2010 Bathurst 12 hour

[bluesport]

Originally Posted by 6.213km

I noticed during the race the narrow rear track on the new FG. Is this to bring it in line with the VE / BF or something ? If nothing else it makes it look weird.... At the track its very noticeable and looks bizarre - handling looked ok though...

Stock standard FG utes look strange and ugly rear of the cab.

[mtpanorama]

Originally Posted by 6.213km

I noticed during the race the narrow rear track on the new FG. Is this to bring it in line with the VE / BF or something ? If nothing else it makes it look weird.... At the track its very noticeable and looks bizarre - handling looked ok though...

The rear was slightly "modified" also after practice when Elsegood had a minor touch with the tyre wall. The tubs tend top pop right above the wheeel arches.

[toby]

Doesn't the amount of boost they are allowed to run equal what they have as standard road cars ie Evo X must have more boost standard than an Evo IX or Subaru.

[ForumNick]

Originally Posted by 6.213km

I noticed during the race the narrow rear track on the new FG. Is this to bring it in line with the VE / BF or something ? If nothing else it makes it look weird.... At the track its very noticeable and looks bizarre - handling looked ok though...

Looks like an XA/XB/XC 'SuperBird' with 5 1/2" standard rims !!!!!!

[Morris Dancer]

After yet another miniscule spectator attendance - two men and a dog, and the dog was only there to keep the men in, as the late Frank Gardner used to say - for a 'production touring' race, it's high time that the organisers realised that high-performance cars like Evos, BMWs etc. will never draw a crowd.

The race in its current form is just an ego trip for wealthy amateur racers who put talented co-drivers in their high-performance cars to make themselves look good.

Production touring car racing should be for mass-produced (ie. at least 10,000 registered in the preceding year; possibly pro-rata for six months to allow for recent releases) 'base' models (eg. Commodore Omegas and Falcon XTs). Then it could be promoted as a real 'showroom showdown', just like the Phillip Island/Bathurst 500-mile races in the early-1960s.

Properly organised and promoted, it would have to be more successful than the current race - and eventually maybe even rival the 1000km V8 Supercar event!

Otherwise it's only a matter of time until Bathurst Council decides that the economic return, which can't be very big, doesn't justify the noise and inconvenience to the residents who live near the circuit.

[gwg1010]

Originally Posted by Morris Dancer

After yet another miniscule spectator attendance - two men and a dog, and the dog was only there to keep the men in, as the late Frank Gardner used to say - for a 'production touring' race, it's high time that the organisers realised that high-performance cars like Evos, BMWs etc. will never draw a crowd.

The race in its current form is just an ego trip for wealthy amateur racers who put talented co-drivers in their high-performance cars to make themselves look good.

Production touring car racing should be for mass-produced (ie. at least 10,000 registered in the preceding year; possibly pro-rata for six months to allow for recent releases) 'base' models (eg. Commodore Omegas and Falcon XTs). Then it could be promoted as a real 'showroom showdown', just like the Phillip Island/Bathurst 500-mile races in the early-1960s.

Properly organised and promoted, it would have to be more successful than the current race - and eventually maybe even rival the 1000km V8 Supercar event!

Otherwise it's only a matter of time until Bathurst Council decides that the economic return, which can't be very big, doesn't justify the noise and inconvenience to the residents who live near the circuit.

I think the rules are just about right as it is. I hope your not knocking the winners because they were not driving a Holden or Ford. The reality is it took an experienced and talented crew with a lot of support and a 6 litre engined Holden to get into the top five. Im sure a 135i with the same support and drivers would have put daylight between them and the rest of the field.

[Sheep Stations]

Originally Posted by Morris Dancer

After yet another miniscule spectator attendance - two men and a dog, and the dog was only there to keep the men in, as the late Frank Gardner used to say - for a 'production touring' race, it's high time that the organisers realised that high-performance cars like Evos, BMWs etc. will never draw a crowd.

