STR to become Scuderia Lancia????

[Marbot]

Fiat (yes Fiat) are looking at buying into STR.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScqJk...eature=related

[Mekola]

Wonder to think what the Ascari family will say about all this. The Ascaris were well tied to Lancia project in the 1950s and, in some way, they saw amusing that Juan Manuel Fangio could drove the D50 to the championship in 1956. Because the "Chueco" had good relationship with Alberto, being such a friendly driver with motorsport people.

[Sev]

What the hell does that video have to do with anything? I'm confused

[Redlake27]

Yes, clearly the wrong video. But quite a fast Vectra! Brings back memories of my 160mph drive on a nearby Autobahn on the way up to Spa once.....

....anyway we digress.

Fiat own Ferrari. They have stated that the relaunch of Lancia will be as a luxury brand, with Alfa Romeo as the sporty brand. I just don't see why they would do this.....

But then ................ http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns20358.html

[nickyf1]

Does anyone else have an image of a Martini F1 car?

Because im enjoying it.

[vinegar]

Originally Posted by Redlake27

Lancia will be as a luxury brand, with Alfa Romeo as the sporty brand. I just don't see why they would do this.....

Mercedes, Renault, Toyota and Honda aren't predominantly sporting brands.
BMW may be perceived as sporting, but a lot of its range isnt. Even Ferrari isn't a purely sporting brand.

I don't see why not focusing on street racers would stop a company coming into F1, especially if they want a very quick boost to their global profile. Especially if that boost will stir memories of their past racing glories. Think of all the retrospectives in the motorsport press, the year or two of their history being recounted on global TV. And think particularly of the impact on a sector of the market made up of people who are generally past the age where they use sports cars as their mode of transport but still hanker after the association with sport and glory. Preferably with some added history.

Makes sense to me, especially as it is locally based, and a lot of the most complicated parts already exist in a sister operation.

We'll see.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by Sev

What the hell does that video have to do with anything? I'm confused

Sorry about the vid.Not sure where the Hell that came from!

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by Redlake27

But then ................ http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns20358.html

That's the one!

[cds_uk]

Lancia or Alfa back in F1, sounds good to me, i wont hold my breath though.

[JohnSSC]

Why would Fiat, who are already in F1 (via Ferrari) want to turn around and spend an equal sum (or close to it) on "Team Lancia?"

In today's economic climate this makes no financial sense whatsoever.

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by JohnSSC

Why would Fiat, who are already in F1 (via Ferrari) want to turn around and spend an equal sum (or close to it) on "Team Lancia?"

In today's economic climate this makes no financial sense whatsoever.

You're right John, there's no way on earth FIAT shareholders will consent to owning and bank rolling 2 Formula One teams. If they acquire STR, it likely means they're going to sell Ferrari.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by JohnSCC

In today's economic climate this makes no financial sense whatsoever.

Which is why Fiat will do it anyway and then expect someone else to bail them out.

Also,it hasn't stopped Fiat from being the main sponsor of Yamaha's front line MotoGP team.

[Knowlesy]

Being a sponsor in MotoGP and running an F1 team are very different things.

Fiat have only just recovered from serious financial bother, so I see this Lancia idea as unlikely. It would also be about as evocative as Jaguar Racing was.

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

Being a sponsor in MotoGP and running an F1 team are very different things.

Fiat have only just recovered from serious financial bother, so I see this Lancia idea as unlikely. It would also be about as evocative as Jaguar Racing was.

Agreed completely.

[duke_toaster]

They're probably going to try and circumvent the customer chassis rules somehow and just run Ferraris. Whoop de do ... 4 Ferraris. Two to use as missiles, two to use for points ...

[banger_racer]

Originally Posted by duke_toaster

They're probably going to try and circumvent the customer chassis rules somehow and just run Ferraris. Whoop de do ... 4 Ferraris. Two to use as missiles, two to use for points ...

Totally agree.

[KA]

Originally Posted by Knowlesy

Being a sponsor in MotoGP and running an F1 team are very different things.

Fiat have only just recovered from serious financial bother, so I see this Lancia idea as unlikely. It would also be about as evocative as Jaguar Racing was.

