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Old 25 Mar 2016, 13:20 (Ref:3627084)   #6826
Spyderman
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Spyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSpyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSpyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSpyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
I wouldn't read too much into these times. Both Audi and Toyota are testing here after the Prologue, and so they may not want to reveal too much. Furthermore we still have 4 more sessions
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Old 25 Mar 2016, 13:48 (Ref:3627097)   #6827
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One thing that I noticed is that because Porsche had to ditch the "wheel arch" winglets, they're running very tall gurney flaps on the TE of the engine cover.
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Old 25 Mar 2016, 13:56 (Ref:3627103)   #6828
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1:37.960.

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Old 25 Mar 2016, 14:12 (Ref:3627109)   #6829
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sssssssss should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridsssssssss should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
i think their game is to try and push audi and toyota to show some of their cards early on, so they know where they stand compared to the new cars pace-wise, since the new, aggresively-designed cars should theoretically have the better pace, but the more fragile reliability.
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Old 25 Mar 2016, 14:44 (Ref:3627119)   #6830
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that's what i was thinking ,,too..toyota is testing the low downforce package for the first time, so i dont think they are pushing hard ,,,
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Old 25 Mar 2016, 15:21 (Ref:3627131)   #6831
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Originally Posted by Spyderman View Post
As I have mentioned before, I was not fully on board with the new livery, until @LMPone pointed out the following:

Very clever livery on the '16 #919hybrid! Very smart @Porsche_Team!

Not trying to be overly negative, but... while that is an interesting observation, I highly doubt that was the intent. Why optimize your livery for night or low light viewing when most races are in daylight and all of your PR material shows the car well lit? Basically... "If you squint and look at this in a dark room, it looks like something its not?"

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Old 25 Mar 2016, 19:49 (Ref:3627257)   #6832
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gustavobamba should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridgustavobamba should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Porsche is in the (1.37,487) Session III
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Old 25 Mar 2016, 20:16 (Ref:3627271)   #6833
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gustavobamba should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridgustavobamba should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Porsche looking good
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Old 25 Mar 2016, 20:36 (Ref:3627281)   #6834
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Spyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSpyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSpyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSpyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
As Fritz Enzinger said: It's too early to judge performance.
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Old 25 Mar 2016, 20:37 (Ref:3627282)   #6835
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Originally Posted by Richard Casto View Post
Not trying to be overly negative, but... while that is an interesting observation, I highly doubt that was the intent. Why optimize your livery for night or low light viewing when most races are in daylight and all of your PR material shows the car well lit? Basically... "If you squint and look at this in a dark room, it looks like something its not?"

Richard
I think this is pretty cool and explains why there is so much black and white this year...you can finally get rid of that Big Honking Fin to see what your car would look like.

If this is intentional, which I think it is, it is the best livery trick since the old Champion Audis and the Panoz Hybrid (Sparky) at Le Mans.
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Old 25 Mar 2016, 20:45 (Ref:3627285)   #6836
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Originally Posted by Richard Casto View Post
Not trying to be overly negative, but... while that is an interesting observation, I highly doubt that was the intent. Why optimize your livery for night or low light viewing when most races are in daylight and all of your PR material shows the car well lit? Basically... "If you squint and look at this in a dark room, it looks like something its not?"

Richard
Because Le Mans = Season, and of that about third is in darkness.

I actually think Spyder & Cyber might actually be on to something, very nice indeed!
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Old 25 Mar 2016, 23:11 (Ref:3627340)   #6837
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It might be just me but looking at the photos of the first day of running and every time I see the 919's head on I think its a 2011 R18
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Old 26 Mar 2016, 00:10 (Ref:3627351)   #6838
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I think the white is supposed to be evocative and agree we are supposed to see that. But I don't buy the "at night" or cameras adjusting exposures to make the rest of the car fade away. And optimize for 1/3 of a race when visibility is poor (even if Le Mans). Makes no sense.