The race in its current form is just an ego trip for wealthy amateur racers who put talented co-drivers in their high-performance cars to make themselves look good.

Production touring car racing should be for mass-produced (ie. at least 10,000 registered in the preceding year; possibly pro-rata for six months to allow for recent releases) 'base' models (eg. Commodore Omegas and Falcon XTs). Then it could be promoted as a real 'showroom showdown', just like the Phillip Island/Bathurst 500-mile races in the early-1960s.

Properly organised and promoted, it would have to be more successful than the current race - and eventually maybe even rival the 1000km V8 Supercar event!

Otherwise it's only a matter of time until Bathurst Council decides that the economic return, which can't be very big, doesn't justify the noise and inconvenience to the residents who live near the circuit.

What a lot of cynical tripe. You can the event for low crowd attendance as if it's the be-all-end-all and substitute it with a suggested format of vehicle inclusion so boring and lacking any motorsport interest as to be a fail-safe cure for insomnia? Very original I guess...

Track hire, full restaurants, catering, accomodation, transport, contract work etc etc...I think Bathurst and its council do very nicely out of the 12 hour thanks very much.

[Alan52]

The "Morris Dancer" Production formula was actually in place for the Australian championship from 1990 to 1994.It was reasonably successful at the time but no more than the current formula.Any Commodore /Falcon formula is always going to look like a poor cousin of V8 Supercars while doing nothing to interest the numbers of motoring people who see the big Australian cars as dinosaurs for knuckle draggers.The 12 Hour race is basically competitor funded and future commercial growth is more likely to come as a result of TV coverage than spectators at the track whilever the race has a start time before 9am.As one of the "2 men and a dog" at the past 4 12 Hours (not to mention the 91-94 versions of the race) I can say that it is one of the most interesting days of the motorsport year in Australiaand I hope it continues for long into the future with the current eligibility list philosophy (give or take the turbo boost rules).

[bluesport]

With the weather conditions prevailing that weekend any sporting event would only attract "2 men and a dog".

[Oldtony]

I'm just enough of a snob to hope it never attracts the V8SC crowd. Maybe as many people, but certainly not THAT crowd.
Personaly I think the regs are about right, but I'm not sure if the "Invitation" class is a good feature. The Armstrong/Gallagher/Hardie etc era did include the higher performance cars of thier era. A 220S Merc in those days was looked upon as very exotic"and a Studebaker Lark was virtually police only equipment.
What the early races had was a "class by price" system. These days perhaps economy and price could be looked at in setting classes to make it more showroom relevant.
What the EvoX turbo episode would seem to indicate is the need for much closer examination of homologation papers to rule out anomolies.
This man and his dog missed out this year but I'll be hard to keep away next year. Meanwhile the future of the event is very much in the hands of the cut and edit people at Ch7 who are putting together the 3hr Highlight package.

[Holly Wood]

I think we've already seen the future Tony.

The future is live web streaming for niche interest events such as these...

[alfacors]

And live streaming for the Shannons Nationals rounds all through 2010 too!

[Morris Dancer]

Originally Posted by Sheep Stations

What a lot of cynical tripe. You can the event for low crowd attendance as if it's the be-all-end-all and substitute it with a suggested format of vehicle inclusion so boring and lacking any motorsport interest as to be a fail-safe cure for insomnia? Very original I guess...

Track hire, full restaurants, catering, accomodation, transport, contract work etc etc...I think Bathurst and its council do very nicely out of the 12 hour thanks very much.

This post (and other recent ones like it) show that some motorsport enthusiasts have no grasp of the commercial realities – and political realities in the case of races held on public road courses like Mount Panorama – of major events like the Bathurst 12-Hour.

A 'headline' event must attract significant public interest (ie. a decent raceday crowd and 'live' free-to-air TV coverage) to survive more than a few years.

No business worth the name will fork out thousands of sponsorship dollars for a race that's watched by just a few hundred paying spectators, several thousand online streaming viewers (many of whom probably don’t live in the sponsors' target market locations), and maybe 10-20,000 viewers of the delayed TV highlights package.

