Barrichello's future - Page 4

pole2pole · 5 Jun 2005, 13:55 (Ref:1320514)

When Michael made that courageous move at monaco to pass RB could it have been a contract issue? What I mean could RB have a contract that states that if he is in front of his team mate in the points table at a certain stage in the championship then he becomes the number one.

Mr V · 5 Jun 2005, 14:40 (Ref:1320537)

Doubt that very much, after all, Rubens was ahead of Michael in the WDC after Australia.

pole2pole · 5 Jun 2005, 14:53 (Ref:1320543)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr V

Doubt that very much, after all, Rubens was ahead of Michael in the WDC after Australia.

That's what I mean. If RB was in front of Michael in the points table at a certain stage of the season then he would be the number one driver in the team. When Michael made that move at monaco not only did he pass RB on the track but he also past him on the points table. Rb then cracked and spoke out about his team mate something which he has never done

Mr V · 5 Jun 2005, 15:13 (Ref:1320551)

If that was the case, as Rubens was still 7 points ahead of Michael at Bahrain, how come Ferrari left Rubens on the sidelines upto Qualifying 1? (He qualified 20th iirc).

Surely, if you assumption is correct regarding his contract, and as he was leading Michael in the WDC, Ferrari would have allocated their working gearbox to him?

Just a thought.

Mekola · 5 Jun 2005, 15:38 (Ref:1320567)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kicking-back

Who was the last driver to have his first ever Grand Prix in a Ferrari?

In the official records, the last driver who had his first ever GP in a Ferrari was Arturo Merzario in the 1972 British GP, but the last ever time when a driver made his Formula One race debut in a Ferrari was when Giancarlo Martini raced the 312/T2 loaned to Giancarlo Minardi's Everest structure for two non-championship races of 1976, the Race of Champions at Brands and the International Trophy at Silverstone.

Dutton · 8 Jun 2005, 02:26 (Ref:1322859)

I think that both Rubens and Michael have a contract, just like every other driver in Formula One, that states they have to obey team orders.

There is nothing more required.

Logrence · 8 Jun 2005, 09:40 (Ref:1323016)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutton

There is nothing more required.

Cooperation is always key...

BSchneiderFan · 8 Jun 2005, 09:47 (Ref:1323026)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr V

If that was the case, as Rubens was still 7 points ahead of Michael at Bahrain, how come Ferrari left Rubens on the sidelines upto Qualifying 1? (He qualified 20th iirc).

Surely, if you assumption is correct regarding his contract, and as he was leading Michael in the WDC, Ferrari would have allocated their working gearbox to him?

Just a thought.

With respect, I think you're missing the point slightly. The contention (with which I don't necessarily agree) is that the contract may say that if Rubens is ahead in the points by a certain point in the season, he becomes the 'number one' driver, and that that point was rapidly approaching after Monaco.

Valve Bounce · 8 Jun 2005, 09:57 (Ref:1323033)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutton

I think that both Rubens and Michael have a contract, just like every other driver in Formula One, that states they have to obey team orders.

There is nothing more required.

And the team orders are very clear and concise: "Rubens, move over!!"

Glen · 8 Jun 2005, 10:02 (Ref:1323036)

Quote:

Originally Posted by BSchneiderFan

With respect, I think you're missing the point slightly. The contention (with which I don't necessarily agree) is that the contract may say that if Rubens is ahead in the points by a certain point in the season, he becomes the 'number one' driver, and that that point was rapidly approaching after Monaco.

I suspect it is you who misses the point! There is no need for the contracts to speak of number one drivers whatsoever - merely a conventional clause about both drivers working for the team, not themselves. If the team (the employer!) come on the radio AT ANY TIME and ask the driver to do something, the contract requires the driver to do it. Why would it need to be any more complicated than that?

BSchneiderFan · 8 Jun 2005, 10:43 (Ref:1323066)

I suspect most contracts are rather more complex than that!

Glen · 8 Jun 2005, 10:49 (Ref:1323071)

I strongly doubt that any driver's contract has clauses which describe the number of points you need to be ahead before you are the "number one" driver. I doubt that the notion of "number one" driver gets into the wording at all.