I think the livery is good... If you are limited to just black and white (which they are not)

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Old 26 Mar 2016, 04:02 (Ref:3627377)   #6839
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I think the cars have been designed for optimal performance and the look of the cars has suffered. They are really strange looking at some angles and have lost that gracefulness and sleekness. With the 2016 liveries, I think the cars can regain some of the beauty of lines that have been lost with the blunt fenders and the BHF and BHHs. When the cars are the stars, you've got to keep them looking as good as possible.

I still think the side fins (gills) on the Porsche are one of my favorite design elements in the field.
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Old 28 Mar 2016, 09:32 (Ref:3627981)   #6840
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Spyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSpyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSpyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridSpyderman should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
After reading on the Toyota and Audi threads what basically boiled down to claiming that both Audi and Toyota were really out for an early spring stroll, whilst Porsche was doing its very best to set the fastest time, I thought I would try and inject some sensible (I hope) counter points.
  • As we all know, Porsche was testing their high(er) down force package for the first time. It strikes me that Paul Ricard , in the configuration that was being used for the prologue, is not exactly a high DF type of track. It of course has sectors 1 and 3 where some good DF is a great help, but the long Mistral straight is not at all kind to those running a high DF package. This was more than evident in the delta between the top speeds set by Porsche and the other two competitors. The Sector 2 times were also illustrative as Porsche's best sector 2 time was 0.291 slower than Audi's best for that sector, and a full 0.656 seconds off Toyotas best.
  • Of course Porsche did do some qualy simulations, but these were usually done right at the start of the session, and were not nearly as frequent as some are claiming.
  • An interesting observation is to see Porsche doing a stint of 9 laps where only 2 of the laps (one being an out-lap) were over 1:39.7 (last stint of Day 2 - Afternoon)
  • It is really difficult to make any real comparisons between the three cars (at this point in time) as they were all running different aero packages , all in differing stages of development.
  • I read somewhere that Toyotas were claiming to be fastest in all sectors and that were often on a quick(est) lap and would back out in the last sector. I am afraid that this is simply not the impression one gets from looking at the sector times. Toyota was never quickest in S1 with their best S1 time being 0.575 off Porsche's best time for that sector.
  • It also does not seem reasonable to me, that one would give up testing an entire sector of the track over a period of two days, even if your DF package is not ideal. Testing is all about trying to find out (gather data) as much as possible about as many conditions as possible.
  • I think that we can safely (relatively) say the following: Porsche has , at this stage, an edge in reliability. They also seem to have a slight edge over both Toyota and Audi . Now, will they retain that edge into Silverstone?. I don't know, but over those two days at Paul Ricard, they were the car to beat. That is all we can safely say at this time.
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Old 28 Mar 2016, 09:39 (Ref:3627983)   #6841
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Originally Posted by Richard Casto View Post
I think the white is supposed to be evocative and agree we are supposed to see that. But I don't buy the "at night" or cameras adjusting exposures to make the rest of the car fade away. And optimize for 1/3 of a race when visibility is poor (even if Le Mans). Makes no sense.

I think the livery is good... If you are limited to just black and white (which they are not)

Richard
tbh, I agree. But despite it making no sense, it's exactly the kind of thing the teams do. They employ design students who produce concepts which are great in a studio, and terrible on circuit. Porsches design with the text looking down doesn't work outside of a studio, so this would fit with that too.

Similarly, Aston Martin did the car that was meant to change colour at night, and it did absolutely nothing at all lol.
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Old 28 Mar 2016, 13:37 (Ref:3628028)   #6842
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Originally Posted by Spyderman View Post
After reading on the Toyota and Audi threads what basically boiled down to claiming that both Audi and Toyota were really out for an early spring stroll, whilst Porsche was doing its very best to set the fastest time, I thought I would try and inject some sensible (I hope) counter points.