I understand, from a reliable source, that most of the 'sponsorship' of at least one Bathurst 12-Hour outright contender comprised contra deals and favours for the car owner's business suppliers. Hardly a dollar changed hands.

Race promoters need lots of 'bums on seats' to pay the considerable expenses involved in running the event and to show sponsors that their expensive signs are being seen by many potential customers – not just farm animals.

Local business income from teams, officials and other race visitors aren't enough for the Bathurst Council, which has the final say on the events held at Mount Panorama, to justify the noise and inconvenience to its constituents.

As for the bad weather affecting this year's spectator attendance, the race – like the other recent Bathurst production touring car enduros – has never drawn a decent crowd even in fine weather.

If people are interested in an event they'll come - rain, hail or shine.

There have been plenty of well-attended motor racing meetings held in appalling weather. The 1969 Calder one-hour production touring car race (in which Bob Jane in an 'uncompetitive' Monaro 350 fitted with Kleber road tyres splashed to victory over Alan Moffat's factory Falcon GT) and the 1974 Hardie-Ferodo 1000 (in which 'co-driver' Kevin Bartlett made John Goss look much better than he was) spring to mind.

History lesson:

The high-end imported cars that competed in the early Armstrong/Gallagher 500s at Phillip Island/Bathurst spelt the demise of those races as true 'showroom showdowns' for average car-buyers.

'Bathurst specials' took over until the 1972 'Supercar' controversy, which effectively killed Series Production Touring Car racing for almost 20 years.

The 1980s Production Touring Car rules, which permitted sporty cars like the Mazda RX7 and Commore VL turbo, never attracted a worthwhile public following.

It wasn't until the 1990 Production Touring Car formula, which was designed around 6-cylinder Commodores and Falcons, that real 'Series Production' touring car racing reappeared. It had the right ingredients but never took off because the promotion was left to CAMS, which like any government wouldn't know a good marketing concept if it jumped up and bit it on the bum.

If CAMS had restricted the category to mass-produced base models all along it would have kept its credibility with the car-buying public - and probably still be around today. But, racing drivers being racing drivers, they just couldn't leave well enough alone.

Production touring car racing must have classes, but they should be based on the car industry's recognised size-based categories (ie. light, small, medium and large) and not purchase prices. Car buyers tend to consider size before price.

The fact remains that races dominated by Porsches, Audis, BMWs, Evos and the like have never been – and will never be – popular with Australian motorsport fans. Group A and Super Touring both flopped for that very reason.

There's room for a 'high-performance' production touring car category, but it should be for mass-produced variants (eg. like turbo 6-cylinder or V8 XT Falcons, and Commodore SS V8), not tiny-volume ones like Evos, Stis and 335is. These cars should race separately from the base models because they appeal to a different market.

Motorsport has a place for limited edition semi-exotic production touring cars. It’s called club racing.

If the Bathurst 12-Hour continues to allow high-performance cars to compete then history will repeat itself - maybe not next year, but within a couple of years at the most. The promoters are dreaming if they think the race will ever be popular in its current format.

[gwg1010]

Originally Posted by Morris Dancer

This post (and other recent ones like it) show that some motorsport enthusiasts have no grasp of the commercial realities – and political realities in the case of races held on public road courses like Mount Panorama – of major events like the Bathurst 12-Hour.

A 'headline' event must attract significant public interest (ie. a decent raceday crowd and 'live' free-to-air TV coverage) to survive more than a few years.

No business worth the name will fork out thousands of sponsorship dollars for a race that's watched by just a few hundred paying spectators, several thousand online streaming viewers (many of whom probably don’t live in the sponsors' target market locations), and maybe 10-20,000 viewers of the delayed TV highlights package.

I understand, from a reliable source, that most of the 'sponsorship' of at least one Bathurst 12-Hour outright contender comprised contra deals and favours for the car owner's business suppliers. Hardly a dollar changed hands.

