Group A Golfs & Audis

[KA]

OK, just when you thought it was safe, and we'd got all the Group A touring car history threads you could ever wish for, there's one important car (or group of related cars...) that keep popping up in other threads, but we've never tackled in their own right- the VW Golf.

Along with the Corolla, it was almost the backbone of the 1600cc class, particularly in Europe where there seemed to be hordes of them. It was also seen in 1.8-litre form in Class B, where it struggled a bit to stay on terms with the bigger-engined Alfas

There were quite a few in earlier years in the BTCC, but they seemed to go out of fashion, briefly coming back into vogue in Mk2 16v form when the BTCC introduced a 1600-2-litre class in the late 80's- until John Cleland and the Astra GT/E turned up...

The most prolific British Group A Golf campaigner was probably Alan Minshaw, but others who ran them include Alan Greenhalgh, John Morris, Andrew Jeffrey and James Shead. I think Richard Lloyd, who was one of the pioneers of using the Golf in UK saloon racing in the 70's also fielded a Group A example in the early 80s, though he's probably better known for his Group 1/2 cars a few years before. They were hugely popular as a 1600cc class car in Europe, even after the 16v Corolla largely became the dominant force in the class, there were still plenty of Golfs- Also a few in Japan, as shown by Jesper recently. Were there any Group A ones in Australia? I don't recall one, but...

It's also worth including the Golf's closely related cousins, the VW Scirocco and Audi 80- both commonly raced in Europe, and less often in the UK. The Sciroccos largely disappeared by the mid-80's, but Peter Seikel's squad were campaigning Audis up to about 1987

Do we want to take in the bigger-engined fwd Group A Audis as well? I'm thinking of the fwd Audi Coupes used in the early years of Class B,
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-09-12-041.jpg and Chris Heyers Audi '5+5' (is that the Australian-market designation for the 5-cylinder versions of the Audi 80?) seen at Bathurst in '85, or the US-spec 5-cyl 'Audi 4000' entered by the Belgian VW-Audi Club at Spa around 1983/4
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-07-31-050.jpg


To kick off, a few pics...

Alan Greenhalgh's 'Ordebel' Mk1, Spa 85
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-07-28-079.jpg
Alan Minshaw's 'Demon Tweeks' Mk2
http://www.vwmotorsport.com/download...018.9.1998.jpg
RAS Sport Scirocco- Spa '83, Herregods/Bergmeister/Trint
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-07-31-062.jpg
Audi 80- Richard Lloyd/Jeff Allam, 1982 TT Silverstone
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-09-12-043.jpg

OK, over to you- usual routine, who raced them, where and when, reminiscences and pics, anyone got a Group A Golf gathering dust in their shed etc, plus the usual diversions into Group A rally Golfs, Prodsaloons and models

[Jesper OH]

Thank you KA for starting the thread - you beat me to it

I have put together a list of available VWs and Audi taking the freedom to include VW Polos and Jettas as well as the bigger types of Audi 80s of which the Coupé was technically identical. Hope its alright.

The Volkswagens first.
*denotes turbo- or supercharging
A1- denotes Group 1 car transferred to Group A

Volkswagen Polo Typ 86
A1-5601 / 1975.07.01-198x.xx.xx / 896 cc / VW Polo
A1-5645 / 1977.01.01-198x.xx.xx / 771 cc / VW Polo + Audi 50
A1-5690 / 1978.01.01-198x.xx.xx / 1272 cc / VW Polo + Audi 50
A5028 / 1982.05.01-1990.12.31 / 1093 cc / VW Polo
A5031 / 1982.05.01-1995.12.31 / 1272 cc / VW Polo
A5139 / 1983.05.01-1995.12.31 / 1272 cc / VW Polo Coupe GT
A5438 / 1991.10.01-2001.12.31 / *1273 cc / VW Polo Coupe G40
A5439 / 1991.10.01-2001.12.31 / 1273 cc / VW Polo Coupe

