Audi LMP1 Discussion

[CTD]

Originally Posted by avvelenamento

Maybe you mean 90X, the last number should be the same of the street cars. In '90 peugeot range vehicles was 205, 305 etc... so the WSC was 905. In 2007-2011 peugeot range vehicles was 208, 308, 408 etc... so the lmp1 was 908. If in future peugeot vehicles will be 211, 311 etc... a possible lmp1 could be named 911?

You need to follow the Car news a bit more .

Peugeot have announced that there will be a change in how the name their models...
Previously the first digit (xoo) was the class of the car (like 10x is the smallest). The second digit (oxo) was the iconic "0". The third (oox) was the generation.

In the future, the 2 first digits will follow tradition, but the third (oox) will change from a generation number to an "area" number. In the future all European sold Peugeots will be X08, and all Asian sold Peugeot will be X07 (South America, I don't know). SO the 908-bis (the V8 powered car), was actually the first of the new naming strategy.

But back to Audi.
Audi has for a long time now named their racecars after their project names. "R" for Racing and then a number which project the car is.
Ex:
Audi R16, is the R8 LMS, Audi R17 is the A5 DTM car, Audi R18 is the Le Mans racer.

So the 2014 Audi will be R18 +the number of other project started before the 2014 Audi.

[avvelenamento]

Originally Posted by CTD

You need to follow the Car news a bit more .

Peugeot have announced that there will be a change in how the name their models...
Previously the first digit (xoo) was the class of the car (like 10x is the smallest). The second digit (oxo) was the iconic "0". The third (oox) was the generation.

In the future, the 2 first digits will follow tradition, but the third (oox) will change from a generation number to an "area" number. In the future all European sold Peugeots will be X08, and all Asian sold Peugeot will be X07 (South America, I don't know). SO the 908-bis (the V8 powered car), was actually the first of the new naming strategy.

But back to Audi.
Audi has for a long time now named their racecars after their project names. "R" for Racing and then a number which project the car is.
Ex:
Audi R16, is the R8 LMS, Audi R17 is the A5 DTM car, Audi R18 is the Le Mans racer.

So the 2014 Audi will be R18 +the number of other project started before the 2014 Audi.

I liked peugeot sport and 908-908HDi, but I'm not a great fan of peugeot street cars so thanks for these infos. Anyway we have to wait a lot to see how the 908-bis will be named. Doubt that peugeot will come back again before than 10 years, or anyway before PSA will rise from their crisis. Yeah I know the "R" audi style, R12 was a concept street car if am I not wrong, R13, R14 and R14+ was the A4 2005-2009 spec DTM, R15, R15+ and R15++ the 2009-2011 lmp1, R16 the r8 lms, R17 the A5 and RS5 dtm, R18 is the 2011 spec lmp1. If audi will follow tradition should be R19.

[CTD]

Originally Posted by avvelenamento

I liked peugeot sport and 908-908HDi, but I'm not a great fan of peugeot street cars so thanks for these infos. Anyway we have to wait a lot to see how the 908-bis will be named. Doubt that peugeot will come back again before than 10 years, or anyway before PSA will rise from their crisis. Yeah I know the "R" audi style, R12 was a concept street car if am I not wrong, R13, R14 and R14+ was the A4 2005-2009 spec DTM, R15, R15+ and R15++ the 2009-2011 lmp1, R16 the r8 lms, R17 the A5 and RS5 dtm, R18 is the 2011 spec lmp1. If audi will follow tradition should be R19.

The 908-bis is the 2011 Le Mans car, not a future model.
(R12 was a DTM car too)
The R19 should be a DTM car.

But this shouldn't be the topic of discussion here, as it's the R18 thread

[avvelenamento]

My bad, r12-13-14 are the codename of A4 dtm during 2005-2009 years. You are right, don't know how i remember that r12 was a concept car. How could you say that R19 will be a dtm car? new DTM specs should debut in 2015, while lmp1 car should debut next year. Anyway maybe will be named r19, r20 or some other name like simpy audi e-tron.

[Mal]

Originally Posted by avvelenamento

Maybe you mean 90X,

No I dont. What I mean is Audi can call it what it likes - including the R18 - it is their choice. We all know it wont be the same car but if they want to they can call it the R18 and that is the policy the Peugeot were following.

[MitchZ06]

I thought all new closed top coupes would be R18s from now on?

[avvelenamento]

Ok, I was wrong about peugeot X0X name, but judging by the fact that each different audi race car had an own R- codenam, is very unlikely that the new 2014 car will be named again R18. Of course everything can happen.
If I was someone inside audi sport, I would like to call the car simply audi e-tron, simple and very usefull to use for commercials and advertisment.

[MyNameIsNigel]

I can't find the source any more but I did read somewhere that the new Audi was unlikely to be called R19 or R20 and that Audi would probably stick with the R18 codename.

[TF110]

I think it will be called something new as it will be an entirely new car. My guess is R21 e-tron hybrid blah blah...

[MyNameIsNigel]

Originally Posted by MyNameIsNigel

I can't find the source any more but I did read somewhere that the new Audi was unlikely to be called R19 or R20 and that Audi would probably stick with the R18 codename.

