Bernie Ecclestone says F1 be sold this year.

[Mekola]

This man Bernie has selling F1 once in a five years in average!
And in all "sellings" he's still the Supremo.
Is like selling five or ten times the same car to different buyers.

[jimclark]

Originally Posted by Mekola

This man Bernie has selling F1 once in a five years in average!
And in all "sellings" he's still the Supremo.
Is like selling five or ten times the same car to different buyers.

I don't follow as closely as I used to but I don't remember BE selling, and re-acquiring his holdings. 'Links please, thanks....

[MoMedic9019]

Originally Posted by jimclark

I don't follow as closely as I used to but I don't remember BE selling, and re-acquiring his holdings. 'Links please, thanks....

It happened once. He owned it, sold it, and bought it back at a discount. He's going to get ousted this time around.

[BSchneiderFan]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

Peroni Nastro Azzurro has that Blue Ribbon quality.

That would be better, certainly. It's a better lager, too. Oh, to see the British GP sponsored by a heavy-duty scrumpy. The Old Rosie Grand Prix of Britain!

[cerdic]

The Silverstone Old Peculiar ...?

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by cerdic

The Silverstone Old Peculiar ...?

The Silverstone Old Peculiar 200.

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by MoMedic9019

It happened once. He owned it, sold it, and bought it back at a discount. He's going to get ousted this time around.

over the last few years with the trials and lack of transition planning, it really looked like BE's exit was going to be a juicy tabloid story and one that would demand a forced removal.

under the new ownership group it seems like the inevitable succession of power will be handled with some dignity.

i think the sport is fortunate that it has (apparently) avoided what would have been a messy and potentially destabilizing transition period.

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

over the last few years with the trials and lack of transition planning, it really looked like BE's exit was going to be a juicy tabloid story and one that would demand a forced removal.

under the new ownership group it seems like the inevitable succession of power will be handled with some dignity.

i think the sport is fortunate that it has (apparently) avoided what would have been a messy and potentially destabilizing transition period.

I think there is still yet room for major drama. However how much of that may play out in public is yet to be seen. I can't imagine the new owners wanting to maintain the status quo for three years. So they will be pushing through change that in effect will be "not the way BE would do it" and likely is going to grate upon him. Given his MOA, he will be public about his dissatisfaction. Not to mention that at the end of that time period they should not only have a successor lined up, but in the job and working. The job is likely only big enough for one ego of his size.

He will likely get paid for three years, but I say it is even odds he will see out his full three years "on the job".

Richard

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by Richard Casto

I think there is still yet room for major drama....

yeah i think i spoke too soon. lol

grandprix.com running a story that there is already toruble in paradise and abu dhabi might be BE's last race.

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns34774.html

[S griffin]

It seems someone finally has the guts to get rid of him. I only hope this new guy does for the good of the sport and doesn't try and introduce more gimmicks like reverse grids, chase for the cup or the blue shell

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

yeah i think i spoke too soon. lol

grandprix.com running a story that there is already toruble in paradise and abu dhabi might be BE's last race.

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns34774.html

Oh my!

Some quotes from the article...

But Germany's Auto Bild claims that Ecclestone, 85, and 75-year-old Malone may already have clashed, with the current F1 chief executive now set to vacate his role after November's season finale in Abu Dhabi.

Maybe it didn't take long!

The same report said Malone and Ferrari president Sergio Marchionne are also clashing, with the former wanting to end the fabled Italian team's special annual bonus payments.

"Sue me!" Malone is quoted as having told Marchionne during recent negotiations. "I have the time and the money."

Oh please let it be true! I know it's a controversial topic here, but I think the inequitable treatment of teams is a large problem with F1 today.

I can imagine Marchionne basically saying... "This is how things work around here" and Malone saying... "Not anymore."

Frankly, I can't even allow myself to believe this is true for fear it is not.

Richard

[wnut]

Liberty Media's main interest will be how good the show is, so they will not pander to engineering companies trying to push their own profits if they are denigrating the quality of the product.

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out.

Does anyone know who is advising Malone?

Interesting to see where the FIA and Mr Todt come into play.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by wnut

Liberty Media's main interest will be how good the show is, so they will not pander to engineering companies trying to push their own profits if they are denigrating the quality of the product.

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out.

Does anyone know who is advising Malone?

Interesting to see where the FIA and Mr Todt come into play.

Interesting, that there's been nothing from the FIA and Mr. Todt.

