schedule over an established great race that could cause a lot of good publicity for the type of racing whether it was a WEC race or not without even telling the ALMS. They found out about it the same time we did supposedly. The teams were not informed about Bahrain either. It was a surprise to them. How is that wise decision making? Is the greed so high that they will grab bags of money anywhere without consulting their most essential stakeholders? Do they even know who the most important stakeholders are? I've seen a lot of stupidity by racing series over the years, but that move may have been one if the worst I've seen. Shameful, what more can I say?

Long term, the current WEC calendar isn't tenable. Even the big money teams are complaining about the condensed nature of the bottom end of the schedule. What are the smaller teams thinking? Of course, they can blame the big teams to some extent because they don't want to race a lot before Le Mans. I think that has a lot to do with BoP and sandbagging. Again, BoP is killing the sport, but that is a whole different story. Anyway, the WEC has to do a better job balancing the schedule. They don't have a lot of races so harmonizing it with other partner series should not be too difficult. In theory. We see what happens in practice. Running on opposite weeks as F1 can be beneficial in someways, but successful series do what's best for them. If it comes down to competing with the ALMS or competing with F1, they need to compete with F1 because otherwise you're making the small base of fans and media choose which sports car race to follow. That's a net negative for both.

Ultimately, there are big reasons for the ALMS to go on their own now aside from the ACO's predatory behavior. The predatory behavior just adds a lot of fuel to the fire. As for the ELMS, I don't know. The LMS was always a fun little series even when it did not have the heavy hitters. The racing was often very good and competitive. It's not fun to see it wither away. The ELMS may not be much, but I think a lot of fans will miss it when it's gone.

[Simmi]

Originally Posted by AndrewF31

Then ACO kicked ELMS in the ass after this championship said "ok, we'll give you P1 and focus on P2" and ACO suddenly said "we need more entries.... come on P2s, we give you LM spot!!!". And shafted ELMS.

Hmm I don't think the ELMS "gave" P1 to the ACO and the WEC. They chose to head in another direction, knowing full well that WEC entries would be good for an invite to Le Mans. It's not even like stalwart LMS teams have defected to the WEC.

Outfits like Signatech are new to the game and have bigger fish to fry.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by Simmi

Hmm I don't think the ELMS "gave" P1 to the ACO and the WEC. They chose to head in another direction, knowing full well that WEC entries would be good for an invite to Le Mans. It's not even like stalwart LMS teams have defected to the WEC.

Outfits like Signatech are new to the game and have bigger fish to fry.

Signatech = Signature Plus right? They are a former ELMS team. 2010 runner up in LMP1 IIRC. Ok, that might have been a bit of a joke of a second place, but whatever.

As for "giving up" P1, it might not have been a fully conscious move, but the ELMS probably thought that they would be better off conceding the P1 business and focusing on stand-alone races with P2s and other things since they did everything not P1 pretty well and the ILMC did not. Well, that may have been a somewhat flawed idea, but I don't know what other choice they could have made. Still, I think teams like Pescarolo and Rebellion would have run in the ELMS if ELMS P1 still existed. It may have been in combination with WEC in the case of Rebellion, but that's still something. But, yeah, that's not enough just as 2 P1s in ALMS isn't enough even if Dyson-Muscle Milk and Pescarolo-Rebellion put on better shows than Peugeot-Audi at non-Le Mans tracks. Granted, that's with BoP in the case of the ALMS.

[JAG]

We see what happens in practice. Running on opposite weeks as F1 can be beneficial in someways, but successful series do what's best for them. If it comes down to competing with the ALMS or competing with F1, they need to compete with F1 because otherwise you're making the small base of fans and media choose which sports car race to follow. That's a net negative for both.

You need to avoid F1 when possible, it soaks up the specialists press and wider media coverage, there's also the possibilty of F1 (reserve) and GP2 drivers bringing funding to WEC programs. A bigger worry would be giving drivers the opportunity to run in both the WEC/ALMS over media clashes.

The LMS was always a fun little series even when it did not have the heavy hitters. The racing was often very good and competitive. It's not fun to see it wither away. The ELMS may not be much, but I think a lot of fans will miss it when it's gone.

The ELMS fits it's new role easier, it's a series predominantly for privateers and pro/am driving teams, they only have half the rounds the ALMS does with those being 6 Hours each, for those reasons it was also an easier choice to go with P2.

[AndrewF31]

Originally Posted by JAG

The ELMS fits it's new role easier, it's a series predominantly for privateers and pro/am driving teams, they only have half the rounds the ALMS does with those being 6 Hours each, for those reasons it was also an easier choice to go with P2.

The problem with that JAG is right now there may not be as many P2s as originally thought since many have 'fled' to the WEC when they were supposedly going to stay in ELMS with WEC's primary focus on P1s.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by JAG

You need to avoid F1 when possible, it soaks up the specialists press and wider media coverage, there's also the possibilty of F1 (reserve) and GP2 drivers bringing funding to WEC programs. A bigger worry would be giving drivers the opportunity to run in both the WEC/ALMS over media clashes.

