Castroneves Sets Unofficial Track Record at the Glen

Tim Northcutt · 2 Jun 2005, 13:32 (Ref:1318056)

On Tuesday, Penske and Ganassi cars ran laps at Watkins Glen in a closed test held by the IRL to assess the safety changes made to the course, and to give WG additional ideas for revisions prior to their Sept. visit to the famed road course...

(BTW...many teams wil test there in mid-June)

However, the interesting news is that Castroneves was unofficially clocked on a lap that set a new track record for the Glen...

It barely topped a time set back in 1980 by an F-1 car...

This lap was captured on a stopwatch, and not with formal timing gear, but it speaks volumes about how far these cars have come in such a short time with the road packages that were created for this year...

Tim Northcutt · 2 Jun 2005, 13:38 (Ref:1318060)

Forgot to list the time:

Penske's crew clocked him at 1:33.1, for a lap speed of more than 130 mph.

The track record is 1:33.291, set in 1980 by F-1 polesitter Bruno Giacomelli in an Alfa Romeo at the 1980 US Grand Prix.

The result was reported by a writer with the Elmira Star-Gazette from an interview with one of the officials at the track.

Kicking-back · 2 Jun 2005, 13:46 (Ref:1318071)

Was the 1980 Grand Prix on the same track configuration?

rustyfan · 2 Jun 2005, 13:47 (Ref:1318072)

Big test set for mid-June you say? Can't wait - been wanting to see some images of both the cars out on track as well as the changes made to the track for some time now

Tim Northcutt · 2 Jun 2005, 13:49 (Ref:1318074)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kicking-back

Was the 1980 Grand Prix on the same track configuration?

Yes...the 3.4 mile circuit with "The Boot"

Raglanparade · 2 Jun 2005, 13:57 (Ref:1318082)

Wasnt there a little chicane tho thru the esses in 1980 ????

I dont think thats there anymore.

rustyfan · 2 Jun 2005, 13:58 (Ref:1318083)

Watkins Glen has to be one of the very few tracks in the world that has remained unaltered for so long - the current layout was finalized in 1971, and hasn't changed since (with the exception of the Inner Loop used by NASCAR of course, but I don't think the IndyCars will use that?).

rustyfan · 2 Jun 2005, 14:00 (Ref:1318086)

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasonhill9884

Wasnt there a little chicane tho thru the esses in 1980 ????

I dont think thats there anymore.

Hm, now that you mention it, yeah, I seem to recall seeing images of a chicane (where several drivers went for pretty wild airborne rides after hitting the big curbs). Had completely forgotten about that one, but I don't know any specific details about it.

Tim Northcutt · 2 Jun 2005, 14:03 (Ref:1318091)

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasonhill9884

Wasnt there a little chicane tho thru the esses in 1980 ????

I dont think thats there anymore.

There was, but the Inner Loop was not there in the F-1 Course that is there now... which is an extended set of two chicanes 2/3 of the way down the backstretch... the backstretch....

Go to www.racingcircuits.net and look up Watkins Glen to compare the two....

rustyfan · 2 Jun 2005, 14:10 (Ref:1318098)

The Inner Loop was added in 1992 after J.D. McDuffie's fatal crash in 1991.

netfindr · 3 Jun 2005, 13:54 (Ref:1319052)

Having just returned sunday from flagging the skip barber races there, i can say all will like the changes there so far. As far as the track record, it can't be compared with the old chicane that the f1 guys ran @ the start of the esses. Though it's ashpalt still exists there today. From all the alterations that they did to runoff and rumbles, i am not surprised that they are running laps as fast as those old f1 cars.

rustyfan · 3 Jun 2005, 14:04 (Ref:1319066)

Quote:

Originally Posted by netfindr

Having just returned sunday from flagging the skip barber races there, i can say all will like the changes there so far. As far as the track record, it can't be compared with the old chicane that the f1 guys ran @ the start of the esses. Though it's ashpalt still exists there today. From all the alterations that they did to runoff and rumbles, i am not surprised that they are running laps as fast as those old f1 cars.

Welcome to the forum!

Now you have made me even more interested in seeing what the changes look like. I don't reckon there are any photos etc available online from said Skip Barber races?

netfindr · 3 Jun 2005, 14:07 (Ref:1319072)

Exit of 1

Exit of 11

Middle Of the Esses - Just past old f1-chicane

I worked these corners on sat and sun
Example of how they have changed the rumble strips

Most of the runoff area was paved, for example turn 1 was paved and raised 4ft above the track. Turn 11 had it's runoff paved, and straightened. As you can see in the middle picture the wall in the esses was moved back about 10-25ft further from the track so the driver now can see further thru the corner too. The foam has been replaced by tires wrapped in a straight piece of rubber, or so it looks. Over the car tunnels and other strategic areas, the fences were raised to i'd estimate 15ft, and curved gently toward the track (sorta like indy's fences). I hope this gives a rough idea of what's changed.