Race promoters need lots of 'bums on seats' to pay the considerable expenses involved in running the event and to show sponsors that their expensive signs are being seen by many potential customers – not just farm animals.

Local business income from teams, officials and other race visitors aren't enough for the Bathurst Council, which has the final say on the events held at Mount Panorama, to justify the noise and inconvenience to its constituents.

As for the bad weather affecting this year's spectator attendance, the race – like the other recent Bathurst production touring car enduros – has never drawn a decent crowd even in fine weather.

If people are interested in an event they'll come - rain, hail or shine.

There have been plenty of well-attended motor racing meetings held in appalling weather. The 1969 Calder one-hour production touring car race (in which Bob Jane in an 'uncompetitive' Monaro 350 fitted with Kleber road tyres splashed to victory over Alan Moffat's factory Falcon GT) and the 1974 Hardie-Ferodo 1000 (in which 'co-driver' Kevin Bartlett made John Goss look much better than he was) spring to mind.

History lesson:

The high-end imported cars that competed in the early Armstrong/Gallagher 500s at Phillip Island/Bathurst spelt the demise of those races as true 'showroom showdowns' for average car-buyers.

'Bathurst specials' took over until the 1972 'Supercar' controversy, which effectively killed Series Production Touring Car racing for almost 20 years.

The 1980s Production Touring Car rules, which permitted sporty cars like the Mazda RX7 and Commore VL turbo, never attracted a worthwhile public following.

It wasn't until the 1990 Production Touring Car formula, which was designed around 6-cylinder Commodores and Falcons, that real 'Series Production' touring car racing reappeared. It had the right ingredients but never took off because the promotion was left to CAMS, which like any government wouldn't know a good marketing concept if it jumped up and bit it on the bum.

If CAMS had restricted the category to mass-produced base models all along it would have kept its credibility with the car-buying public - and probably still be around today. But, racing drivers being racing drivers, they just couldn't leave well enough alone.

Production touring car racing must have classes, but they should be based on the car industry's recognised size-based categories (ie. light, small, medium and large) and not purchase prices. Car buyers tend to consider size before price.

The fact remains that races dominated by Porsches, Audis, BMWs, Evos and the like have never been – and will never be – popular with Australian motorsport fans. Group A and Super Touring both flopped for that very reason.

There's room for a 'high-performance' production touring car category, but it should be for mass-produced variants (eg. like turbo 6-cylinder or V8 XT Falcons, and Commodore SS V8), not tiny-volume ones like Evos, Stis and 335is. These cars should race separately from the base models because they appeal to a different market.

Motorsport has a place for limited edition semi-exotic production touring cars. It’s called club racing.

If the Bathurst 12-Hour continues to allow high-performance cars to compete then history will repeat itself - maybe not next year, but within a couple of years at the most. The promoters are dreaming if they think the race will ever be popular in its current format.

This sounds like someone wants another V8 supercar category only with 6 cylinder engines. the reason I dont go to Bathurst to watch the 1000 is because it is restricted to two different vehicles, I wont say makes because they dont even look like the cars they represent.
The organisers have done well by having a race that allows different makes to compete and I will support that. i dont want this event to turn into a Holden versus Ford race like some do.

[bluesport]

Originally Posted by gwg1010

This sounds like someone wants another V8 supercar category only with 6 cylinder engines. the reason I dont go to Bathurst to watch the 1000 is because it is restricted to two different vehicles, I wont say makes because they dont even look like the cars they represent.
The organisers have done well by having a race that allows different makes to compete and I will support that. i dont want this event to turn into a Holden versus Ford race like some do.

I'd go to the B12hr but not the B1000.......it's a shame that it has to be held in February though......too hot.

[mildura1963]

Bro...the 90's Prod car racing with only the Fords/Holdens & a Camry from memory were not well supported by spectators or competitors alike...it was better supported in the 80's when the Rx-7, Starion, Cordia, BMW & a Rover were running around (good quality drivers too).