Volkswagen Golf Typ 17 / Mk. I
A1-5583 / 1975.01-01-198x.xx.xx / 1093 cc / VW Golf
A1-5733 / 1979.01.01-198x.xx.xx / 1471 cc / VW Golf Diesel
A1-5731 / 1979.01.01-198x.xx.xx / 1588 cc / VW Golf GTI
A1-5732 / 1979.01.01-1988.xx.xx / 1471 or 1588 cc / VW Golf LS
A5042 / 1982.06.01-1985.12.31 / 1471 cc / VW Golf Diesel
A5069 / 1982.10.01-1988.12.31 / *1588 cc / VW Golf GTD
A5096 / 1983.01.01-1989.12.31 / 1781 cc / VW Golf GTI
A5172 / 1983.10.01-1987.12.31 / 1588 cc / VW Golf GTI

Volkswagen Jetta Typ 16 / Mk. I
A1-5802 / 1980.07.01-19xx-xx / 1588 cc / VW Jetta GLI

Volkswagen Scirocco Typ 53 and 53B / Mk. I and II
A1-5734 / 1979.01.01-19xx.xx.xx / 1588 cc / VW Scirocco (Mk. I and II)
A1-5735 / 1979.01.01-19xx.xx.xx / 1471 cc / VW Scirocco (Mk. I and II?)
A5175 / 1983.11.01-1997.12.31 / 1781 cc / VW Scirocco GTI 1800 (Mk. II only)
A5314 / 1986.11.01-1997.12.31 / 1781 cc / VW Scirocco 16V (Mk. II only)

Volkswagen Golf Typ 19 / Mk. II
A5212 / 1984.04.01-1996.12.31 / 1781 cc / VW Golf GTI
A5295 / 1986.03.01-1996.12.31 / 1781 cc / VW Golf GTI 16V
A5337 / 1987.07.01-1996.12.31 / 1781 cc / VW Golf Syncro
A5398 / 1989.12.01-1995.12.31 / *1764 cc / VW Rallye-Golf G60

And now some Audis

Audi 80 / 90
A1-5559 / 1974.04.01-198x.xx.xx / 1588 cc / Audi 80 GT
A1-5774 / 1980.01.01-198x.xx.xx / 1588 cc / Audi 80 GLE
A1-5808 / 1980.12.01-198x.xx.xx / 2145 cc / Audi 80 2.2
A5010 / 1982.02.01-1989.12.31 / 2145 cc / Audi 80 2.2
A5012 / 1982.02.01-1988.12.31 / 1588 cc / Audi 80 GLE
A5156 / 1983.07.01-1989.12.31 / 2145 cc / Audi 80 quattro
A5223 / 1984.05.01-1991.12.31 / 1781 cc / Audi 80 GTE/Sport
A5276 / 1985.07.01-1992.12.31 / 2226 cc / Audi 90 quattro
A5346 / 1988.01.01-1996.12.31 / 2310 cc / Audi 90 quattro B3
A5383 / 1989.04.01-1996.12.31 / 1984 cc / Audi 80 2.0 E

Audi Coupé
A1-5829 / 1981.03.01-19xx.xx.xx / 1921 cc / Audi Coupé 2.0
A5011 / 1982.02.01-1992.12.31 / 2145 cc / Audi Coupé 2.2
A5013 / 1982.02.01-1992.12.31 / 1921 cc / Audi Coupé 2.0
A5284 / 1986.01.01-1992.12.31 / 2226 cc / Audi Coupé Quattro

Now its time to pin point various cars!

