Autosport's Rating of Montoya & Raikkonen

OSTKURVE · 31 Jan 2005, 09:41 (Ref:1213610)

I saw the latest edition of Autosport @ the newsstand this eveniing & Autosport bills Montoya & Raikkonen as the most effective combination in F1 or something to that effect.

I was wondering how Ten Tenth's F1forum members felt about that analysis considering I have read many post criticizing Montoya for being inconsistant.

**Adam43** · 31 Jan 2005, 09:49 (Ref:1213618)

Putting aside my opinion that any team with Michael in it probably has the best combination as he can make up for deficiancies of teh other one. I think Autosport may be right.

Williams. They will have a couple of good drivers, but both will be relatively inexperienced. Also I'd rate both Kimi and Montoya ahead of Williams' main driver Webber (at the moment).

Renault. This is the closest challenger to best combination IMHO. Alonso is very good and I think Fisi is too. Will it come together, I think it might.

Toyota have a couple of good experienced drivers. Both are quick, but niether are great.

BAR. A good one and a mediorce one. This combination threatens to be a great one and a good one, but aren't yet.

Sauber. I don't want to destroy this thread, which will happen whatever I say. Not as good a combination as the McLaren pair.

Reb Bull. The same.

Jordan and Minardi. Nope.

So yes McLaren, at this stage, do look like the best pairing. We'll see how all the teams adapt to the new pairing as the year goes on (Ferrari and BAR are the only ones with the same pair).

Seton Fanatic · 31 Jan 2005, 09:58 (Ref:1213624)

That's an interesting and, perhaps, shrewd observation by Autosport. Montoya and Raikkonen are both very fast drivers and eminently capable of beating Michael Schumacher and Ferrari. Both drivers know that to win the world title, they must apply their intelligence and work together to achieve that goal. The indication, publicly, at least, is that both get on extremely well, and will not be afraid to race each other on the track. This is a combination that will add 3/10ths of a second on talent alone. 2005 must be a year in which McLaren challenge for the title, or Mercedes, whose interests are worryingly diverted to the establishment of the GPWC, may get cold feet over their future in F1.

As for the others - The Sauber and Toyota pairings appear to be the wildcards in the pack. All drivers in that quartet have everything to prove, and will be giving it their all. Watch these two pairings with interest.

Gt_R · 31 Jan 2005, 10:34 (Ref:1213656)

Indeed, the Kimi/JPM partnership may promise great things...and be a winning combination. On their own, each driver possess great talent, Kimi with ice-cold efficiency while JPM achieves his competitiveness through fiery enthusiasm.

And, bar Ferrari, this combination is effectively the strongest relative to rival teams. Renault run them close in theory, but last season, Alonso's first half season was average, and that cannot happen again this season. BAR has the service of a steady Jenson Button, and Sato COULD potentially be very quick too.

Williams is strong with Webber, but there is question mark over the other driver..and imo, at this point of time, Williams seem to have the weaker combination among the top 5 teams Ferrari/Mclaren/Renault/Williams/BAR.

Compared to Ferrari, i would say that while JPM/Kimi can be POTENTIALLY quicker, especially in the future, but Michael/Rubens are PROVEN to be quicker. The Michael/Rubens partnership is efficient, fast AND consistent, while JPM/Kimi is fast, but not as efficient nor consistent. Kimi seem to be the stronger of the 2 at this point (but still a bit behind Michael) , and Rubens is as fast/consistent as JPM (or rather, not).

If i were to rate the effectiveness &strength of the partnership (Highest/Lowest):
1) Ferrari 9.2/8.2
2) Mclaren 8.9/7.4
3) Renault 8.5/7.0
4) BAR 8.5/6.6
5) Williams 8.1/6.8 *considering Nick is 2nd driver*
6) Toyota 8.0/6.0
7) Sauber 7.5/5.5
8) RedBull 7.1/5.2 *considering Klien*
9) Jordan -/-
10) Minardi -/-

Now, JPM and Kimi put on a united front...but i wonder how long it will last.. Even the strongest rivalry/friendship Trulli/Alonso last year took some strain..and we know that JPM and Kimi are not exactly the least calm headed. Both are establishing themselves, a good result against the other this year is instrumental for their career.. with big pride... Ron Dennis would have to balance both drivers to extract the best. The fireworks would come if one driver consistently beats the other.

jj2728 · 31 Jan 2005, 12:50 (Ref:1213736)

the montoya/kimi partnership has all the makings of a jones/reutteman or piquet/mansell partnership...no love lost between the 2 and if they can keep from punting each other off course then, if the past is any marker, quite a few race wins and possibly even a championship or 2....

Sodemo · 31 Jan 2005, 13:06 (Ref:1213754)

I really like Montoya and want him to do well, I just get a feeling he might be blown away by Kimi this year...

BSchneiderFan · 31 Jan 2005, 13:18 (Ref:1213766)

I think it's hard to argue that Raikkonen/Montoya is a better combination that Schumacher/Barrichello. After all, if you accuse Barrichello of inconsistency, the same charge could just as well be levelled at Montoya. So I think Ferrari have got the best pairing; and with Williams signing Heidfeld to partner Webber, they've got a pretty handy twosome as well.

Tweed · 31 Jan 2005, 13:20 (Ref:1213771)

I do feel they will be the strongest pairing this year, mainly because Barrichello lets Ferrari's line up down.