[jimclark]

I'm humble enough to admit I wouldn't have a clue how to run things. All I've got to say, which works in most cases, is to be careful what you wish for; you just might get it quite differently than you expected.

[Mike Harte]

To the best of my knowledge, this is not yet a done deal. Todt and the FIA have to agree the change of control, and have put out a statement to the effect that the proposal looks interesting, but they are awaiting more details. And, possibly more importantly, the sale has to be approved by the EU to ensure that it is not, or will not be, anti-competitive. And considering that the EU is already investigating the governance of F1 on two fronts, that approval may not be forthcoming.

There is still plenty of time for this to all fizzle out, just like the public offering in Singapore a few years back. But expect to see more "soundbites" as the major players jockey for position as top dog within the new proposed regime.

[wnut]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

To the best of my knowledge, this is not yet a done deal. Todt and the FIA have to agree the change of control, and have put out a statement to the effect that the proposal looks interesting, but they are awaiting more details. And, possibly more importantly, the sale has to be approved by the EU to ensure that it is not, or will not be, anti-competitive. And considering that the EU is already investigating the governance of F1 on two fronts, that approval may not be forthcoming.

There is still plenty of time for this to all fizzle out, just like the public offering in Singapore a few years back. But expect to see more "soundbites" as the major players jockey for position as top dog within the new proposed regime.

Why would you start in on Marchionne and Bernie if the ink hadn't dried on the contract though Mike?

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by wnut

Why would you start in on Marchionne and Bernie if the ink hadn't dried on the contract though Mike?

So that GrandPrix.com article seems to be actually based upon this Auto Bild article which adds a tiny bit of extra information...

http://www.autobild.de/artikel/forme...-10770509.html

According to Google translate, the conflict between Marchionne and Malone happened during prior negotiations and not after the deal was completed (at least prior to any pending governmental, etc. approval). I could be that Liberty has just been open as to their future intent prior to the deal closing and that involved parties such as Ferrari, etc. were somewhat involved in negotiations (either actively or as observers).

Richard

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

Todt and the FIA have to agree the change of control, and have put out a statement to the effect that the proposal looks interesting, but they are awaiting more details.

I would be shocked if they try to stop it. Mostly due to their history of not doing much of anything that requires strength of will.

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

And, possibly more importantly, the sale has to be approved by the EU to ensure that it is not, or will not be, anti-competitive. And considering that the EU is already investigating the governance of F1 on two fronts, that approval may not be forthcoming.

I know little about how the EU works with respect to approval of this type of thing and the status of any anti-competitive investigation. A bit of Google searching says that the EU couldn't investigate unless there was a complaint and the triggering complaint was via Force India and Sauber. Now I don't know if the investigation has a life of it's own at this point or is the investigation is still dependent upon the will of the complaintants? Can Force India and Sauber withdraw their complaint and make the investigation go away? If this leverage exists might they have done some negotiation directly with Liberty to extract concessions from Liberty? Some quid pro quo?

Here is another Auto Bild article that interviews Monisha Kaltenborn...

http://www.autobild.de/artikel/forme...-10766825.html

Via Google translate it has them asking Kaltenborn about a decision on the EU investigation with her saying "We are confident that it should come soon." Does she know something? Timing is interesting given pending Liberty purchase?

Clearly Liberty also is not blind to the investigation and may have heard in advance what moves on their end might help alleviate regulators concerns. This talk of challenging Ferrari's special payments, reducing costs of event tickets and more events in Europe are likely all things teams like Force India and Sauber plus the EU might consider to be good news. Additional reading also speaks to the issue that the FIA owns a 1% share in F1. That this could potentially be an issue, but more on the part of FIA and less for Liberty? Might the EU force FIA to sell their 1% and also frown upon the FIA if they decide to stop the sale?

Richard

[BSchneiderFan]

If Liberty wants more European races, I'm all in favour. Imola? Zandvoort? Somewhere in central or eastern Europe?

[Mike Harte]

Richard, you raise a number of good points, and I will try to answer as best as I know.

The complaint by FI and Sauber has been accepted by the EU, but the investigation hasn’t, to the best of my knowledge, started yet. In fact, the EU has been faced with so many complaints to deal with that they have now split the Investigations Department in two, one to look into commercial enterprises and the other into sports’ enterprises. F1 falls into the latter category.