The problem is that a lot of other series have the same idea. The "specialist" media who might cover non-F1 events then are divided. If it's a shared weekend with ALMS or other sports car racing, the only guaranteed media the WEC has will be split up. Obviously that could cause problems for pro and amateur drivers and teams with multiple sports car commitments too. As drawing up the schedule to appease to F1 third seat pay drivers, well, that's pure comedy. Why should the schedule be determined by a driver or drivers of unknown talent who will probably be in a car with little media attention? That's more important than, say, avoiding a conflict with Petit?

The ELMS fits it's new role easier, it's a series predominantly for privateers and pro/am driving teams, they only have half the rounds the ALMS does with those being 6 Hours each, for those reasons it was also an easier choice to go with P2.

Originally Posted by AndrewF31

The problem with that JAG is right now there may not be as many P2s as originally thought since many have 'fled' to the WEC when they were supposedly going to stay in ELMS with WEC's primary focus on P1s.

Andrew is right. ELMS teams are more dependent on Le Mans than ALMS teams. Without Le Mans, those rides may never materialize. Amateur drivers and sponsors won't drop a wad of cash without some idea of getting to Le Mans.

[The Badger]

Just a question : I get the feeling that many American ALMS followers think there should be 2 races in the WEC , Sebring and Road Atlanta .

Am I guessing correctly ?

[JAG]

Not all teams have the funding, experience or desire to go to Le Mans and/or the WEC, across Europe there's a few hundred GT3/4 cars competing on a regular basis, there is a desire and push to race prototypes, both P2 and LMPC, so the aim in the medium-term has to be grids around the forty car mark, split equally between LMP's and GT's.

The problem is that a lot of other series have the same idea. The "specialist" media who might cover non-F1 events then are divided. If it's a shared weekend with ALMS or other sports car racing, the only guaranteed media the WEC has will be split up.

Sportscar racing is well covered by the specialist media and clashes between the various series are not uncommon. F1 garners 90%+ of the mainstream motorsport press, to make even a small dent you have to avoid it, even more so when targeting an international audience. The point about drivers is valid, the same pool are now competing in LMP/F1/GP2, a driver with talent and funding could put another car on the grid, but I agree current sportscar drivers need as few clashes as possible.

[AGD]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Just a question : I get the feeling that many American ALMS followers think there should be 2 races in the WEC , Sebring and Road Atlanta .

Am I guessing correctly ?

I can only speak for myself, but I want to see IMSA go on their own. That would be zero shared WEC races. If that happens, Sebring and Road Atlanta may not be available to the WEC. At least the prime race slots should not be available to them. If the WEC wants to run in North America somewhere, ok, but good luck getting it to be successful given the current level of promotion for the WEC and the the WEC's treatment of the fans.

Originally Posted by JAG

Not all teams have the funding, experience or desire to go to Le Mans and/or the WEC, across Europe there's a few hundred GT3/4 cars competing on a regular basis, there is a desire and push to race prototypes, both P2 and LMPC, so the aim in the medium-term has to be grids around the forty car mark, split equally between LMP's and GT's.

I don't know what GT4 teams want to do, but they aren't in the ELMS anyway unless they get very desperate. GTE and LMP2 teams, however, want to go to Le Mans. There may be one or two oddballs who don't care, but that is rare in the ELMS.

Sportscar racing is well covered by the specialist media and clashes between the various series are not uncommon. F1 garners 90%+ of the mainstream motorsport press, to make even a small dent you have to avoid it, even more so when targeting an international audience.

The sports car media does the best they can, but they are not numerous (not the English speaking ones at least) and they are stretched pretty thin as it is. For example, look at RLM's coverage of China this past year. They did not even have a video feed so Goodwin had to give play-by-play radio coverage when I'm sure that wasn't his plan. Ideally, what sports car racing needs is passionate media who can do what they do at their peak ability at all the major events. If the WEC conflicts with the Albanian GT4 championship, well, so be it. To dilute the media for the WEC and ALMS would be a shame. Doubly so if it's Petit or something like that.

Look, someone like CNN or Bloomberg could come in and cover Petit if Dagys isn't there or some F1 hackjob can do a halfassed job covering the WEC when they'd rather be rehashing more popular F1 press releases on their futons at home during their "off" week, but that's not the kind of media sports car racing needs. Some ditzy reporter who covers Hollywood can go cover F1 or NASCAR and do a decent job writing for the masses, but sports car racing appeals to a certain audience who demands some meat. Sports car racing has to reach the sports car fans first before it has any chance of going any further. Making the sports car community, especially the fans, choose one or the other isn't a positive development. Ideally, there would not be any conflicts of any kind, but that isn't going to happen with all the racing going on. Sometimes it's better to stick to the niche and do it very well rather than water down everything so nothing has any real importance.

[Jonerz]

Originally Posted by The Badger

Just a question : I get the feeling that many American ALMS followers think there should be 2 races in the WEC , Sebring and Road Atlanta .

Am I guessing correctly ?

Negative. A simple no. We don't want to rely on the WEC.

What we want is the ALMS to be a top class series that doesn't need two European manufacturers to come and play twice a year for people to respect it. If European teams wanted to come and play in the North American market they should be free to do so, especially considering the role Petit played in the last decade and a half of International sports car racing.