I don't think you can compare the partnership to Senna-Prost, because those two were clearly head and shoulders above the fireld anyway. Also, it was widely acknowledged that Senna was ultimately faster than Prost, but Prost was ( possibly ) a bit more canny. Raikkonen and Montoya are too similar in that respect, should be very interesting!

BootsOntheSide · 31 Jan 2005, 13:44 (Ref:1213789)

On paper this combination is stronger - Rubens has failed to get the best out of the Ferrari more than 3 or 4 times a season, whereas Montoya often wrestled the Williams to impressive positions last season. The only issue is that the Ferrari pairing always seems to work together, yet the McLaren guys might end up working against each other.

Inigo Montoya · 31 Jan 2005, 13:58 (Ref:1213797)

I think its very close between Ferrari, McLaren, and Renault for best driver pairing. Given the choice between Kimi/JPM and Fisi/Alonso, everyone who knows me, knows who I'd pick

Knowlesy · 31 Jan 2005, 17:23 (Ref:1213920)

McLaren have the strongest driver pairing on the grid. This is both good and bad. The main worry being that they'll take points off each other.

Compare that to the Ferrari situation where they have the hare (Michael) winning all the time and the carthorse (the other guy) coming in second and picking up meaningless scraps.

Whatever, I am very excited about McLaren with two drivers I have admired greatly over the past few years.

Kirk · 31 Jan 2005, 17:58 (Ref:1213949)

No question in my mind that the top 7 teams have the strongest line-up in years (if not ever) .... however it's still questionable whether the driver will make a significant difference. Fingers crossed that the new engine, aero and tyre rules will make strides in that direction. I hope to see some real wheel to wheel battles this year.

Knowlesy · 31 Jan 2005, 18:07 (Ref:1213958)

I think it's likely we'll have exactly the same amount of wheel to wheel action as any other year. A reasonable amount in other words, but not an abundance.

Marbot · 31 Jan 2005, 18:45 (Ref:1213992)

Quote:

Originally Posted by knowlesy

Compare that to the Ferrari situation where they have the hare (Michael) winning all the time and the carthorse (the other guy) coming in second and picking up meaningless scraps.

Just goes to show how good last years Ferrari was/is,when "the other guy" finished second in the WDC,had it not been for TGF however it might have been a close run thing.

I wonder how many other drivers would like to pick up those "meaningless scraps"

joe rossi · 31 Jan 2005, 20:06 (Ref:1214043)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirk

No question in my mind that the top 7 teams have the strongest line-up in years (if not ever) .... however it's still questionable whether the driver will make a significant difference. Fingers crossed that the new engine, aero and tyre rules will make strides in that direction. I hope to see some real wheel to wheel battles this year.

I think this is dead on..It will all come down to the car won't it? If the new Mac does the job, then both drivers will rise to the challenge. If the car misses the mark, then it won't matter much either way, but I expect Kimi to come out on top due to his longer experience at driving dodgy Macs!

mac · 31 Jan 2005, 21:36 (Ref:1214107)

Schumacher and Barrichello is the best driver line-up at the moment.

JPM and Kimi may work out well - it's certainly going to be very interesting to see them fight it out with Ferrari.

Providing McLaren can give them a car within 2 seconds of the red ones.

Also, I would just like to note that I am having a little giggle at those suggesting the Webber and Heidfeld combination cannot compete with the other top teams - I suspect by season's end that may be a gigantic belly laugh.

If you look past the hype of the McLaren duo, and take a peak at the actual achievements of the Williams pair over the last few years, you may understand why I feel the Williams duo can take it to any other team on the grid - providing they get the right equipment of course.

**Adam43** · 31 Jan 2005, 21:41 (Ref:1214112)

I think the Williams duo can cut it, however there are more unknowns there. This is just down to a lack of up front running. It is not a reason to write them off, but it means we can't categorically say they will be great. Others are right to wonder.

Marbot · 31 Jan 2005, 21:42 (Ref:1214113)

Quote:

Originally Posted by mac

Schumacher and Barrichello is the best driver line-up at the moment.

Especially from TGFs point of view.

mac · 31 Jan 2005, 22:02 (Ref:1214129)

The mere fact that Barrichello can occasionally match Michael's times is IMO good enough to elevate that partnership to numero uno.

Glen · 31 Jan 2005, 22:08 (Ref:1214138)

You are dead right Mac, in my opinion. Not holding a win is probably a difference, but as soon as either MW or NH, or preferably both, break their duck I don't think they'll have any trouble living at the top of the pack.

Skam85 · 31 Jan 2005, 22:58 (Ref:1214167)

Alonso and Trulli didn't have a win in 2003 and look how they went.

Raglanparade · 31 Jan 2005, 23:04 (Ref:1214170)

I seem to remember Alonso having a win in 2003. Maybe i was just dreaming.

BSchneiderFan · 31 Jan 2005, 23:07 (Ref:1214173)

Hungary, n'est-ce pas? Though I think Skam85 means that neither had won a race when they were paired at the beginning of the season.

Skam85 · 31 Jan 2005, 23:08 (Ref:1214175)

My bad, I meant, pre-2003 as in, before the season started. Should have specified that. Good example of my point though!

Sodemo · 1 Feb 2005, 00:01 (Ref:1214218)

Well both Montoya and Kimi were the only ones to challenge Micheal in 2003 for the title...

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