2012 Bathurst 12 Hour - 24-26 February

[GROUPA]

Originally Posted by ff s conscience

i'll point out for all that the vast majority of prep for teds car is done at his shop by two of his full time staff.

The Ferrari is and was fickle, and needs a certain touch, and I did a lot more, but the Lambo is a lit easier, newer, and the guys have been going a while now and are more than competent.

I mostly crew chief the weekends, while one of the guys is manager, the other is no1 mech. I advise a bit still, but the ship is steady. Its a great little outfit. Other GT3 car teams can only fantasise about getting such results so efficiently.

Yeah because those guys at MPC are just a bunch of flogs

[ff s conscience]

Originally Posted by GROUPA

Yeah because those guys at MPC are just a bunch of flogs

Huh?

What have MPC got to do with anything?

[James69181]

Would love to see a face to face forum with a group interested in Australian Motorsport (not self interested). To discuss the for and against of taking the biggest production car race in Australia from one group and giving it to another (smaller) group that has their own national and international competitions.
29 cars .... maybe !!!

[Oldtony]

Doesanyone else get the feeling that this disagreement between Production and GT is all about who will be in the best position to take over when V8SC implodes?
Ah! I can dream cant I. GT in Febrauary. Showroom in October

[peckstar]

Originally Posted by Oldtony

Doesanyone else get the feeling that this disagreement between Production and GT is all about who will be in the best position to take over when V8SC implodes?
Ah! I can dream cant I. GT in Febrauary. Showroom in October

Lets see, you have a GT race at bathurst where the local GT cars wont race at. Who is imploding?

you also had a showroom race in February with 40 plus cars, now there are less than 10, who is imploding?

[GROUPA]

Originally Posted by ff s conscience

Huh?

What have MPC got to do with anything?

Other GT3 car teams can only fantasise about getting such results so efficiently.

MPC runs the Eddy & Hackett cars they are GT3 and certainly have the runs on the board

But as a racing spectator that does the odd track day I love your (and others) banter on this thread.

[bluesport]

Originally Posted by Oldtony

Doesanyone else get the feeling that this disagreement between Production and GT is all about who will be in the best position to take over when V8SC implodes?
Ah! I can dream cant I. GT in Febrauary. Showroom in October

I think there will be room for both Tony, with GT3 taking top billing.

[ff s conscience]

Originally Posted by GROUPA

Other GT3 car teams can. only fantasise about getting such results so efficiently.

MPC runs the Eddy & Hackett cars they are GT3 and certainly have the runs on the board

But as a racing spectator that does the odd track day I love your (and others) banter on this thread.

Ah, I see where you.re coming from. I have not commented on MPC though. Their results are there to see, but I maintain my efficiency argument

[GROUPA]

Originally Posted by ff s conscience

Ah, I see where you.re coming from. I have not commented on MPC though. Their results are there to see, but I maintain my efficiency argument

It would fall into the category of 'other'

[woodduck97]

Originally Posted by peckstar

you also had a showroom race in February with 40 plus cars, now there are less than 10, who is imploding?

Pfft... you aren't serious ? Half of the "40" arent even eligble to run at the 12 hour anymore (most of the bay car classes are all gone and the middle classes aren't invited either - only the "outright" classes).

42 cars started the race in 2010 (46 did enter), 47 in 2009, 34 in 2008 and 32 in 2007. So there was an upward trend there...

This dropped to 26 in 2011 and doesnt look like being much better this year.

Most of the production car competitors are focussing their energies on the Australian Manufacturers championship, and so they should. With this championship gaining momentum, had the 12 hour stayed just Production based it wouldnt be totally crazy to suggest a 55 car grid would not have been too far away....

But alas...

If the event fails to get 30 cars this year there would have to be some serious re-consideration on the decision to go GT, especially given the total lack of support from the organisers of AUS GT and the snubbing from the majority of the local competitior base. It has attracted some tasty entries from overseas, I will give that some credit.

The question will be, and always has been, is it - GT - sustainable ?

One possible solution could be to offer the Australian Manufacturers Championship a 6 hour race on the Saturday afternoon, and run the 12 hour for GT and assorted Sports cars on the Sunday, or visa versa - the best of both worlds, the promoter gets more cars to the meeting and so on....

This would mean that in order for the GT side to put together a viable grid without proddies/commodore cup/saloon cars/HQ's whatever propping it up, The frosty relationship between B12HR HQ and AUS GT owners would need to be warmed, and the local competitors would have to embrace more openly.

Could GT put 35 cars on the grid geninuely ?

over to you guys....

PS> I agree with oldtony, there is a certain level of "jockeying" to put one in a position of strength once the envitable collapse of the V8 circus happens.

[R4z3rw33n]

Originally Posted by woodduck97

If the event fails to get 30 cars this year there would have to be some serious re-consideration on the decision to go GT, especially given the total lack of support from the organisers of AUS GT and the snubbing from the majority of the local competitior base. It has attracted some tasty entries from overseas, I will give that some credit.