Logrence · 8 Jun 2005, 10:54 (Ref:1323079)

I think in most teams it's subtle use of favouring one driver with certain things, psychological games and that sort of thing. Having said that we do hear all the time about Schumacher's contracts having certain clauses in them.

Glen · 8 Jun 2005, 11:10 (Ref:1323092)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Logrence

Having said that we do hear all the time about Schumacher's contracts having certain clauses in them.

Hear about from whom? Absolutely nobody that knows. Only from people that assume. They know Jack.

Valve Bounce · 8 Jun 2005, 11:56 (Ref:1323122)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glen

Hear about from whom? Absolutely nobody that knows. Only from people that assume. They know Jack.

Well, I know Rubens moves over!!

Let's not get too heated about this point, because the contracts may or may not specify what Rubens has to do, but the end result is the same. However, Rubens was well paid for his subservience to his excellency. N'est-ce pas??

pole2pole · 8 Jun 2005, 12:54 (Ref:1323171)

What if the tables where turned and you had the closing stages of a GP do you think RB would have the permission to have a go at passing Michael. Would he have to ask for permission or would he just go for it?

Logrence · 8 Jun 2005, 12:55 (Ref:1323174)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glen

Hear about from whom? Absolutely nobody that knows. Only from people that assume. They know Jack.

Well does Jack know?

Thorstone · 8 Jun 2005, 13:41 (Ref:1323198)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kicking-back

Red Bull would not replace Coulthard with Barrichello.

Maybe Ferrari will ?

Logrence · 8 Jun 2005, 16:07 (Ref:1323292)

Coulthard was offered a testing role at Ferrari, incidentally - he turned it down to drive for RBR.

Mr V · 8 Jun 2005, 16:35 (Ref:1323318)

Quote:

Originally Posted by pole2pole

What if the tables where turned and you had the closing stages of a GP do you think RB would have the permission to have a go at passing Michael. Would he have to ask for permission or would he just go for it?

Depends how long his new and improved i'm racing for myself attitude continues.

mac · 8 Jun 2005, 23:45 (Ref:1323574)

I'd like to see Rubens at BAR - I think that could work well.

Gt_R · 9 Jun 2005, 04:08 (Ref:1323655)

Like what Glen said, we hear about "certain clauses in Schumacher's contract" by people who don't like MS/Ferrari and make assumptions. Repeat it 1000 times, or 3 times a day if you like, and what you have is people start taking it as "fact".

Truth is, nobody saw THAT contract before.... and nobody believes when Ferrari said before that the clause that binds drivers is probably the same as what other teams employ.. that drivers are contracted to listen to what the team manager says.

Rubens is a top notch driver, whom i think would be an asset to any team. I have no doubts that he is and would be better than DC, whom is a good driver in his own rights.

People tend to over exaggerate the relationship within Ferrari and between RB & MS. There's nothing more to it, and i think RB & MS share one of the most effective, if not closer, relationship among any teammates on the grid now.

But still, i'm curious to know how those who dislike Ferrari, and don't bother following what goes on with Ferrari, get to know so much about the contract...while the fans are not entitled to such previlges.

Mr V · 9 Jun 2005, 04:21 (Ref:1323659)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kicking-back

Red Bull would not replace Coulthard with Barrichello.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thorstone

Maybe Ferrari will ?

Ferrari will be looking forwards, not backwards

Glen · 9 Jun 2005, 08:50 (Ref:1323759)

He didn't move over in Monaco - merely declined to take Schumacher out. I think the situation IS different now - now that there isn't a clear lead in the points race, and especially after that Monaco last lap shennanigans - gloves are off, and (just to repeat myself yett again!) I do not believe the "contracts" make a bit of difference. If Ferrari decide they don't like the driver's attitiude, they'll get rid of him whatever.

Nismo · 9 Jun 2005, 18:40 (Ref:1324185)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glen

He didn't move over in Monaco - merely declined to take Schumacher out. I think the situation IS different now - now that there isn't a clear lead in the points race, and especially after that Monaco last lap shennanigans - gloves are off, and (just to repeat myself yett again!) I do not believe the "contracts" make a bit of difference. If Ferrari decide they don't like the driver's attitiude, they'll get rid of him whatever.

Like they sacked prost prior to the 91 oz gp! apparently he made comments about ferraris management. he was out quick time!

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