[[*]I think that we can safely (relatively) say the following: Porsche has , at this stage, an edge in reliability. They also seem to have a slight edge over both Toyota and Audi . Now, will they retain that edge into Silverstone?. I don't know, but over those two days at Paul Ricard, they were the car to beat. That is all we can safely say at this time.[/LIST]
I think maybe more accurately we could say the car Porsche showed us was faster at Paul Ricard than the cars Toyota and Audi showed us there. This looks to be a very close hold'em game, Silverstone should be very illuminating. Meanwhile the suspense is terrific (in both senses).
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Old 28 Mar 2016, 13:42 (Ref:3628030)   #6843
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I think maybe more accurately we could say the car Porsche showed us was faster at Paul Ricard than the cars Toyota and Audi showed us there. This looks to be a very close hold'em game, Silverstone should be very illuminating. Meanwhile the suspense is terrific (in both senses).
Exactly what I was trying to say.
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Old 28 Mar 2016, 16:34 (Ref:3628085)   #6844
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Similarly, Aston Martin did the car that was meant to change colour at night, and it did absolutely nothing at all lol.
Yeah I guess even the ill fated BMW "art car" was better at that a few years ago.
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Old 28 Mar 2016, 16:49 (Ref:3628088)   #6845
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Porsche LMP1 Discussion

Porsche texting in spa this week? Neel Jani posted a picture on Twitter.
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Old 28 Mar 2016, 17:23 (Ref:3628097)   #6846
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They testing tomorrow and Wednesday.
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Old 29 Mar 2016, 05:20 (Ref:3628271)   #6847
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Spyderman, where did you read about the Toyota guys sandbagging? I haven't seen anyone claim that. I have seen people say that Sarrazin set their best lap and he was or is their slowest driver. Not sure what to say about Audi. Imo they seem to have a few issues but will probably get over them. Porsche is still the car to beat until someone beats them.
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Old 29 Mar 2016, 05:37 (Ref:3628274)   #6848
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FIA WEC actually said it ,,, that toyota was fast in must sectors and then dropped out the lap....i read Spyders comment before ,, but went to the Fia wec web , to check for new and read it there

this is what the FIA WEC article says

toyota will be greatly encouraged by the performance of the TS050 HYBRID. The car set a succession of fastest sector times during the two days, but then chose not to complete the laps. The intrigue about just how much pace the Japanese marque has with its new car is the talk of the WEC paddock

Article here

http://www.fiawec.com/en/news/prolog...-pro_3832.html
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Old 29 Mar 2016, 05:39 (Ref:3628275)   #6849
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Spyderman, where did you read about the Toyota guys sandbagging? I haven't seen anyone claim that. I have seen people say that Sarrazin set their best lap and he was or is their slowest driver. Not sure what to say about Audi. Imo they seem to have a few issues but will probably get over them. Porsche is still the car to beat until someone beats them.
I'm referring to the general tone of the discussions on the two threads mentioned. I also read the "Toyota" thing on a Facebook post that some one was quoting a source.
Again - Having looked very closely at the sector times, there is no doubt what-so-ever that Toyota has improved immensely. They had the furthest road to travel. They were very far behind last year, and also had to recover the 3-4 seconds lost due to fuel restriction. They have certainly done that, and deserve all the praise in the world. However, to go from there to insinuate that they were generally taking a stroll in the park (hyperbole being used to illustrate a point) during the prologue is silly. All competitors wanted to see where they stood in relation to the competition. That issue was not just the prerogative for Porsche.
Furthermore - I have no doubt that both Toyota and Audi will resolve what ever technical difficulties they are currently having, and will appear at Silverstone much more stable than during the prologue, and they will be strong by Le Mans. It's the nature of development.
Observation: I compared last years best sector times (across the 5 sessions) for Porsche with this years times. The high DF package has a tremendous effect in Sector 3 (fast corners) where they improved ~1.1 seconds , but they also lost ~ 1.1 seconds in Sector 2 (mistral).
I think it is clear why Porsche chose to test their high(er) DF package:
  1. They had not tested it before
  2. They wanted to test it for Silverstone.
It was not (IMO) to set any rocket times in the prologue. They were as committed ( or not) as any of the other two teams.
This week they are testing at Spa. The lower DF package will be used, no doubt.

Last edited by Spyderman; 29 Mar 2016 at 05:47.
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Old 29 Mar 2016, 05:49 (Ref:3628282)   #6850
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Spyderman can you provide the link to w.e you are referring about Facebook.. thank you..
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