The question will be, and always has been, is it - GT - sustainable ?

The lack of entries is due to multiple factors; pretty much all of these factors are the result of motives, and expectations of specific parties.
Realistically, they aren't huge issues. It seems this could be avoided with either a) more cooperation or, b) greater planning.

The lack of local GT runners doesn't so much seem to be a case of their snubbing the event - multiple owners expressed interest; this is documented.
In an ideal scenario, there wouldn't be a scheduling conflict with Adelaide/Clipsal; which would immediately provide access to a larger volume of AustralianGT/CC entries.

As far as GT being sustainable is concerned, sure - providing it's managed correctly. It's worth reminding people that all technical rule sets have a finite life cycle, regardless - it's just a matter of sustaining this for as extended a period as possible.

If there's an increase in local involvement, I see no reason as to why GT(3) can't achieve this. There's a local cachet of eligible, relatively recent machinery and, teams interested in participating.

Ultimately, it's a matter of providing a workable event for those parties. That's not the case, currently and, one could argue that's a direct result of the scheduling conflict.
Blame aside, this needs to be rectified.

Originally Posted by woodduck97

One possible solution could be to offer the Australian Manufacturers Championship a 6 hour race on the Saturday afternoon, and run the 12 hour for GT and assorted Sports cars on the Sunday, or visa versa - the best of both worlds, the promoter gets more cars to the meeting and so on....

This would mean that in order for the GT side to put together a viable grid without proddies/commodore cup/saloon cars/HQ's whatever propping it up, The frosty relationship between B12HR HQ and AUS GT owners would need to be warmed, and the local competitors would have to embrace more openly.

Could GT put 35 cars on the grid geninuely?

over to you guys....

That doesn't sound like a bad idea. Personally, I'd much rather see both GT/Production (providing they're eligible) competing concurrently, over the 12 hour duration.

[GROUPA]

Tony Quinn apperas to be a pretty good guy on has a quick wit...but his handling of this whole GT matter and not attending makes him another sort of wit.

I understand his problems from last year but he is not doing Aus GT or the fans any favours in his current stance...I would love to see him and Weeks and a few others @ Bathurst.

Come on TQ it is not too late to run something

[TCR]

Tonys focus obviously has to be on the GT Championship, but I still believe he should be supporting the stand alone 12Hr event.

I also believe that the lack of local entries can be put down to the scheduling of the event and the fact that the opening round of the Championship is only one week after the 12Hr.

Hopefully something can be sorted out for next year but it seems that the promoters are somewhat stuck, as they really only have a 7 week window between the Dubai 24Hr race and the Clipsal event.

[peckstar]

why should he be supporting the stand alone event, I wasnt aware he was a charity.

its easy to spend someones elese money

[Axeman444]

Originally Posted by woodduck97

Pfft... you aren't serious ? Half of the "40" arent even eligble to run at the 12 hour anymore (most of the bay car classes are all gone and the middle classes aren't invited either - only the "outright" classes).

42 cars started the race in 2010 (46 did enter), 47 in 2009, 34 in 2008 and 32 in 2007. So there was an upward trend there...

This dropped to 26 in 2011 and doesnt look like being much better this year.

Most of the production car competitors are focussing their energies on the Australian Manufacturers championship, and so they should. With this championship gaining momentum, had the 12 hour stayed just Production based it wouldnt be totally crazy to suggest a 55 car grid would not have been too far away....

But alas...

If the event fails to get 30 cars this year there would have to be some serious re-consideration on the decision to go GT, especially given the total lack of support from the organisers of AUS GT and the snubbing from the majority of the local competitior base. It has attracted some tasty entries from overseas, I will give that some credit.

The question will be, and always has been, is it - GT - sustainable ?

One possible solution could be to offer the Australian Manufacturers Championship a 6 hour race on the Saturday afternoon, and run the 12 hour for GT and assorted Sports cars on the Sunday, or visa versa - the best of both worlds, the promoter gets more cars to the meeting and so on....

This would mean that in order for the GT side to put together a viable grid without proddies/commodore cup/saloon cars/HQ's whatever propping it up, The frosty relationship between B12HR HQ and AUS GT owners would need to be warmed, and the local competitors would have to embrace more openly.

Could GT put 35 cars on the grid geninuely ?

over to you guys....

PS> I agree with oldtony, there is a certain level of "jockeying" to put one in a position of strength once the envitable collapse of the V8 circus happens.

a stupid question from someone who doesn't follow this side of the sport as much, however, I seem to recall that the Aust GT series is something along the lines of required to run N-1 or older, ie running cars 1 year or more older than the euro series'. Is this the case? If so, could it work bringing last year's euro or other cars here to run the 12 hr, then selling cars to local teams to run the rest of the year, reducing the freight costs for the euro's (not having to ship them home) and the locals (not having to ship them here), and keeping the local series semi current while still staying within the regs?

obviously this is apart from the issues that teams will be working on 2013 cars before Dec 2012 for example. Just thinking with my keyboard

[TCR]

Originally Posted by peckstar

why should he be supporting the stand alone event, I wasnt aware he was a charity.

its easy to spend someones elese money

I suppose when I said supporting the event, I meant more in terms of working with the promoters of the 12hr in regards to scheduling, to give the local GT guys the opportunity to do both the 12hr and GT Championship rather than putting in an entry.

