FIA Formula Two / FIA F2 - 2012 Season

[peebee2]

Think so. It is generally supporting the GT Open / F3 Open again this year

[HaydenFan]

Mathéo Tuscher

Look at drivers running GP3? A bunch of young guys with little experiene. I though we got over the young age period of single seaters a few years ago. You have the 18-19-20 year olds running F1, and the 18 year old's running GP2 (Razia comes to mind). Is the sponsors urge to get their driver's to F1 that high that they'll put an unexperienced drivers in fast cars.

Same can be said about Sergey Sirotkin. Only 16, yet has shown to be one of the fastest on the grid in that series. Yet racing experience is down to one year in Formula Abarth (albeit a pretty dang impressive year).

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by HaydenFan

Mathéo Tuscher

Look at drivers running GP3? A bunch of young guys with little experiene. I though we got over the young age period of single seaters a few years ago. You have the 18-19-20 year olds running F1, and the 18 year old's running GP2 (Razia comes to mind). Is the sponsors urge to get their driver's to F1 that high that they'll put an unexperienced drivers in fast cars.

Same can be said about Sergey Sirotkin. Only 16, yet has shown to be one of the fastest on the grid in that series. Yet racing experience is down to one year in Formula Abarth (albeit a pretty dang impressive year).

Uh, yes.

[Frosty11]

i think that this year's championship is going to be very good. I can see Zanella and Marinescu filling the top 2 but behind them is anyone's guess.

[pauln]

If I was a betting type I'd have a flutter on Dino Zamparelli

[Flavio Galtieri]

Originally Posted by HaydenFan

Mathéo Tuscher

Look at drivers running GP3? A bunch of young guys with little experiene. I though we got over the young age period of single seaters a few years ago. You have the 18-19-20 year olds running F1, and the 18 year old's running GP2 (Razia comes to mind). Is the sponsors urge to get their driver's to F1 that high that they'll put an unexperienced drivers in fast cars.

Same can be said about Sergey Sirotkin. Only 16, yet has shown to be one of the fastest on the grid in that series. Yet racing experience is down to one year in Formula Abarth (albeit a pretty dang impressive year).

I don't care how fast a 15 year old child can drive.

The fact is he is a child and as such should not be exploited for profit by those who would have him put his life in danger. F2 should be for adullts, there are plenty of series designed for children. That's why we don't have child labour in this country. It's what makes us civilised.

Of course he will love it, and may be very good at driving. That's not the point. Where do you draw the line? A 14 year old next year? A 13 year old the year after.

This should be a child protection issue in the UK if he's racing in front of a paying audience at Silverstone.

What with Pommer's live pornographic sponsorship and now a child having his life put at risk I wonder really how low this series can sink just to fill the seats?

I just hope the Daily Wail doesn't get hold of this story. You'll never hear the end of it.

[bella]

i think the point haydenfan made about sergey sirotkin is a valid one - the guy is only a few months older, but it's more acceptable because he's past an age that's considered significant in the uk?

it is interesting though. it wasn't so long ago that max chilton had to wait until his 16th birthday before he was able to compete in british f3, yet here we have a fia series allowing a 15 year old to join in.

i guess it just highlights the inconsistencies in the sport. can't blame f2 really - if the guy is allowed to drive as per the fia regs, and he's got the money and a bit of experience, who's to turn that down? if we're not careful then we'll end up looking at whether it's appropriate for anyone under the legal age for buying alcohol in a country to be waving it around on the podium for example.

[HaydenFan]

Originally Posted by Flavio Galtieri

I don't care how fast a 15 year old child can drive.

The fact is he is a child and as such should not be exploited for profit by those who would have him put his life in danger. F2 should be for adullts, there are plenty of series designed for children. That's why we don't have child labour in this country. It's what makes us civilised.

Of course he will love it, and may be very good at driving. That's not the point. Where do you draw the line? A 14 year old next year? A 13 year old the year after.

This should be a child protection issue in the UK if he's racing in front of a paying audience at Silverstone.

What with Pommer's live pornographic sponsorship and now a child having his life put at risk I wonder really how low this series can sink just to fill the seats?

I just hope the Daily Wail doesn't get hold of this story. You'll never hear the end of it.

I understand where you are coming from, but that is sports today. Does it make it right? No! But it is unlikely to change. I, to a point agree with your comment, but this has been happening for years. Many drivers under 18 (I'm from the US, so I'm basing this off of our laws, and 18 year old's are legal adults here) race in big series in the world.

What about the 16 year old's making their Premier League debuts? I'd be ManU or Barcelona, or whoever would gladly put in a 15 year old if they were good enough of a player. What about the young player development programs? They take kids from a young age to turn (hopefully, not many really turn pro) into the players of the future. Little outcry over that.

What about the skateboarders? The dirt bike racers?The kids in the X-Games who are not 18 and getting paid beyond belief to perform in front of paying customers? Travis Pastrana was 15 when he won his X-Games old in Freestyle motocross. Nothing really said about that being wrong.

I know this is more about the fact that this kid brings money, and the cars a bit higher than Formula Renault or Formula Ford, but what about the 15-16 year old's who have been running in Grand Prix bike racing for years? And these kids are not just spending 3, 4, 5 years on the 125's. They are moving up before they're 18 to Moto2. Nothing has been said about that. And bike racing is just as dangerous as single seaters.