It seems a very unlikely idea- it makes no more sense for Fiat to support 2 F1 teams than it does Red Bull or Honda and I suspect that if there was any truth in it then would be no more than a way of setting up a Ferrari 'B' team if they can find a way around the customer car regs....

As to being as evocative as Jaguar Racing wasn't, that's an interesting one-
if it was done right (they'd need Martini or Alitalia on board as title sponsor for starters... ) given Lancia's huge motorsport history, including F1, then maybe they could carry it off in a way that would give the team all the panache and sense of their history that the Jaguar Racing effort lacked.

Then again, you could say the same of Jaguar- the biggest problem after the lack of success was that it always somehow smacked of a fairly desperate marketing campaign by Ford than anything that had any real connection with Jag's sporting heritage....

How is Lancia perceived as a manufacturer these days? They're pretty much forgotten in the UK, I suspect, (apart from stories of rusty Betas in the 70's)
, and most motorsport enthusiasts memories of them are probably more tied up with the Stratos, 037 and Delta on the stages than they are a 50's F1 effort that was taken over by Ferrari....

[Redlake27]

Fiat selling Ferrari is not such a daft idea....

Since the 80s they have invested heavily and Ferrari has become a global brand, rather than 'just' a car manufacturer.

I think Ferrari is at peak value at the mo - at its most successful in F1, expanding in China, India and Middle East - just ripe for a new Middle Eastern owner.

Fiat could then spend a fraction of the billions they would get on rebuilding their Abarth, Alfa and Lancia brands globally.

[JohnSSC]

...or they could continue to take advantage of the $$ that Ferrari brings into Fiat on a regular basis, the $$ that derive from the branding, the $$ that derive from parts, service etc for the "historic" race/road cars to maintain them, etc.

Yep, credit has tightened world-wide so money is hard to come by, the recession is causing people to cutback on purchases including luxury sports cars and so now is the time to sell Ferrari? Now is the time to hang on to it. If there is a "good" time to sell something like Ferrari (and I doubt Fiat will) then it is when demand is highest, not when it is slipping.

The really daft idea would be one manufacturer trying to field two teams at a time when they can barely justify fielding one.

[Pingguest]

I think it's very unlikely. One team is very expensive, let alone two.

Ironically, in 1985 Alfa Romeo was forced to leave Formula 1 as it was taken over by FIAT.

[Gt_R]

I would agree that the costs would make it extremely unlikely, especially considering that it wasn't too long ago that FIAT was really struggling with money.

It is a possibility though for FIAT to explore. Lancia has a rich history, but in recent times have largely been forgotten and branding wise they are weak. F1 is one means to gain quick brand-building in the global sense which Lancia desperately needs.

Rather than seeing the "costs" of owning two teams, i would think FIAT is considering leveraging on Ferrari's resources. With cost structure set to stablize, and regulation stability a possibility, FIAT is merely evaluating whether it could make good sense. With no engine development costs, Lancia could run relatively on a "budget" with relative competitiveness with their own chassis. Lancia would not need the big budget to compete and beat the big teams (ie Mclaren/Ferrari/BMWs). All Lancia need is to run reasonably in the mid-field, occasional points, compete amongst the Renault/Red Bull/Williams and get some coverage/publicity.

What are the alternatives? Getting Lancia into WRC will not be "fitting" for their new image, and the cost will be high too if they want to be competitive. F1 does have costs, but it makes sense IF the proposed changes towards rules stablizing and costs control become a reality.

Re-branding the engines as Lancia, and owning just a majority of the team with other stakeholders to split costs, FIAT could just make it viable enough for their purpose.

[Bononi]

Maybe it has to do with Massa's dad, the billionaire and FIAT interests in brazilian market, and logically make a smooth move for Massa when he'll be replaced by Alonso at Ferrari.

[Notso Swift]

Think wider:

TGF vehicle into ownership

[Kiwi3]

TGF?

After announcing a few weeks ago that it was up for sale, perhaps there are a couple of interested parties so Red Bull have put this idea out in order to invent competition for the purchase and push the price up.

The Bernie E price negotation method.

[Bononi]

Not a bad idea after all, but would TGF seek an own direction or become a Ferrari B team ?