I believe, although I am not 100% certain, that once a complaint is accepted, the complainant has little influence on the investigation apart from any evidence that they may be prevailed on to provide. Recent comments in the media in the last couple of months seem to indicate that the investigation is nearly ready to begin. However, apart from this investigation, the Competition Commissioner has decided that the EU needs to look into the certain specific parts of F1, in particular the relationship between the FIA and DeltaTopco (and/or other linked enterprises such as FOM). This is principally because when the FIA was forced by the EU to divest itself of the commercial interests in F1 (back in ’99? when BCE was granted the exclusive rights to the commercial side of F1), it was a condition that the FIA couldn’t have any pecuniary interest in the commercial side of F1, n or exercise any control of same.

Having broken the conditions of the agreement with the EU by accepting a free shareholding in DeltaTopco, and publically admitting that the FIA has to approve of any new controllers of the commercial interests over which they should not be in a position to exert control, I think it highly unlikely that the EU would allow the FIA to gain financially by selling their shareholding. I think it more likely that the EU will force the FIA to hand back their shareholding, and possibly forfeit any dividends/benefits received in the past.

As is usual in these types of commercial deals, they are subject to regulatory approval, in this case by the EU as it’s a monopoly which is headquarted within the EU.

The Ferrari part of the equation is complicated. Not only do they (historically) receive a larger slice of the financial pie than any other team (they receive almost as much as the combined portions of the lower teams), but they were also given a shareholding in DeltaTopco back when it was split off from the FIA. Whether they paid for that holding, I either don’t know or can’t remember.

Whatever, I would hazard a guess that Liberty are fully aware of all of these hurdles that need to be overcome, and that any “contract” that they may have entered into with other parties is also full of plenty of get out clauses! And that Liberty won’t be taking over until all those hurdles have been cleared.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by BSchneiderFan

If Liberty wants more European races, I'm all in favour. Imola? Zandvoort? Somewhere in central or eastern Europe?

Am I right in thinking Bernie/CVC pays for the teams travel costs?

[richy01908]

From what I have read, they pay the costs for the teams that finish in the top 10 in the Constructors championship, therefore team finishing 11th misses out, but think some other complication if at the bottom of finishing in top 10 2 out of 3 seasons?

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

Am I right in thinking Bernie/CVC pays for the teams travel costs?

On a sliding scale, but only for the top ten teams. It's quite perverse in that the teams that receive the highest "rewards" from FOM also get the most in travel concessions, with, I think, the top 5 teams receiving free freight for the fly-aways, with the other 5 receiving less.

I am not certain, but I don't think that FOM pays for team personnel. In fact, up until about 2007/8, many of the top teams used to charter their own executive jets for travelling for the top brass, as did a number of the top drivers. I believe that, currently, the only driver that has a chartered executive jet is Hamilton.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

On a sliding scale, but only for the top ten teams. It's quite perverse in that the teams that receive the highest "rewards" from FOM also get the most in travel concessions, with, I think, the top 5 teams receiving free freight for the fly-aways, with the other 5 receiving less.

I am not certain, but I don't think that FOM pays for team personnel. In fact, up until about 2007/8, many of the top teams used to charter their own executive jets for travelling for the top brass, as did a number of the top drivers. I believe that, currently, the only driver that has a chartered executive jet is Hamilton.

I was thinking maybe fewer fly away races, would reduce the costs and open the door to more European races. Bahrain doesn't seem to be on the 2017 calendar and the Chinese have threatened to quit before, because of the sanctioning fee.

[chillibowl]

neither here nor there but there is still a fraternity among the drivers in that some of them fly to the races together. a few months ago Hulk posted this awesome pic to his twitter page.

https://twitter.com/HulkHulkenberg/s...rc=twsrc%5Etfw

just going from memory but Coulthard is usually in these types of pics so im thinking its his charter or much more fun to believe is that he just hijacks the plane from Eddie Jordan and just leaves Jordan behind to wander around aimlessly in whatever country they have just left from!

but yeah, totally perverse how the travel allowance/benefits are unequally distributed and leave one team out in the cold.

as for the deal being ratified...to my understanding, the parties involved have all agreed in principle and a downpayment has been made. short of regulators blocking the deal, if Liberty, CVC, or any of the other signatories pull out now then i suspect they would face incredibly large financial penalties.

to me this is a done deal.

i would think that the EU looking into the FI/Sauber complaint is separate to the issue of the deal being ratified.

rather this EU ratification process would happen on any deal in which a non european media company attempted to increase its market share through buying european content.