Lola T450 and T550

[Dan Rear]

I think the Russell T460 was actually the ex-Mallock T450 F2 car. Used briefly in 76 by Mallock, then dumped for his March 742/75B, which he won at Snetterton G8 in. Russell used the car quite a bit in Libre with an Atlantic engine in 78, then got the ex-South March 782. His cars were always very well prepared, but not very fast...I don't think Russell got the car until '78, he had a converted F3 GRD in 77, so Render couldn't have had it in mid-78, unless he borrowed it from Russell.

Now I think about it, didn't Render also have the ex-works/Marazzi T550 F2 car, that I think Lawler also used, or was entered in once or twice in 78. nb, it seems that no-one else agrees with me on the Lawler T550 matter !!!

How many other T450s were made, I guess some of these may also have been called T460s over time, as the Atlantic car went pretty well, compared to the F2 version.

[Colin Haste]

Dan there were 4 T450s made as I understand it.The change over would have been simple given they are basicly the same car as a 460.

[Chris Townsend]

Lola T450s

1976:
HU1 ATS for Mikka Arpianen
HU2 Mikko Kozarowitzky
HU3 Ardmore Racing: Ray Mallock - pretty well trashed at Mallory early in season and Mallock went back to March 742/75B. Ashley tried to qualify the car at Thruxton F2. Sold July? to Adrian Russell. Used by Russell through 1977 G8 series

[Dan Rear]

Does that leave 1 T450 unaccounted for Chris ? Is it the Roland Binder car, from later 76 then 77, or is this one of the ex-ATS cars ? I'd always assumed it was, purely on geographical grounds. Was the missing one the prototype perhaps...

[Chris Townsend]

Dan

Apologies, missed HU4 off the T450s. This was the Roland Binder car.

How does Kinnane sound for the owner of the ex Trimmer car?

Chris

[Colin Haste]

Lets see if I can collate where we are at with

T450s
HU1 ATS for Mikka Arpianen
HU2 Mikko Kozarowitzky
HU3 Ardmore Racing
HU4 Roland Binder.

[Bryan Miller]

Don't forget the ex Mallock/ David Render car, which someone suggested may be a T450.

[Dan Rear]

Bryan

The Mallock/Russell/Render car was T450 HU3, the ex-Ardmore car. I still seem to think Render maybe had the ex-works T550 Abarth at some point, anyone else ??

[Bryan Miller]

Dan.
Thanks, missed seeing it first time around.
No wonder we all go nuts trying to sort out this stuff, when in period the reporters don't call the cars as they were, just seemed to work on close enough / near enough theory. Render's car called as a T460 in period Autosport.

[Colin Haste]

Chris
Im working on the list, in the meantime some more to think about. I have been in contact with David Dettrickson in the US. He has T450 HU1 Fia F2 then hillclimbed still in original condition I'm told. This would be the ATS car now in the US.

[Chris Townsend]

Colin

The Wentz car you refer to as a one-off drive at Brands.
Do you mean T450-HU1? That was the ex Mikka Arpianen F2 car and Wentz did indeed use it in the Shellsport meeting at Brands on the August Holiday.

[Dan Rear]

Chris

Did Wentz use a T450 in any other F2 races in 76? I've a vague recollection that he may have. I'll check Autocourse later today; their records are good I find (shame no chassis nos.)

[allenbrown]

Originally posted by Dan Rear
Bryan

The Mallock/Russell/Render car was T450 HU3, the ex-Ardmore car. I still seem to think Render maybe had the ex-works T550 Abarth at some point, anyone else ??

I met up Adam Ferrington at Goodwood and he provided me with some notes taken at hillclimb meeting. In 1980, when it's with Render, and in 1984, when it's with Jonathon Skinner, Adam notes the chassis number of the Lola T450 as HU1.

Allen

[driftwood]

Originally Posted by Dan Rear

Bryan

The Mallock/Russell/Render car was T450 HU3, the ex-Ardmore car. I still seem to think Render maybe had the ex-works T550 Abarth at some point, anyone else ??
"I met up Adam Ferrington at Goodwood and he provided me with some notes taken at hillclimb meeting. In 1980, when it's with Render, and in 1984, when it's with Jonathon Skinner, Adam notes the chassis number of the Lola T450 as HU1."

As I have mentioned on the Chevron thread, this is the car that never raced in F2; only sprints and hills, used by Rowan's brother-in-law, Rod, as well as Mr Render.

The Abarth motor was used once in an F2 Lola with Henton at Thruxton, I recall (was this in the 550 model?) and not used again.

[Dan Rear]

driftwood,

the T550 was only used once in F2 you're right, but not with Henton. It had the Abarth engine, and came out at the 77 Silverstone Int Trophy race, the 1st round of the Euro F2 series that year, with Roberto Marazzi. Non-started, and never seen again racing I believe. I do recall Alo Lawler being entered in it in a 78 Aurora race, though whether it was a misprint of his T460 I don't know. I guess at this distance only Alo could tell us the real truth.

On the Henton matter, I think you're confusing the Lola with the Wheatcroft/Pilbeam he was entered in at Thruxton in 76, which had an Abarth motor IIRC. Again this entry didn't come to much, I believe Bob Evans was connected with this as well later that year.

[Chris Townsend]

Dan

Correct on the Henton/Pilbeam. The only outing for the Lola with the Abarth motor was with Roberto Marazzi in practice for the International Trophy meeting.

Regarding T450s.