[davidmcomau]

Hi guys, I'm from the Bathurst SES and am just wondering if many people got some good photos of the tree that fell on the track. If anyone has any they'd like to share, could you email me at davidm@davidm.com.au?

Don't worry, they won't be used for promotion etc unless you provide permission.

Thanks

[Oldtony]

Morris Dancer if you want production touring car racing to reflect the market it is time to get away from this Commodore/Falcon fixation
In January of this ear 74864 vehicles were sold in Australia of which only 3241 were Commodores and 2318 Falcons. Together the 2 of them made up just 7.4% of the Australian market. In fact they accounted for around one third of Holden and Ford sales.
Some top 10 figures by Model:
Commodore 3241
Mazda3 3223
Hilux 2997
Corolla 2711
Falcon 2318
Cruze 2218
Hyundai I30 2116
Hyundai Getz 1717
Lancer 1588
Yaris 1562
By Marque:
Toyota 14564
Holden 10468
Ford 6730
Mazda 6658
Hyundai 6208
Nissan 4144
Mitsubishi 4040
Subaru 3260
Honda 3006
VW 2337
By Country of Manufacture:
Japan 26311
Korea 13130
Thailand 10777
Australia 9741

The Mitsu Evo is just as legitimate as the performance variant of a mass selling model as the HSV or FPV models. Same goes for the WRX.
BMW while not in the top 10 are certainly a big part of the market as are VAG with VW/Audi/Skoda. I would have a guess that there are probably more road registered 335i BMWs in Australia than there are R8Clubsport waggons.
The car buying public, particularly in the enthusiast segment most likely to be influence4d by racing, is buying a whole range of cars. A Showroom showdown should reflect that wide variety.
When we talk production touring please let's concentrate on getting more manufacturers and importers involved, not trying to limit it to another Taxifest.

[Richard Craill]

No business worth the name will fork out thousands of sponsorship dollars for a race that's watched by just a few hundred paying spectators, several thousand online streaming viewers (many of whom probably don’t live in the sponsors' target market locations), and maybe 10-20,000 viewers of the delayed TV highlights package.

However, it is interesting to note that clearly ArmorAll did just that and were very pleased with the results!

Every indication is that they will return next year. That stability will in turn give the event a better base on which to market itself, draw more people through the gate and on TV and offer more value to the sponsor who will then ideally re-sign again allowing the event to get an even better base.... and so on..

Another example is the GT3 Cup Challenge. They recently signed Mission foods as a presenting sponsor. This deal was signed with the knowledge that attendance at GT3 Cup Challenge (Shannons Nationals) rounds was not 'substantial' (a few thousand per round) and that the main push of the exposure terms of the deal come via value-for-money Television, Public and Media releations and not from having events where 50,000 people turn up to watch. If this is what they wanted they would go the V8s and be paying about five to ten times as much.

And yet they see value in doing what they are doing and I can tell you 100% that they will get bang for their buck. My point is that it does not take a big crowd at the circuit to sell sponsorship.

Sure, it doesn't help, but it's not the be-all and end all. Creative people will find ways of offering value in other departments.

Sponsorship these days is about offering a legitimate B2B return on investmenet as much as it is delivering big crowds and TV ratings. Sure, they go hand in hand, but it's not the be all and end all as you suggest.

Your point that 'most of the 'sponsorship' of at least one Bathurst 12-Hour outright contender comprised contra deals and favours for the car owner's business suppliers. Hardly a dollar changed hands.' is a fair observation but it should not a commentary on the event itself.

How does this support your argument that the event will not succeed in it's current state? I can list 30 combinations in that race that were funded by pay drivers, contra sponsorship, or enthuaiast owners chipping in. That's the essence of production car racing and it's (relative) affordability allows this to occur.

I would guess that 80% of the funding for Garry Holt's BMW comes from Holty himself or his business, Eastern Creek Karts. I'm sure he would love a major sponsor and is trying all the time to get one. But if he choses to run self-funded, how does that change the event? This occurs in all categories around the world, including Formula one.