Jesper

[Jesper OH]

Ernst Schröter

http://www.teambild.se/arkiv/details...1600ff9b8fc5b6

The link refers to Dane Ernst Schröter and his pristine VW Golf GTI 16V Mk. II. From its debut in 1984 the car started as a normal 8 valve version then upgraded to 16V specs for the 1987 season. In the period from 1984 to 1993 the car brought its owner two Danish titles, one was the 1985 Group A Championship while 1993 saw him crowned with the Super Saloon title. The car was also used for various Nordic championship meetings – as this one in Mantorp depicts – but I don’t think he won any titles with this car though. From a reliable witness it still stands in the Schröter work shop as it was brought home from the final race of 1993 awaiting some historic racing!

A bit of background for this very colourful driver would perhaps be in place, so here goes. Hailing from Grindsted on the west coast of Jutland he bears evident traces that this part of Denmark was German from 1864-1921. Not only is the family name more German than Danish but when he was bossing his mechanics in the family team even in this millennium it usually happened in the German tongue – all of this happening with his trademark cigar stump in the corner of his mouth.
The Family has been VAG dealers for decades which naturally also selected the cars. Ernst thus started his career on the dirt tracks of the late 1960s in an NSU. During the mid-1970s he made a complete switch to the race tracks firstly in NSU but soon he made his name in Audi 80s with which he took his first Danish title in 1977. A switch to the Volkswagen brand saw him racing his first Golf GTI in 1979 narrowly defeated by Erik Høyer which repeated itself in 1980. This period also saw another of the often aggressive Schröter speciality in the form that no season would be complete without rolling the car at least once. His also supposed to have made a guest appearance in the American Volkswagen Rabbit Cup at no less place than Talladega in early 1980.
With the introduction of Group A for 1982 Ernst Schröter was the first taker in Denmark. Running for Nordic honours (I presume this was solely run for Group A cars, but don’t know) as well as Danish points he build himself a brand new Golf GTI and soon learned about the difference between the old Group 1+ and the new Group A. Dampers were the problem. By June 1983 his Mk. I was updated to 1.8 configurations and a few weeks later he was running Thomas Lindström (Volvo 240 Turbo) a close second at the Anderstorp Nordic meeting. In Denmark he found competition a bit tougher but at the forth and final meeting things gelled big way. Rain was prevailing and his proven wet weather talent (the dirt tracks) was proven beyond belief winning convincingly.

Jesper

[bigears]

http://www.clubgti.com/FORUM/showthread.php?t=112850

I wonder if Nick Cresswell's Golf that took part in the ModSaloon race at the 1987 Birmingham Superprix is entitled in this thread?

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by KA

To kick off, a few pics...

Alan Greenhalgh's 'Ordebel' Mk1, Spa 85
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-07-28-079.jpg

That's fairly signficant for that particular year KA. Greenahalgh was a BTCC regular in 1983/84 and was usually the main opposition to the Datapost and Brooklyn RS1600's. However he didn't run in '85.

The line up includes Alan Minshaw for the 24 Hours there, as well as a Belgian. Did Greenahalgh sell his car abroad for '85 and get invited back to share it? and was Minshaw asked to share because he was a GTi specialist?

I seem to recall that the car was originally owned by Minshaw as well, could that be right anyone?

[Jesper OH]

Originally Posted by KA

Alan Greenhalgh's 'Ordebel' Mk1, Spa 85
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-07-28-079.jpg

What's that "thing" below the front bumper?

Jesper

[chunterer]

I often wondered what that 'thing' was too. It certainly had it during 1984, but not sure about prior to that?

Some kind of front splitter? Got a feeling the later Mk1 GTi road cars had it on them though.

[KA]

Originally Posted by Jesper OH

What's that "thing" below the front bumper?

Jesper

Hmm, I hadn't noticed that.....It certainly isn't the 'standard' front spoiler seen on Group A Golf GTIs at that time...
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-07-28-076.jpg
(Chapel/Norhomme/Erez at the same race)
...and it seems to have gone by the time the car appears at Zolder later in the season, where it's wearing the usual Golf spoiler....
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-09-29-068.jpg

Some of the Golf teams do seem to have used fairly prominent brake ducting around the front spoilers.....
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-09-29-092.jpg
(Ripolles/Rutten, again at Zolder)

....so I wonder if it's just a fairly elaborate solution to providing ducts for brake cooling- and is therefore in no way whatsoever intended to increase the efficiency of the front spoiler.....