I don't have a problem with Render's car as HU1. I think the attribution of HU1 to ATS is a dodgy F1R entry. I was at the Brands G8 race where it was meant to have appeared, but it wasn't one of the plates I recorded - being far too shy to venture into such an imposing set up.

As to Render's car being the ex Mallock-Russell car [which we all agree started life as HU3]. There is a possible solution. Mallock bent that car VERY badly early on in the season, in testing. It's feasible that Lola scrapped it and swapped it the test car.

Chris

[Dan Rear]

Chris, on the above, I read in the Mallock book (Paul Lawrence and pretty good), that the prototype T450, or was it the 'T362' from late 75, was badly bent early in 76. The car Ray M then got was a new one, and much worse than the one he'd tested then crashed. So possibly it was a 'new' one, maybe HU-3.

From memory on this thread, have we got 4 T450s, 2 to ATS, one to Ardmore/Ray, one to Binder. The one Wentz used occasionally in both G8 and F2 in 76 was, I've always thought, the ATS car that Mikko K started out in, and had an awful time with. I presumed ATS sent it back to Lola in disgust, and Lolas then tried to improve it with Ted W, who was going well with the T460 in Indylantic at the time.

Maybe I'm quite wrong on ATS having 2, though didn't they intend to enter both Mikko K and Mika Arpianen that year? Possibly there was only ever 1 ATS car, I checked my 76 Autocourse yesterday, there only appears to have been 1 ATS ever entered at a time.

Thoughts ??

[Chris Townsend]

Dan

I agree. ATS only ever entered one car, shared between Kozarowitzky, Arpianen and Wentz.
Roland Binder had one.
Mallock stuffs one and gets it replaced. This might well be HU3 replacing HU1 except it doesn't satisfy the provenance for the Render car as being ex Mallock-Russell. [Which HU1 replacing HU3 does].

[driftwood]

sorry to go back into the tread but re 450 550 cars
i can confirm
T450#1 was raced by adrian russell in uk
the car never raced in F2 events
it was then used by Mr Render on the hills/ sprint series but he enetered it as 460 probably due to the fact that he could not read the plate correctly ( easily done as the plate is stamped a 5 & 6 can look the same at a glance)
he sold the car and did have 550 lola with abarth motor he changed the motor and alan newton ended up with the abarth motor and the holbay spare parts to make another lump
hope this satisfies the record keepers

[Dan Rear]

Originally posted by driftwood
sorry to go back into the tread but re 450 550 cars
i can confirm
T450#1 was raced by adrian russell in uk
the car never raced in F2 events
it was then used by Mr Render on the hills/ sprint series but he enetered it as 460 probably due to the fact that he could not read the plate correctly ( easily done as the plate is stamped a 5 & 6 can look the same at a glance)
he sold the car and did have 550 lola with abarth motor he changed the motor and alan newton ended up with the abarth motor and the holbay spare parts to make another lump
hope this satisfies the record keepers

DW, are you saying T450-HU1 was used by Russell then Render, but that it wasn't the Mallock car ? If so, was HU1 crsahed by Ray M early that year, then replaced by HU3. HU1 then passes, presumably repaired to Russell, HU3 as a new car then onto Mallock, occasionally Ian Ashley.

If this is right, where does Hu3 go after that ??

[driftwood]

car was crashed and had a replacement tub fitted its not a chassis # swap cars 1- 4 are all aaccounted for and we know where they are -234 in europe

[Steve Wilkinson]

According to my records Dave Render's Lolas were as follows:

1) 1978 1.6 Lola-Ford BDA T460 - actually T450-HU1
2) 1979 to 1980 2.0 Lola-Abarth T560
3) 1981 1.6 Lola-Ford BDA T460 (see 1)
4) 1983 1.6 Lola-Ford BDA T460 again plus
2.8 Lola-Hart T560
5) 1984 and 1985 2.8 Lola-Hart T560

Can anyone shed any light on the T560 which looked very much like an F2 car?

[Chris Townsend]

Interesting information on David Render's Lolas

Ad by Render in Autosport 9.9.82 p. 70 lists for sale
Lola T560 chassis 2
Lola T450 chassis 1

Now the 460 confirms observations
I think that Mallock originally had HU3 and was given HU1 to replace it after the Mallory accident, so that the history of this car is indeed Mallock - Russell - Render.

The chassis number for the 560 suggests that there really were two 560s [or that the 550 happened to sit in the planned 560 series as chassis HU2]. This can't be a kit of T460 HU2 as that car was in the USA.

Chris

[Steve Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by Dan Rear

Chris. Do we now assume the T450-1 story goes : works development, Mallock (to replace the Mallory wreck), Russell, Render. If so, and HU3 was rebuilt by the works, then to Europe as DW said, I wonder which mug from the Continent bought it, a climber perhaps ?

Re the 550/560s, I guess they were numbered in 1 sequence only, hence the US Atlantic car was HU1, and the Marazzi F2 car HU2.

Whilst having another trawl through Autosport mags I spotted that at the end of 1981 David Render had two Lolas for sale.

Lola T460-01 with a 1600 BDA and

Lola T560-02 with a 2000 Hart 420R

[driftwood]

swiss still has his car
my man has 5 lola cars 360 460 450 cars and then the mad ozzie has the rest of the production run !!

there is a car for sale in usa @ $30k "rebuilt" engine etc 2 yrs ago
in uk 1600 cars are not wanted when u can run 2 lire f2 car
yes Fa car and f2 cars are usually the same chassis and often same suspension
but 400 cc is another 50 hp on some engines and what wins races?