[bluesport]

Originally Posted by peckstar

why should he be supporting the stand alone event, I wasnt aware he was a charity.

its easy to spend someones elese money

Probably because it would create greater interest in the GT category in general, and also if the local entries (and drivers) put up good performances against some of the world's leading teams it could be a real shot in the arm for Australian motorsport.........it may even launch some careers into bigger things internationally.

[peckstar]

you mean 55 year old tony quinn wants to launch a career in motor racing internationally.

I'm not sure he has time for it

[R4z3rw33n]

Originally Posted by peckstar

why should he be supporting the stand alone event, I wasnt aware he was a charity.

its easy to spend someones elese money

Originally Posted by TCR

I suppose when I said supporting the event, I meant more in terms of working with the promoters of the 12hr in regards to scheduling, to give the local GT guys the opportunity to do both the 12hr and GT Championship rather than putting in an entry.

Originally Posted by bluesport

Probably because it would create greater interest in the GT category in general, and also if the local entries (and drivers) put up good performances against some of the world's leading teams it could be a real shot in the arm for Australian motorsport.........it may even launch some careers into bigger things internationally.

That's pretty much it. Even if, at this point, it's solely potential.

The 12 Hour and AustralianGT organisers might be competitors when they're placed in a position to fight one another for entries, sponsors or, spectators (not so much the latter) but, ultimately both parties are likely to mutually benefit from the local GT scene being perceived in a more positive/healthy light.

Consider the 12 Hour as an annual showcase for the local GT market. Seeing rival factions emerging and damaging one another's interests (in a small market) doesn't exactly inspire confidence in an investment.

The issues faced at present are detrimental to both parties. It's in both organisers' best interests to sort a workable solution.

[GROUPA]

Originally Posted by peckstar

why should he be supporting the stand alone event, I wasnt aware he was a charity.

its easy to spend someones elese money

Originally Posted by peckstar

you mean 55 year old tony quinn wants to launch a career in motor racing internationally.

I'm not sure he has time for it

Your a jovial fellow

Craig Baird summed it up nicely in his AA interview this week...the GT guys have been *****ing and moaning about longer races....they put one on and they don't attend.

At the end of the days these guys are racers I can understand one car team not running eg Weeks, Crick but Quinn (maybe Weeks too) has a few cars in the shed and he is a racer after all....will be surprising if he actual attends the event at all...if he did it would be somewhat hypocritical

I think TQ is great for motorsport in Australia, he has put his money where his mouth is and runs in alot of motorsport events in all different fields.

Here, here to the previous post too

[DAVID PATERSON]

Originally Posted by Axeman444

I seem to recall that the Aust GT series is something along the lines of required to run N-1 or older, ie running cars 1 year or more older than the euro series'. Is this the case? If so, could it work bringing last year's euro or other cars here to run the 12 hr, then selling cars to local teams to run the rest of the year, reducing the freight costs for the euro's (not having to ship them home) and the locals (not having to ship them here), and keeping the local series semi current while still staying within the regs?

Formula 1 teams did this 45 years ago and it worked out well for everyone, F1 teams, the Aussie competitors and the Aussie fans all benefitted from it.

[bluesport]

Originally Posted by GROUPA

Your a jovial fellow

That's the polite way of putting it........there probably is more accurate descriptions.

[peckstar]

like i said its easy to spend someones elses money.

go and make your own multi millions and you guys can decide how you spend it.

Its the same with craig baird, pay driver, when he has his own team he can make the descsions.

Besides its not Tony Quinn who decided to have the race the week before the start of the GT season

[R4z3rw33n]

Originally Posted by peckstar

like i said its easy to spend someones elses money.

go and make your own multi millions and you guys can decide how you spend it.

Its the same with craig baird, pay driver, when he has his own team he can make the descsions.

Besides its not Tony Quinn who decided to have the race the week before the start of the GT season

It's isn't a case of spending another guy's cash.
It's a case of not stepping on one another's toes, where possible, to ensure a positive outcome - rectify the scheduling conflict, watch the scenery change.

[woodduck97]

Originally Posted by R4z3rw33n

It's isn't a case of spending another guy's cash.
It's a case of not stepping on one another's toes, where possible, to ensure a positive outcome - rectify the scheduling conflict, watch the scenery change.

Think it is more than just a scheduling issue. If you can find the clip of "in pit lane" interview with TQ from Shannons Nationals at Sandown, this would be very apparent....