And yet, on the flipside, you have TMR announcing a major deal with a significant corporate presence in Pedigree. Companies like that don't sponsor the event or a car in it just for kicks - they obviously saw that they could get return from the various aspects involved in the event and the good TV on seven. So it goes both ways.

It is a fact that in this day and age, events like the 12-hour are unlikely to ever come close to reaching 'big' crowds like V8SC. The market is too crowded and the sporting landscape too busy and competitive. What it does attract are hardcore fans and those - like people who have posted here - who are keen to see something other than two-make V8 racing.

It is with longevity and solid and creative promotion that will see this base grow and in time, more people will come.

But events like this have a unique opportunity to be creative in what they do to gain exposure - the live steaming is an ideal example.

The bottom line is this: With solid (financial + Operational) management - which I think the event has - and some outside the box marketing and selling there is no reason this event won't be around for another 20 years.

Oh yes - I hope they don't stuff about too much with regs. I, for one, would prefer this event to remain GT-car free. The focus needs to be on getting a wider variety of outright-competitive and class cars in the race, not making it more expensive and 'unobtainable' to people on the street.

To end - I'm glad people like Morris Dancer can offer their opinion, whether I or others agree or not. It's great that the event is followed enough to allow people to have a discussion about it's future. Keep it up and may it grow!

[mtpanorama]

Originally Posted by Morris Dancer

I understand, from a reliable source, that most of the 'sponsorship' of at least one Bathurst 12-Hour outright contender comprised contra deals and favours for the car owner's business suppliers. Hardly a dollar changed hands.

So what, most of us on here could name numerous cars from every series running in this country (and O/S) that are funded in that way.
Most of my racing is done that way!

Originally Posted by Morris Dancer

It wasn't until the 1990 Production Touring Car formula, which was designed around 6-cylinder Commodores and Falcons, that real 'Series Production' touring car racing reappeared. It had the right ingredients but never took off because the promotion was left to CAMS, which like any government wouldn't know a good marketing concept if it jumped up and bit it on the bum.

That formula turned into a farce as well with the allowing of "homologation" specials. Holden were running a VP V6 SS commodore and Ford had an EB XR6 S that they were using. There only had to be 6 produced to be allowed into the series.

[nafe!]

From memory the total amount of viewers who logged into the online streaming of the event was 22000, and in the early evening peaked at 2000 concurrent viewers. (thats higher then some f1 streams viewed in the oceania region)

I was at the event this year and i can say from my experience as a spectator that the weather was atrocious. We narrowly got home prior to rivers flash flooding on our return trip. It poured throughout the day and the previous nights non stop rain had already turned the place into a mud hole.

I can tell you that we very seriously considered not attending the event due to the rain and probably only attended thanks to my positive experience from last years event. Despite the weather we didnt regret the decision!.

Can anyone tell me of a bathurst event in the recent decade that has come anywhere near getting v8supercar attendences? I am simply not aware of it ever occuring. Even the Bathurst 24 hr races got bagged out for their low attendence rate despite the potential of the event and its competitors.

I think anyone who has attended motorsport in australia in the recent decades will tell you that v8supercars is the only australian based circuit category that gets large attendences.

From our experience of looking for accomodation i can tell you that the local economy was obviously benefiting from the event with most reasonably priced accomodation sold out. The families, friends, and support crews of the teams from every category that raced over the weekend alone would have made a large contribution to the local economy.

Your not talking about closing a major road and disrupting local businesses either.

At the moment i love the bathurst 12 hour race as it is. I think it would definately benefit from a number of factory efforts with more famous drivers in the mix, but otherwise anyone who has actually attended and can judge it off that experience not a stripped down sterile 3 hr coverage package will tell you that it is a fantastic race.