I realized after i posted i should provide some pictures, and i took too long researching.

Here's some shots my buddy and his wife took while we were there. I'm the one wearing the nextel cup series hat.
http://www.kodakgallery.com/Slidesho...e&conn_speed=1

Tim Northcutt · 3 Jun 2005, 14:09 (Ref:1319076)

Welcome to the Forum!!!!

Question...

Do we know if they (IRL) were running the Inner Loop???

Just curious....

But the changes DO look nice!!!

netfindr · 3 Jun 2005, 14:13 (Ref:1319078)

I believe all series that run there run the inner loop now for safety reasons, but i can check that out for ya when i go back for grand-am. I can remember on sat and sunday those little cars where rather racey thru there. I can remember 2-wide thru there quite a few times, and 4 wide heading into there.

rustyfan · 3 Jun 2005, 14:23 (Ref:1319093)

Excellent pics!

netfindr · 3 Jun 2005, 14:33 (Ref:1319108)

Thanks, but the ones that are shown are taken directly from http://www.formuladodge.com If you read the stories of the race(s), theres one with a half-hour stoppage. I was on that station when it happened, and all i can say is it was a totaled race car. The driver was un-hurt though.

Snrub · 3 Jun 2005, 17:52 (Ref:1319313)

I'm not to take anything away from what it took to make the cars road course compatible, but I wouldn't be praising the ability of the cars to meet 1980 F1 standards as some sort of feat. Up until the late 90s-2000 F1 and Champ Car were pretty close in speed. Champ Car today is fairly close to the speeds from back then and IRL cars are a couple of seconds a lap slower than that. My point is that we could also point to a IRL lap as being faster than Nascar. That's not impressive, that's expected.

luke · 3 Jun 2005, 18:00 (Ref:1319316)

Nice circuit it may be, and the shorter circuit defiantely suits NASCAR, but will there be much room for overtaking and the same with Sears Point?

Both seem tight and twisty to me, and I know the IRL is using the full versions.

Tim Northcutt · 3 Jun 2005, 18:21 (Ref:1319344)

Watkins geln is anything but tight and twisty....

Sears Point...Yes....

The Glen.....a great race circuit....a very fast circuit....

The speed of that lap time was 130 mph....that is not a slow road course....at least not for North America...

luke · 3 Jun 2005, 18:26 (Ref:1319346)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Northcutt

Watkins geln is anything but tight and twisty....

Sears Point...Yes....

The Glen.....a great race circuit....a very fast circuit....

The speed of that lap time was 130 mph....that is not a slow road course....at least not for North America...

I only know the Watkins Glen NASCAR circuit though but surely the back strech wouldn't be that long for IRL cars to make a pass, especially at 130mph laps.

I just personaly can't see any overtaking opportunties.

Tim Northcutt · 3 Jun 2005, 18:37 (Ref:1319358)

The Glen has plenty of places to pass...and the action will be good there.....

BTW, Luke....

I've been tied up on some projects, but I'll send you what you asked for in your PM if you will send me your actual e-mail address so that I can attach it to an e-mail for you...

GP Racer · 3 Jun 2005, 18:52 (Ref:1319370)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snrub

I'm not to take anything away from what it took to make the cars road course compatible, but I wouldn't be praising the ability of the cars to meet 1980 F1 standards as some sort of feat. Up until the late 90s-2000 F1 and Champ Car were pretty close in speed. Champ Car today is fairly close to the speeds from back then and IRL cars are a couple of seconds a lap slower than that. My point is that we could also point to a IRL lap as being faster than Nascar. That's not impressive, that's expected.

IMO, speed is not the most important factor here anyway.

What matter's, at least to me, is that the cars are set-up so they can race close, and make passes. I'll give up a few seconds a lap and a few MPH to see that. While not as fast as CC or F1 cars, the IRL cars have proven very adept at at being able to set themselves behind other cars, then out-brake, and make the pass at St. Pete. That's something that the super-quick F1 cars only rarely seem to accomplish these days...

luke · 3 Jun 2005, 19:26 (Ref:1319401)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Northcutt

The Glen has plenty of places to pass...and the action will be good there.....

BTW, Luke....

I've been tied up on some projects, but I'll send you what you asked for in your PM if you will send me your actual e-mail address so that I can attach it to an e-mail for you...

No problem, Thanks Tim.

Baritone2400 · 23 Jun 2005, 19:22 (Ref:1338606)

i Just can't wait :beer;

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