2005 tyres - hard as nails

[sonic]

Looks like theres a big debate about the new slower (or long-life) rubber proposed for 2005 on Autosport.com

http://www.autosport.com/newsitem.asp?id=40310&s=5

apparently they are massively quick on the first lap and then the perfomance plummets away.

Some drivers are up in arms and miserable. But according to the report Ant Davidson had a huge grin on his face and said -

"It's just like driving a big Formula Ford,” he said. “It slides around so much and it is quite good fun.

which sounds great! just what we need to create some decent overtaking!!!

[Kicking-back]

When the grooved tyres were brought in during the winter of 1997/98, some drivers claimed it wouldn't be F1 any more.

Whenever big changes come in, people always criticise - because most of us are resistent to change.

Things will work out fine - and the new tyres are a change for the better, I believe.

[climb]

The only problem is, changing rules every year does nothing but favourising dominant leaders

[T0MAT01]

Two birds with one stone - it reduces cornering speeds and improves overtaking.

Sounds like a good idea to me.

[Adam43]

Originally posted by climb
The only problem is, changing rules every year does nothing but favourising dominant leaders

Off topic: and keeping the rules relatively stable has, er...

The big difference on the first lap grip could be relavant for qualifying. A set-up for that grip might be different from one for the rest of the race (on lower grip).

[BootsOntheSide]

Sounds promising to me. Tyres with less grip tend to make for more overtaking as it reduces the consistancy of laps, and should make the cars more interesting to watch, even when they're on their own. The grids should be more mixed as well - partly because qualifying mistakes are more likely, and partly for the reasons Adam mentions.

In fairness KB, the grooved tyres were a mistake - although it's still F1, it's not as exciting anymore.

[mstar]

favours teams with big testing budgets who can test week in week out. 2005 another ferrari domination i can see

[Tweed]

Let's wait and see first. Come March we could be back having similar grip levels to this year.

[Glen]

I can't see any special characteristic to the rules that favours big spenders - other than the fact that F1 itself favours big spending. Williams and McLaren test just as much as Ferrari anyway.

Actually, a harder wearing tyre would make the cars a little easier to work with I'd imagine - as well as placing a little more premium on actual driving, rather than car set-up. Good for guys like Montoya and JV maybe.

[sonic]

Originally posted by Tweed
Let's wait and see first. Come March we could be back having similar grip levels to this year.

I seriously doubt that. They're only gonna have 2 sets per weekend - presently they only have to last 20 laps! it would be a triumph of rubber engineering if they managed that (and amazing benifits to the motoring public)

Perhaps through the season though they will be able to win back the downforce they've been forced to lose. Which in my opinion would then be a problem as far as racing is concerned.

My understanding is that cars with less mechanical grip that rely more on aero are harder to overtake with, or at least much harder to follow the car in front.

as for continued Ferrari / big team domination - frankly regardless of what you do teams with more money will rise to the top.

However I believe drastic rule changes do give smaller teams the chance to get it right by accident at least for the first half of the season. Remeber Last season even ferrari made a bit of lemon (by their standards) because the qual rules changed and left them with a car that was too long wheelbase.

Basically I think rule changes introduce that element of chaos and chance - that long term rule stability practically removes.

[Marbot]

So hopefully braking distances have been increased substantially ,bringing an end to the usual DC/RB,TS/RS,DC/RS wheel tangling dramas.

[Sodemo]

Yes but they had hard tyres in 1999 and 2000 and the racing then was no better than now, if anything it was worse than now.
How many times did we see a faster car get stuck behind a slower car in 1999 - 2000 and couldn't overtake.
At least now if the same happens, they seem to have more of a go.
Having harder tyres will only work if they slash the areo on the cars by 75%, then we might see some good racing...

[Pingguest]

Well, the drivers critise the new rules. And I agree with them.

Formula 1 is supposed to be a sprintrace of 305 or 310 kilometers. Now we will get an endurance race about who drove the less laps during the free practises. That will only be bad for the croud. Well done, Mosley, for destroying the Formula 1!

[Kicking-back]

Formula One has always had an element of endurance.

It's only since we've had refuelling that people have approached it as flat out all the way.

[RWC]

Don't worry too much about the dramatic performance drop off after one lap-grooved tyres also were odd when first introduced.The designers are just trying too hard .

Good point sonic & monster -they will still find it hard to overtake without a massive reduction in aero

And the point about having only two sets-so less running on thur/fri - is also relevant.They must have it so that they are allowed practice tyres and seperate qual/race tyres!

About the ONLY good thing i can see comming out of this is that there will be far less rubbering up of the racing line-which means going offline to overtake will be abit easier (a little like a wet track which effectively has no racing line )

As usual for the fia it's an impotent and badly thought out measure for a massive problem.

[touringcarnut]

Seems like a move in the right direction if the cars can slide about a bit more. Combined with the aero changes, it might well work...

[pole2pole]

Will there still be two tyre makes in next years championship?

[latemdnof]

who the hell is sonic? monto is the monster, sonic the sato? lol

[Kicking-back]

sonic was the poster who started this thread, and monster was one who responded to it.



At the moment, both Michelin and Bridgestone will be back in 2005 - but Max is pushing for that to change.

[pole2pole]

Originally posted by Kicking-back




At the moment, both Michelin and Bridgestone will be back in 2005 - but Max is pushing for that to change.

I hope that next years championship will be a one tyre make championship. This new hard tyre idea really sounds good but if you have two tyre makes one is going to produce a better tyre and out perform the other, just like what we have seen for the last number of years. Max has a hell of a job on his hands if he wants everybody on the same rubber. The first problem I see is how do you break up that fantastic relationship Ferrari have with brigdestone hrug:

[Pingguest]

I don't see the problem. The competition between Bridgestone and Michellin is good for the sport. When Michellin came back in F1, everyone was content with it.

One tyre supplier will mean that the teams will get a bad tire. In 1999 all teams complained about the bad Bridgestone tyres.

[Kicking-back]

Competition on tyres tends to dangerously escalate speeds.

As for one supplier making a "bad tyre" - it matters little, as everyone would have the same.

[Mr V]

The trouble with only having one tyre is it still needs testing, and the best team in F1 will always get that work, it gives them (the best team) an unfair advantage.

[Rich R]

what provisions will there be for a driver who gets a puncture, not from wear but from debris. it wouldn't really be fair to be penalised for being unlucky, or if you get a race like spa or indy this year with a lot of punctures.

[Marbot]

Originally posted by Rich R
what provisions will there be for a driver who gets a puncture, not from wear but from debris. it wouldn't really be fair to be penalised for being unlucky, or if you get a race like spa or indy this year with a lot of punctures.

In the event of a puncture the driver uses a tyre from his first set that were used for practise,obviously this tyre will have a different tread depth to his remaining tyres and could upset the handling quite badly.