The production cars you see racing are representive of their show room counter part. There was a strong representation of profesionally prepaired cars in most of the classes in the field. There were some very well known "big gun" drivers racing with a very diverse mix of genuinely talented amateurs, up and comers, veterans etc as well as the usual gentlemen drivers.

The events secured its future for next year as far as i understand, and ill be making another trip up. Bare in mind that we travelled 3 hours each way in rubbish weather to attend the race so that in itself is a indication of how good it is if we are willing to do it all again.

[johnh875]

Originally Posted by Morris Dancer

The high-end imported cars that competed in the early Armstrong/Gallagher 500s at Phillip Island/Bathurst spelt the demise of those races as true 'showroom showdowns' for average car-buyers.

'Bathurst specials' took over until the 1972 'Supercar' controversy, which effectively killed Series Production Touring Car racing for almost 20 years.

/snip

There's room for a 'high-performance' production touring car category, but it should be for mass-produced variants (eg. like turbo 6-cylinder or V8 XT Falcons, and Commodore SS V8), not tiny-volume ones like Evos, Stis and 335is. These cars should race separately from the base models because they appeal to a different market.

Motorsport has a place for limited edition semi-exotic production touring cars. It’s called club racing.

If the Bathurst 12-Hour continues to allow high-performance cars to compete then history will repeat itself - maybe not next year, but within a couple of years at the most. The promoters are dreaming if they think the race will ever be popular in its current format.

How do you conclude that the high-end Studebaker etc affected the race when they never won - ok the Phillip Island races were won by a Vauxhall Cresta & Merc 220... and a (very) basic Falcon. This was followed Cortinas and Cooper S's, again hardly high-end imported. I agree the 'Bathurst Specials' did get out of hand when you got to the GTHO and XU1 level, but at GT/GTS/GTR level with a couple of thousand sold per model surely that is ok.

A similar thing exists now where I don't think they should allow 'special' versions of Evo's, STi's etc. A small correction re the ~1992 Grp E cars, the Ford was a Falcon SS also, which just snuck in a couple of months before the XR6 was launched.

Something I would note about the 12Hr race is that unless you follow motorsport in the specialist media (which is only a small % of the population) you probably don't even know it is on. I also think it is showing a pretty healthy path with higher-profile entries/drivers coming on board and has every chance to continue to develop into a proper event. There is a national championship for the category too, so it is beyond club racing.

I don't think they can separate the >$60k cars from the <$60k (to arbitrarily choose a split point), all are needed to run the event and all are appropriate in my view. I would be happy with either the current situation or perhaps allow in the M3/C63/RS4/ISF types. Some people follow (and race) the car they drive, some follow an aspirational car.

[RotorFan]

Originally Posted by nafe!

From memory the total amount of viewers who logged into the online streaming of the event was 22000, and in the early evening peaked at 2000 concurrent viewers. (thats higher then some f1 streams viewed in the oceania region)

A typo, I know, but you popped an extra zero on there - it was ~2200.

Originally Posted by alfacors

And live streaming for the Shannons Nationals rounds all through 2010 too!

Are you saying it will be, or is that your wish?

Originally Posted by Wood-duck

hi all

Does anybody know how i could get a copy of the live coverage and commentary of the entire race (the same that was broadcast on the net, into the pits etc)

VHS, DVD - not fussy....

if anyone has access to make a copy it would be greatly appreciated

PM me if you might be able to help

Thanks :-)

I'm working on this, I'll let you know.

[alfacors]

Confirmed live streaming online

http://www.thenationals.com.au/story.asp?id=459

[nafe!]

Originally Posted by RotorFan

A typo, I know, but you popped an extra zero on there - it was ~2200.

Nope not a typo, i was referring to the amount of viewers in total who watched the stream at some point during the race.

This qoute from the latest press release on the Bathurst 12 hr site confirms the figures.

Mr O’Brien said that while a three day attendance of almost 18,000 endured uncomfortable weather conditions at Mount Panorama, more than 20,000 around the world followed the race via a successful first-time internet telecast.