That might explain why it's disappeared by Zolder...

[KA]

Originally Posted by chunterer

That's fairly signficant for that particular year KA. Greenahalgh was a BTCC regular in 1983/84 and was usually the main opposition to the Datapost and Brooklyn RS1600's. However he didn't run in '85.

The line up includes Alan Minshaw for the 24 Hours there, as well as a Belgian. Did Greenahalgh sell his car abroad for '85 and get invited back to share it? and was Minshaw asked to share because he was a GTi specialist?

I seem to recall that the car was originally owned by Minshaw as well, could that be right anyone?

As you said, he didn't run the BTCC in '85. I've got some old copies of Performance Car magazine from 1983/4, which had a regular column by Art Markus on the BTCC- titled 'Art on A', they included a bit of background story as well as the race reports- I'll have a look at those and see if they shed any light.

I don't remember whether Minshaw originally owned the Greenhalgh Golf- Were Minshaw's Golfs (the Mk1 and the first Mk2 from 1985 at least) built by Andy Rouse by any chance- that thought rings a very vague bell?

[Jesper OH]

Originally Posted by KA

Hmm, I hadn't noticed that.....It certainly isn't the 'standard' front spoiler seen on Group A Golf GTIs at that time...
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-07-28-076.jpg
(Chapel/Norhomme/Erez at the same race)
...and it seems to have gone by the time the car appears at Zolder later in the season, where it's wearing the usual Golf spoiler....
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-09-29-068.jpg

Some of the Golf teams do seem to have used fairly prominent brake ducting around the front spoilers.....
http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-09-29-092.jpg
(Ripolles/Rutten, again at Zolder)

....so I wonder if it's just a fairly elaborate solution to providing ducts for brake cooling- and is therefore in no way whatsoever intended to increase the efficiency of the front spoiler.....

That might explain why it's disappeared by Zolder...

I was thinking of the rear mounted oil cooler on the TWR Jaguars of late 1983 too, also non spoilers of course!

Jesper

[KA]

Originally Posted by Jesper OH

I was thinking of the rear mounted oil cooler on the TWR Jaguars of late 1983 too, also non spoilers of course!

Jesper

So was I!!!!

http://www.racingsportscars.com/etcc...-06-12-002.jpg

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by KA

I don't remember whether Minshaw originally owned the Greenhalgh Golf- Were Minshaw's Golfs (the Mk1 and the first Mk2 from 1985 at least) built by Andy Rouse by any chance- that thought rings a very vague bell?

Yes I think you're right KA, ARE did build Minshaw's car, or at least maintained it and latterly looked after Greenhalgh's car too...

The last time I saw anything in depth related to Alan Minshaw's Group A cars, the golf included, was in an article in that lost gem of a magazine 'Ingear' a few years ago.

[Jesper OH]

Speaking of Minshaw. From the 1987 Autosport BTCC reports he ran a production spec Golf 16V before his proper Group A mount was ready. When exactly was the Group A car debuted?

Jesper

[chunterer]

Jesper, Alan Minshaw first ran a Mk2 GTi in the last few rounds of the 1984BTCC.

It didn't continue into 1985 though as far as I am aware.

He later entered a 16v version in '87 as you say, but again I reckon it was later on in that season before it was entered in a full season in 1988. I don't remember a prodsaloon car running though.

[Jesper OH]

I don't think he managed a full season in 1988 either, as Andrew Jeffrey and James Shead eventually decided the class C battle among them in their former Rally Golfs. I believe that Minshaw sold his 16V to John Morris midway through the 1989 season when Morris about totalled his own 16V.

Jesper