the UK Driving Test - Is It Adequate?

[bella]

i think the only way to carry the hazard perception thing into the real world would be a running commentary from the candidate.

what they're probably looking for in the hesitation thing is fear of the road and other users more than anything. you can't fail someone for being scared of another car, but you can fail them for braking unnecessarily and all that.

like i say, i think the test should be marked differently. positive action should be taken into consideration.

[Suze]

You can press the button a number of times (it brings up a little flag at the bottom of the screen) so for example I remember I ended up with multiple flags. However when it first was brought out I believe there was a number of motoring journalists who sat there and just constantly clicked and all passed - now if you do click too frequently / quickly it makes that screen void I believe.

[Suze]

Originally Posted by bella

i think the only way to carry the hazard perception thing into the real world would be a running commentary from the candidate.

what they're probably looking for in the hesitation thing is fear of the road and other users more than anything. you can't fail someone for being scared of another car, but you can fail them for braking unnecessarily and all that.

It may sound silly, but sometimes if I'm in a situation I'm not confident in or maybe not as happy in, I will tell instructor / Sam what I'm doing - eg I will say ok I'm not quite sure but I am doing this because etc if it's not obvious.

Hope that makes sense!

[garcon]

Giving a running commentary is a very good idea.

In advanced courses/tests it's expected. It also helps you organise your own thoughts and teaches you to deal with things in the right order.

[garcon]

Originally Posted by chezza

Good idea Garc, I had thought about it myself, but cba to filter all the posts out!

Can't take all the credit... someone else did the hard work, I just moved it!

[Peter Mallett]

me.

[terence]

Originally Posted by Suze

The mirrors thing is something I struggle with - I check them often, but was always criticised by intructor for not making it obvious enough - and that frustrates me.

Being cautious (but safe) is very different from being very hesitant and you're def right it's better than going out all guns blazing!

Have you tried moving the mirrors just enough to make it awkward not to move your head?

[terence]

Originally Posted by garcon

Giving a running commentary is a very good idea.

In advanced courses/tests it's expected. It also helps you organise your own thoughts and teaches you to deal with things in the right order.

If you dont give a running commentary in IAM you dont pass.

[terence]

just dont understand this concentrating on the car in front, its the cars that are three or four in front where the problems arise,the one in front is the one you hit because you were not looking far enough ahead!!Running commentary,motorway and highspeed should be much more of the test than they are at the moment.Highspeed on motorways[legal of course] and teaching to position just to the right of the car in front,so that you can see whats happening infront etc.

[bella]

i have actually driven into the back of someone by not concentrating on the car in front, so there is some merit for looking at it at least

[luke]

Originally Posted by bella

i have actually driven into the back of someone by not concentrating on the car in front, so there is some merit for looking at it at least

Why? Were you doing your make up in the mirror bella?

[Suze]

Originally Posted by terence bower

Have you tried moving the mirrors just enough to make it awkward not to move your head?

When I look I glance in the mirrors - my eyes move but head doesn't - presuming you have a license here so don't know how it would've been when you learnt, but my instructor had an additional mirror which was looking at me or whoever else was driving the car in order to watch facial expressions and eyes.

The difficulty is, the way I do it, whilst I am aware of what is going on around me as I glance, the examiner or whoever can't be expected to look in that mirror the whole time to see where I'm looking. Therefore, there is the risk of them thinking I haven't checked my mirrors as they hadn't seen my eyes move, which is why it's suggested you move your head whereas infact I almost certainly have checked my mirrors.

[Peter Mallett]

bella you look at the cars ahead of the one in front, but leave space for reaction time in an emergency.

[garcon]

Terence - yes indeed. Though when I did it they didn't automatically expect you to give the commentary for the whole drive. I think I did, but only as a tool for beating the nerves (still forgot my brake checks though!).

That reminds me - must see if I've still got the examiner's marking sheet. Apart from one minor steering slip I think the brake checks were the only thing I did wrong (or rather, just didn't do). He described it as a "very professional drive".