Originally Posted by bella

i think the point haydenfan made about sergey sirotkin is a valid one - the guy is only a few months older, but it's more acceptable because he's past an age that's considered significant in the uk?

That's what I was thinking. Also, is it because the series is UK based? What is it was elsewhere (Auto GP is Italian based).

[Flavio Galtieri]

Originally Posted by HaydenFan

I understand where you are coming from, but that is sports today. What about the 16 year old's making their Premier League debuts? I'd be ManU or Barcelona, or whoever would gladly put in a 15 year old if they were good enough of a player. What about the young player development programs? They take kids from a young age to turn (hopefully, not many really turn pro) into the players of the future. Little outcry over that.

I know this is more about the fact that this kid brings money, and the cars a bit higher than Formula Renault or Formula Ford, but what about the 15-16 year old's who have been running in Grand Prix bike racing for years? And these kids are not just spending 3, 4, 5 years on the 125's. They are moving up before they're 18 to Moto2. Nothing has been said about that. And bike racing is just as dangerous as single seaters.

Good points.

Yes I thought about the 14 year old Melandri when he first burst on the 125 scene. What a revelation he was.

I don't know, somehow bikes are different. Dangerous yes, but a 125 just doesn't go as fast as an F2 car. Maybe it's just me, I remember watching when poor Henry died on live TV, it sent shivers down my spine. It was obvious the poor kid was dead, and he was just 17.

Maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm just being over sensitive to a changing world. It just doesn't feel right to me.....it's just an opinion.

[bella]

Originally Posted by HaydenFan

I know this is more about the fact that this kid brings money, and the cars a bit higher than Formula Renault or Formula Ford, but what about the 15-16 year old's who have been running in Grand Prix bike racing for years? And these kids are not just spending 3, 4, 5 years on the 125's. They are moving up before they're 18 to Moto2. Nothing has been said about that. And bike racing is just as dangerous as single seaters.

being fair, i think a lot is said about the younger guys on bikes. they are given the chance to prove they're respectable, competant, mature riders though much like anyone of a more advanced age. they're on a shorter leash than the older more experienced guys though.

i think as spectators we have to give the driver himself the benefit of the doubt. should he start demonstrating he's a liability and unable to judge risk correctly then it's my opinion that action should be taken, but that goes for the older participants too.

[HaydenFan]

Originally Posted by Flavio Galtieri

Good points.

Yes I thought about the 14 year old Melandri when he first burst on the 125 scene. What a revelation he was.

I don't know, somehow bikes are different. Dangerous yes, but a 125 just doesn't go as fast as an F2 car. Maybe it's just me, I remember watching when poor Henry died on live TV, it sent shivers down my spine. It was obvious the poor kid was dead, and he was just 17.

Maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm just being over sensitive to a changing world. It just doesn't feel right to me.....it's just an opinion.

The Surtees accident was just that, an accident, but I get your point. These are just kids. I'm only a few years older than these drivers, and understand that they are young, they have more than a silly sport to look forward to in life, but like Bella pointed out, these many of these kids are beyond their years. They probably make us here look like children in terms of maturity in certain situations. To succeed they have to learn the be more like adults than kids, and many have. Which is why I can deal with these kids racing at a young age. An 18 year old in today's racing is where a 24-25 year old was 20 years ago in terms of where they are mentally as a race driver. Many have raced at a professional level in motorsport since they were 10-11 years old, so moving up classes is not a big issue.

[Flavio Galtieri]

One other thing that just occurred to me, and this is specific to the UK, but anyone having intensive contact with a child is required by law to have an enhanced CRB check by their employer. Intensive is deemed as any contact of three days or more and also applies to volunteers. I'm sure Dr. Palmer and the MSA know that though.

[HaydenFan]

Originally Posted by Flavio Galtieri

One other thing that just occurred to me, and this is specific to the UK, but anyone having intensive contact with a child is required by law to have an enhanced CRB check by their employer. Intensive is deemed as any contact of three days or more and also applies to volunteers. I'm sure Dr. Palmer and the MSA know that though.

Unless it's Bertrand Gachot, I don't that that's a big problem.

Plus, this is done, or probably done, by all kart sanctions in the UK already.

[formula_fan]

Flavio, from the neutral point of view it looks as though you are clutching at straws trying to slate F2. Yes the kid is very young to be driving these cars, but he certainly hasn't disgraced himself though as he was in the midfield in both test sessions today I believe. I'm not sure you can say he is being 'exploited for profit' because I'm sure he and his management are the ones pushing for him to be driving in the series.

With regards to the Surtees crash, that was not at all age related, anyone in his position would have had the same unfortunate fate I'm afraid. I think Surtees was also 18 at the time. Kevin Ceccon at 17 won the Auto GP championship as well as doing a more than competent job in GP2 when he stepped in and as mentioned Sirotkin looks pretty talented this year at 16 as well. I think age is not as big an issue as overall competence and I think Tuscher seems competent enough to drive the car. I agree with Bella though in that if he demonstrates he is a liability then maybe action should be taken.

[barnettracing]

Originally Posted by formula_fan

With regards to the Surtees crash, that was not at all age related, anyone in his position would have had the same unfortunate fate I'm afraid. I think Surtees was also 18 at the time.

I think it was less about the age of Henry but more to say, at 15, if Tuscher is killed in a motor race (broadcast live around the world) it will have massive repercussions not just for F2 but motorsport on an international scale.

Imagine the up roar in some of the less scrupulous daily newspapers for example...