I've found the source again:

Die Entwickler aus Neckarsulm und Ingolstadt arbeiten unter Hochdruck, um den Gegnern 2013 und auch ab 2014 Paroli bieten zu können. Auf dem Weg in die Le-Mans-Zukunft, in der Audi weiterhin einen Schwerpunkt in der Darstellung von Technologie setzen möchte, gibt es ein ungewöhnliches Hindernis. "Wie das 2014er-Auto heißen wird, weiß ich noch nicht. Nicht ausgeschlossen, dass es wieder R18 heißen wird. Es ist alles nicht so einfach. Wir haben dabei ein formelles Problem", schmunzelt Ullrich.
"Wir können nicht einfach unsere Projektnamen fortschreiben und zum Namen der Rennautos machen", sagt er. "Es gibt einen französischen Hersteller, der gewisse Rechte an Namen mit dem Buchstaben 'R' und einer folgenden Nummer hat. Ab R19 geht nichts, bei R18 ist Schluss. Der R19 ist eben ein Straßenfahrzeug von Renault. Vielleicht könnten wir bei R100 wieder einsetzen." Von "R19" bis "R21" handelt es sich im Straßenfahrzeuge, ab der Bezeichnung "R22" geht es um Formel-1-Fahrzeuge der Franzosen.

In other words, it is highly unlikely that next year's car will be named R19, R20, R21, R22, ... in view of Renault's existing IP rights in the relevant tradenames/trademarks. We should rather expect the R18 name to stay or something totally different. I would be surprised if they use the R100 name. You can however bet that the "e-tron quattro" designation will remain in one form or another.

[sssssssss]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5fPXL0zmLg

here's an interesting video with onboard telemetry from lm2013 where (at minute 9:51) the r18 etron hits 335 km/h on the mulsanne, although the aco data provided a maximum speed of 331 km/h this year (vs. a 326 km/h for toyota).

[CTD]

10:31 is quite close

[TF110]

Originally Posted by sssssssss

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5fPXL0zmLg

here's an interesting video with onboard telemetry from lm2013 where (at minute 9:51) the r18 etron hits 335 km/h on the mulsanne, although the aco data provided a maximum speed of 331 km/h this year (vs. a 326 km/h for toyota).

Those are from the 'speed traps' aren't they?

[CTD]

Originally Posted by TF110

Those are from the 'speed traps' aren't they?

Yes. But the speed traps is likely placed at the points of the highest average speed. Therefor Audi will top a bit after the speed trap because of their shorter and more efficient braking.

However, we must also remember speed telemetry can also be imprecise.

[TF110]

Telemetry should be quite accurate. Not just Audi but other lmp cars were probably faster than the speed traps indicate. True top speed is probably closer to ~330kmh for lmp1 with their low drag.

[gwyllion]

Personal comments on Interlagos weekend:

• McNish: Sao Paulo Debrief
• Treluyer: Mission accomplished

[Articus]

Originally Posted by CTD

10:31 is quite close

So much for Quattro

[MyNameIsNigel]

There is a very short interview of Dr. Ullrich in the latest issue of Autosport magazine where it is suggested that next year's Audi racer will still use only a single hybrid system on the front axle and flywheel energy storage device :

Wolfgang Ullrich:

We think we will stay with one axle and the system we have. We feel we can capture enough energy with our current system; we can't use everything that we recuperate now.

This may suggest that Audi will opt for the 4MJ or 6MJ hybrid option, as it seems unlikely that the current system can be dimensioned to store and deliver 8MJ.

The fact that they are not apparently contemplating to use a second hybrid system (as allowed by the rules) may suggest that they are confident that a medium-sized hybrid system is sufficient to achieve the desired performance or that they are looking at alternate measures, such as the "air-hybrid system" which (according to my reading of the rules) does not qualify as a hybrid system.

[FGE]

Originally Posted by MyNameIsNigel

I've found the source again:


In other words, it is highly unlikely that next year's car will be named R19, R20, R21, R22, ... in view of Renault's existing IP rights in the relevant tradenames/trademarks. We should rather expect the R18 name to stay or something totally different. I would be surprised if they use the R100 name. You can however bet that the "e-tron quattro" designation will remain in one form or another.

Very funny.
They don´t call the race car R19 because of Renault.
But they call the R8 because of Renault?

[gwyllion]

The answer to that question is very easy.

According to the WIPO database, the mark names R19, R21, R25 were registered by Renault on 05/06/1969 and they will expire on 05/06/2019. Lower numbers (except R4, R5) are not protected brand names

In fact R8 is a protected mark name from Audi, that was registered on 06/09/2004. BTW according to the WIP database Audi also owns R6.

[MyNameIsNigel]

Originally Posted by FGE

Very funny.
They don´t call the race car R19 because of Renault.
But they call the R8 because of Renault?

Difference being that Renault do not apparently own any IP rights in relation to the (Gordini) "R8" designation.

This being said Renault own IP rights in the "R18" designation and you may wonder if Audi have not been approached by Renault complaining about the issue, which now leads Audi to refrain from using the "R19" designation for next year's car, which designation is also owned by Renault.

The naming contest is open. My take: "Audi RS19 e-tron (air) quattro"

[avvelenamento]

R18 is used on audi commercials, I think that for the new car they need something more "easy" for common people to associate the lmp1 car to street audi. My take is simply: Audi RS e-tron quattro.

[MyNameIsNigel]

Originally Posted by avvelenamento

R18 is used on audi commercials, I think that for the new car they need something more "easy" for common people to associate the lmp1 car to street audi. My take is simply: Audi RS e-tron quattro.

Or "DasAudi"

[avvelenamento]

not an original idea, ferrari already did with LaFerrari, that basicly means TheFerrari in english or DasFerrari in german

[MyNameIsNigel]

Originally Posted by avvelenamento

not an original idea, ferrari already did with LaFerrari, that basicly means TheFerrari in english or DasFerrari in german

That was the idea indeed. I somewhat suspected that you would get the reference to "LaFerrari". That was not supposed to be an original idea