However, I'd love two WEC races in America, because I am a fan of that championship. I previously used the example of shared weekends with the ALMS at Road America and Laguna Seca. Separate events though, no shared track time because I don't want overpopulation of the grid to be a problem for either championship, and I want the ALMS to have a strong enough championship on its own not to need WEC cars. However, like in the 60s and early 70s if the European teams wanted to enter the American race the next day, perhaps for extra driving time for their gentleman drivers, or to challenge themselves against unique American cars, hopefully the rules will remain close enough to do so. (Or like in the 60s when Group 5 cars entered the Can-Am races they would have different performance capabilities that would make them reasonably competitive.)

I think the ALMS can do a lot to entice entrants if it separated itself from the WEC. I think Road America and Laguna Seca would be more interesting to WEC-type sponsors and teams than Sebring (middle of nowhere, Florida) and Road Atlanta (near a huge hub of business, but in the same region as Sebring.) Elkhart Lake is gorgeous in summer and Laguna Seca is Laguna Seca... 'nuff said.

The biggest problem I have with the ALMS relying on the ACO rules is I feel it gives them an excuse for a lack of interest in its P classes. Do something to differentiate yourself, sure "smaller displacement engines are what road car manufacturers are looking to develop in the future" but that shouldn't stop privateers or cottage industry engine builders from providing an engine that is well developed and powerful. In the IMSA GTP days Toyota had a 2.1 litre turbo four cylinder while the Intrepid Chevy featured a 6.5 liter V8. If you have a sliding scale of weights and restrictors for cars with vastly different engine configurations and layouts there is no reason to restrict the maximum displacement of engines. Also, the fact that diesels still are allowed larger displacement and forced induction is maddening to me. It seemed reasonable when no one was sure of what the diesels could do back in 2005 when Audi developed the R10, but now its insulting to private teams, and part of the reason Greg Pickett is so ticked with ACO rules in the first place.

While the ALMS hasn't run strictly to ACO rules perhaps ever, I think they've stayed to close to the ACO rules which has limited their ability to control their own destiny and earn entrants. In the GTP era there was some similarity between GTP and Group C which allowed teams to, if they chose to, run at Le Mans and run the GTP season. (I think only Jaguar took up that opportunity.) But rules that make sense for the American market and an American series are something that might require moving further away from the ACO's.

Where some might be fine with the American Le Mans Series becoming the British GT of International sports car racing, I for one would not. We have a huge market in North America (and if they so choose, across both Americas) that has sustained a top-flight International sports car series a couple times in the past and there should be no reason it shouldn't now. If maintaining the Le Mans designation means the ALMS is either made a feeder series for global sports car racing then the ALMS should do away with that relationship. (To most of the non-hardcore that I've met I've gotten puzzled looks as to why it is called American Le Mans or ALMS. So no, it doesn't have the same cache over here it does in Europe.)

And for those who have said it, the ALMS doesn't need Daytona, but it would be an immense asset and would be nice to add to Sebring and Atlanta (Petit) to make possibly the greatest sports car calendar on Earth let alone US history.

So no, not being featured twice on the WEC schedule isn't the reason for our disdain for ACO influence in America, what we want is for the ALMS to return to the pinnacle of racing. We won't be content being a peg on the ladder to the pinnacle of global sports car racing.

Chris

[AGD]

Originally Posted by Jonerz

And for those who have said it, the ALMS doesn't need Daytona, but it would be an immense asset and would be nice to add to Sebring and Atlanta (Petit) to make possibly the greatest sports car calendar on Earth let alone US history.

Well, since we're in dreamland talking about a domestic rulebook, Chevrolet Intrepids, and all things that are holy, here is a two part question to those in support of a new domestic formula: 1) Should there be a new American 24 Hour race, 2) Not counting Daytona or any other track IMSA has no shot at racing at, which track would you want it to be at?

[Speed-King]

1) Not sure - cost might be an issue in these days...
2) But if there is to be one have it at Road America

[AGD]

Originally Posted by Speed-King

1) Not sure - cost might be an issue in these days...

True

2) But if there is to be one have it at Road America

That would be awesome. That was my first thought too. The only drawback is that it would have to be run in the summer months. Something in the late fall (for example) could attract some star drivers from elsewhere around the racing world. I don't think that is a make-or-break issue though. It might be a dumb question, but are there any safety hazards at Road America at night? Deer or stuff? I guess that is a city slicker question, but I don't know.

[Jonerz]

I'd want the American 24 Hour race to be Daytona, because of the history, but since there is a greater chance of the ALMS throwing the ACO out than a non-Grand-AM Rolex 24 at Daytona...

1) I'd like it, but like Petit you would be trying to force-start history. So...

2) Why not just turn Petit into the Atlanta 24 Hours? (Although a track that could support 60, 70 or more entries going 24 Hours would be cool.)

Chris

[mountainstar]

Originally Posted by Jonerz

2) Why not just turn Petit into the Atlanta 24 Hours? (Although a track that could support 60, 70 or more entries going 24 Hours would be cool.)

Chris

24 hours of Road America. You could run it in the summer time.