That's over ten years ago now - high time I did a refresher and some serious advanced training with HPC or Drivetrain.

bella - I'm guessing you weren't concentrating on the car in front of that either...

I very nearly got caught out doing something similar - I was looking across a bend to check for oncoming traffic, and looked back just in time to realise the car in front that I'd been planning to overtake had stopped to turn into a drive... (ABS really works y'know...!)

[chezza]

Suze, I had a similar problem and was told also when I wore sunglasses (learnt in the middle of summer) to make my mirror looking more obvious as he couldn't see my eyes clearly. Surely if your concentrating on making your looks more obvious your not concentrating on something else.

[MikeHoyer]

Originally Posted by racing59

So why not restrict newbies to cars under 70hp until their 20, then let them have 120hp to 25. By then they should have calmed down a bit, or taken up motorsport.....

Rob.

I don't think that this would really have that much effect - for a start most under-20's can't afford a powerful car, due to insurance etc., so most of them are probably driving 1.1, 1.2 shopping trolleys anyway. These things can still easily do 70mph+, and can still crash. I crashed my Clio (75bhp) when I was 25, in a bit of a freak accident, so I don't think age/horsepower makes much difference.

[Suze]

I'm sure we're not the only two either, reckon there are a lot of people who do that!

I have had the situation where trying to concentrate on making that so obvious means your attention is diverted from something else, but I'm not sure how you can get away from that as after all the examiner is trying to make sure you do the right thing as well.

Only suggestion is you have to have someone in back of car watching mirror the whole time but not sure would want to be examined by two people instead of one and may just make it more expensive as well!



[edit to add to Mike's point]

FWIW I am under 20 and drive a 1400 which would only describe as a shopping trolley.

[garcon]

The problem with restricting young drivers to small, low powered cars is that these cars don't fare too well in the inevitable accident. The power of the car just dictates how big the accident's gonna be.


(Yes, that's somewhat oversimplified, but you get my point).

[MikeHoyer]

Personally I think that's only relevant if you have an accident from a fast acceleration into something. Like if you drove a Porsche into a brick wall you could do a lot of damage, but in your 1 litre Corsa you might realise the wall was coming and have time to stop...

If you have an accident at 30mph, it's the same speed regardless of car.

There is also the argument that a car with better acceleration makes it easier to move out of the way of a potential accident...

[garcon]

Originally Posted by MikeHoyer

There is also the argument that a car with better acceleration makes it easier to move out of the way of a potential accident...

...but only if you have the skill/experience to know how to.

Fair points otherwise. Except that the majority of young driver accidents involve no other vehicle and are simply due to losing control of the car, often on rural roads... something which is inevitably exacerbated the more powerful the car is. i.e. in the more powerful car you can be going an awful lot quicker when you misjudge the bend.

[Suze]

The money one is a big factor though - I bought a 1400 because a) I had to pay for it myself and I couldn't afford any bigger (I wasn't looking for a 1400 specifically, just what I ended up with) and b) the insurance - it's very expensive!

I think a fair amount of other people u25 or however you want to look at it are in lower powered cars because of money - though it hasn't stopped quite a few people I was at sixth form with writing them off - and yes, all the ones I know that have been written off were on rural country roads where they'd lost control of the car.

[garcon]

Yes, fortunately the cars driven by most teenagers are dictated by financial restraints.

Unfortunately, rich kids ain't any better at driving...

[touringlegend]

When I was learning to drive the point my instructor got onto me about was only moving my eyes - I made sure from then I moved my head all the time - about every 5 seconds or so! Took about 10 lessons and passed first time though. ,

The difference between limiting bikes and limiting cars is the larger bikes can go very very fast, whereas a car with say 120hp won't be that much faster than something with 90, relatively speaking.

[Peter Mallett]

There used to be a field in Runfold with a permanent gap in the hedge. It was on our way home from the Ram Cider House in Godalming.

I know of at least three cars that went through there.

[garcon]

When you say "know of" ...